Dangers of being around wiccans, astrologists, etc

[nablaise]

I have been for a while now in an msn group with atheits, wiccans, and the like.

I try to introduce our faith in a place where people don’t know it or know it terribly wrong. So far it seem that they are starting to get a little respect and fewer insults and a little more understanding of how the Church and our faith works and what they are really about.

But after reading a topic about a person who is struggling about her past life in Wicca and the Crafts, I got a little concerned about what may be happening in the background of the group I am participating in. I have not yet pointed directly to these practice as ‘evil’, but I usually use the Cathechism to indicate more about the one true God. Some times I have a feeling os weekness in faith and self-control in responding to provocations and the like.

My particular concern now, and I have wondered about it before, is: What kind of activities may be happening in the background? from those who practice serious pagan rituals?

I would like to know how much I should pray and all precautions I should take.

Thank you and God bless everyone

 

[uglygal]

Most of them are probably young teenagers or young people who get involved in wicca etc to be cool - that seems to be popular these days, so they are probably putting on a show, talk the talk so to speak. As for anything else, I would say nothing that can harm you whilst you stand under the mantle of God’s Loving Protection. imho

 

[Metaron]

Most of them are probably young teenagers or young people who get involved in wicca etc to be cool - that seems to be popular these days, so they are probably putting on a show, talk the talk so to speak. As for anything else, I would say nothing that can harm you whilst you stand under the mantle of God’s Loving Protection. imho

Why not just pray the St.Michael the Archangel Prayer everytime you go on that forum, if you feel something ‘evil’ is about. I’ve felt the presence of Evil before, and St.Michael hasn’t failed me ever.

 

[nablaise]

Thanks I’ll try to pray more and more,

Actually they are mostly adult mature people, no teens or young adults.

God bless

 

[blacktiger057]

Most of them are probably young teenagers or young people who get involved in wicca etc to be cool - that seems to be popular these days, so they are probably putting on a show, talk the talk so to speak.

Actually, this is a stereotype. I’m sure there are some people who like Wicca “because it’s cool”, but most of us are quite serious about our religion.

 

[blacktiger057]

What kind of activities may be happening in the background? from those who practice serious pagan rituals?

Happening in the background of what? Could you clarify what you mean here?

 

[nablaise]

I wondered if for example those wiccans since they sincerely believe that their beliefs are okay, could be doing some rituals towards members of the group. You know like I may pray for one of an other of them.

Thanks

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Another website I participate at on occasion, there is a woman who is a member of wicca. She is staunchly anti-Catholic and has attempted to spread lies about the Catholic Church. I’ve debated her many times, but she is also very rude and arrogant. Of course, this was used to my advantage as people saw her behavior as being less open, than what she accuses Christians of being.

However, from what I understand, Wicca is more in line with pantheism. I don’t believe they involve themselves in sorcery and would not be in the business of casting spells or such against members of that particular forum.

As Christians, we need not worry about such things anyway, for we have the blood of Jesus Christ to protect us.

The best way to handle them, is to just continue to be truthful and kind. Never never, become rude or angry. This they will use against you.

Jim

 

[Lief_Erikson]

I also doubt that they would try to cast spells against you. Though I’m rather ignorant about the religion, so maybe they would- I don’t know. I just doubt it.

However, we do know from scripture that people involved in magic rather than miracles from God are interacting with demons. The people might not wish you harm, but the spirits they interact with are definitely malevolent and could retaliate against you. The fact that you are Christian does not mean they can’t attack you. Job was faithful to God and look at the kinds of attacks the devil sent at him! Whenever we intrude upon the enemy’s ground, the enemy gets angered. So protect yourself.

I don’t know specific prayers that saints use against evil spirits. I know that when I feel threatened, I always invoke the blood of Christ and pray angelic protection and the infilling of the Holy Spirit. I declare that evil spirits have no right to harm me or my family or my household.

One has to pray for protection when intruding on enemy soil, as you seem to be doing. The enemy might not attack you, but then again, he might. The enemy often retaliates when his soil is intruded upon. So pray for protection frequently in the name of Jesus. He is the authority, so prayer to him will keep you safe.

 

[blacktiger057]

However, we do know from scripture that people involved in magic rather than miracles from God are interacting with demons.

So, if a priest does something otherworldly it’s from God, but if anyone else does it then it’s demonic…sorry, but that’s just a little too convenient.

And you are right when you say that most pagans do not cast spells to harm. But there are always those that do, just like there are Christians that have murdered before. There are bad people in every religion. At least in Wicca, the rule is “to harm none.” So if they were wiccan, then it is against their own religion to harm you.

Also, (I’m speaking from a wiccan perspective here, because pagan is a rather broad term) wiccans don’t work with demons. It’s stupid to even attempt it. I work with the Great Spirit in my rituals, the same one that you worship. No demonic forces.

And remember, they are people, not evil little demons. Most wiccans are pretty open and won’t try to hunt you down for disagreeing with them. Really not much to worry about. But you always have to be careful with the people you talk to online.

 

[byers]

nablaise
Just a warning from experience. Be very, very careful of going on these boards and arguing with these people. You can indeed be attacked spiritually and may not even realize where it is coming from.
It is not just on these pagan, wiccan boards either. Anyone under a delusion, such as those promoting false apparitions, movements, etc can be quite vicious if anyone exposes them or tries to speak the truth. Make sure you are in a state of grace and pray before posting anything controversial or arguing.

 

[Quackers]

I have been for a while now in an msn group with atheits, wiccans, and the like.

I try to introduce our faith in a place where people don’t know it or know it terribly wrong. So far it seem that they are starting to get a little respect and fewer insults and a little more understanding of how the Church and our faith works and what they are really about.

But after reading a topic about a person who is struggling about her past life in Wicca and the Crafts, I got a little concerned about what may be happening in the background of the group I am participating in. I have not yet pointed directly to these practice as ‘evil’, but I usually use the Cathechism to indicate more about the one true God. Some times I have a feeling os weekness in faith and self-control in responding to provocations and the like.

My particular concern now, and I have wondered about it before, is: What kind of activities may be happening in the background? from those who practice serious pagan rituals?

I would like to know how much I should pray and all precautions I should take.

Thank you and God bless everyone

I don’t think you have anything to fear regarding any of these people trying to cast harmful spells against you. To do so actually violates the teachings of Wicca. Wiccans live by the Rede, which states, “An it harm none, do what thou wilt.” Wicca is actually a peaceful religion. The reason I know this is because I was involved in Wicca from the ages of 19-21. For a time, I was actually going to church on Sunday and meeting with my coven for rituals as well. I was initiated into a coven and had the opportunity to meet and get to know Wiccans from all walks of life.

Now having said that, just because the practitioners are peaceful and mean you no harm doesn’t mean there aren’t darker forces at work that the practitioners aren’t aware of. Satan isn’t called the Father of Lies for nothing. He and his demons are quite good at deceiving non-Christians by making them think something harmful is actually something good. If I were you, I would pray to St. Michael before each MSN session. If any demonic forces are trying to get to you, he will protect you. Also, maintaining a courteous and loving attitude during all interactions will speak well for you, and will help shine the light of Christ a little more brightly. Maybe the Holy Spirit will use you to reach someone.

I want to end this by saying that I really don’t think you have anything to worry about, though. You’re a child of God, and I believe He will protect you. Remember I John 4:4,

“You, dear children, are from God and have overcome them, because the one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world.”

I hope what I’ve written here makes sense. I’m not always the best when it comes to expressing myself in writing. God bless you and I’ll say a prayer for you.

 

[nablaise]

Thank you very much everyone! I fell pacified. Yes, I believe I should be always in a state of grace and pray before.

It was also a good point about christians themselves being harmful while they know the commandments. I guess we have to pray always; for ourselves, our christian brethren and our brothers in humanity.

in Christ

Alain

 

[JimR-OCDS]

blacktiger

So, if a priest does something otherworldly it’s from God, but if anyone else does it then it’s demonic…sorry, but that’s just a little too convenient.

Even if a priest does something as you call, “otherworldly,” the Church doesn’t automatically accept it as from heaven.

All such phenomena, must be tested against Scripture and science, which the Church conducts extensively, before declaring anything as from heaven.

In the case of magic, it usually fails the scientific test and there’s no need to go further.

Jim

 

[Lief_Erikson]

So, if a priest does something otherworldly it’s from God, but if anyone else does it then it’s demonic…sorry, but that’s just a little too convenient.

Why? There are so many differing religions out there, and they can’t all be right. They can’t all be right because the major teachings of them disagree strongly with one another. For instance, Christians rely upon Jesus Christ as the Son of God. To Muslims, he is only a prophet. To Jews, he was a false prophet. Jesus Christ is the centerpoint of our faith, and we believe that no one can receive intimacy with God except through him. Muslims believe no one can receive intimacy with God except through Islam (or Christianity or Judaism, to a lesser extent). Buddhists believe that if you die without having received enlightenment, you’ll be reincarnated to try again. Religions have immense differences between them. This intense discord about how one can come to heaven (and often these religions say that those that don’t follow this religion will go to hell) indicates all on its own that there are spirits leading people astray. Especially in view of the fact that most religions and cults begin with mystical experiences.

One might argue that people are misunderstanding the Great Spirit. However, often people write down just what is dictated to them, or what is said to them. If they are supposed to interpret it differently than they do, then the fault is with the spirit that didn’t make himself clearly understood. If it is impossible for him to make himself clearly understood because of our inherent weakness, then he’s useless to us, and everyone should decide for him or herself what to believe. Which means no religion is right. Which means that our assumption that we were hearing from God in the first place was wrong. We’re back to square 1.

I don’t believe in a useless God who can’t make himself understood, and so leaves everything spiritual and important to intensely fallible humans to figure out for themselves. Humans will blunder from error to error- it is extremely cruel to leave how they live their lives and how they come to the afterlife to humans to try (and fail) to figure out. Therefore, for God to be good, he must be capable of making himself understood.

The fact that all of this discord about truth and religion exists and is rooted in spiritual experiences means not that spirits are leading multitudes of people astray, but that religious beliefs are important enough to be worth deceiving people about.

People also get led astray in pacifistic religions. For instance, Buddhism does not demand physical violence. Christianity generally refrains from physical violence. Yet the two religions differ about how to attain spiritual life, and even about what spiritual life consists of. Thus we can see that deceiving spirits have tweaked one of the two accounts- and they only do that if they have a reason.

If spirits are trying to deceive people about the truth regarding how to gain a good afterlife and how to live their lives, then there is some true religion that they are trying to hide. Otherwise they wouldn’t even bother with interfering. And it can only be one true religion that they’re trying to hide, because all religions contain significant differences from one another. Thus one of the religions out there must be true and the others deceptive and in various ways destructive.

Is it any wonder, then, that I believe my religion to be true and the others to involve evil spirits? The people that convert from those religions to Christianity often describe having had to struggle with evil spirits to do so, also.

For us, Christianity goes beyond beliefs that create actions, for Christ actually has the power to transform people’s lives and make them perfect. The proof of this is that he rose from the dead. Eleven disciples claimed to see him rise from the dead, eat and drink with them, teach them and hang out with them for 40 days, and then they claimed to see him rise into heaven. They were willing to die for the truth of what they said they saw, and although people die for lies, they don’t die for them if they know that they’re lies. That at least ten disciples died for what they said they saw with their own eyes about Jesus proves that Jesus rose from the dead. The personal experiences of some of those that have lost sin and come to live saintly lives by worshipping Jesus and relying on his sacrifice and resurrection also proves the literal accuracy of Jesus’ and the disciples’ claims.

 

[Lief_Erikson]

Black Tiger, continuing from my post to you on the other page (please read that one first) . . .

Christ abolishes sin so that there is no more evil or flaw at all. That is the only true way paradise can be achieved and people can be worthy of eternal life. If any sin is left in them, then in any afterlife they will continue to make mistakes and do bad things. That is only natural, for it is part of who those people are.

Only if they have no more sin in them at all can the afterlife be secure for everyone. If even the smallest degree of sin is left, it is a seed that can grow, and it also constitutes rebellion from God since he has the power to remove it, but we want to keep it.

Loads of people have historically claimed to be messengers of God and to receive experiences from him, yet their actions often turned into horrors. For instance, Muhammad claimed to be a Prophet and he gave many teachings that were indeed peaceful, yet he also instructed his followers to conquer infidels. They followed his commands and invaded numerous nations all around them that had done nothing to them. They conquered the Sassanid and Byzantine Empires. They assaulted Europe. They conquered India in a war in which they killed about 80 million people. So you know that one can receive spiritual experiences, think they are from God and are good and holy, and yet they will result in evil.

Aztecs believed that they were guided by gods, and they worshipped those gods with human sacrifices and conquering civilizations.

Even in cases where following spirits is not so obviously harmful, harm must exist in following an (apparently good) evil spirit, for if it didn’t, why would the spirit take the trouble to create a deception? If a spirit appears to be doing good and to mean good, if it teaches that you do no harm, are its intentions genuinely peaceful and kind? How do you know? You can’t get inside its brain, and you don’t know the final consequences of all of its actions.

If spirits (or the Great Spirit) are leading people to deny the divinity of Jesus Christ and his shedding his blood on the cross for our sins, and are leading them to deny his literal resurrection from the dead, then in my view, they are already doing horrendous damage to people. That life from Christ’s resurrection brings us all that is good and transforms us to make us more good, and it promises perfection and eternal life in Jesus, God. Without that experience of intimacy with God, we are still sinful and unworthy of paradise.

And you are right when you say that most pagans do not cast spells to harm. But there are always those that do, just like there are Christians that have murdered before. There are bad people in every religion. At least in Wicca, the rule is “to harm none.” So if they were wiccan, then it is against their own religion to harm you.

Good. I still feel that those are deceiving spirits you are working with, though, so even if the wiccan means no harm, the spirit involved with the wiccan might be intensely malevolent. It might take action all on its own and attack a Christian that is trying to present the truth, because the Christian is interfering with its deception.

Also, (I’m speaking from a wiccan perspective here, because pagan is a rather broad term) wiccans don’t work with demons. It’s stupid to even attempt it. I work with the Great Spirit in my rituals, the same one that you worship. No demonic forces.

Right, but demons make themselves appear good, just like most wicked people try to do. Otherwise they wouldn’t get anywhere in spreading their beliefs and power.

I’ve been deluded by evil spirits before, myself, though by God’s grace I got out of it, so I know from firsthand experience how they can make themselves seem good in order to ruin people’s lives.

And remember, they are people, not evil little demons. Most wiccans are pretty open and won’t try to hunt you down for disagreeing with them.

I definitely agree with you about that.

 

[PaperMoon]

I wondered if for example those wiccans since they sincerely believe that their beliefs are okay, could be doing some rituals towards members of the group. You know like I may pray for one of an other of them.

Thanks

That’s one of the reasons why I would not even go to those boards, there are evil spirits associated with those boards and you could be opening yourself up to some stuff.

 

[PaperMoon]

I also doubt that they would try to cast spells against you. Though I’m rather ignorant about the religion, so maybe they would- I don’t know. I just doubt it.

However, we do know from scripture that people involved in magic rather than miracles from God are interacting with demons. The people might not wish you harm, but the spirits they interact with are definitely malevolent and could retaliate against you. The fact that you are Christian does not mean they can’t attack you. Job was faithful to God and look at the kinds of attacks the devil sent at him! Whenever we intrude upon the enemy’s ground, the enemy gets angered. So protect yourself.

I don’t know specific prayers that saints use against evil spirits. I know that when I feel threatened, I always invoke the blood of Christ and pray angelic protection and the infilling of the Holy Spirit. I declare that evil spirits have no right to harm me or my family or my household.

One has to pray for protection when intruding on enemy soil, as you seem to be doing. The enemy might not attack you, but then again, he might. The enemy often retaliates when his soil is intruded upon. So pray for protection frequently in the name of Jesus. He is the authority, so prayer to him will keep you safe.

Exactly! Well said!

 

[PaperMoon]

I also doubt that they would try to cast spells against you. Though I’m rather ignorant about the religion, so maybe they would- I don’t know. I just doubt it.

However, we do know from scripture that people involved in magic rather than miracles from God are interacting with demons. The people might not wish you harm, but the spirits they interact with are definitely malevolent and could retaliate against you. The fact that you are Christian does not mean they can’t attack you. Job was faithful to God and look at the kinds of attacks the devil sent at him! Whenever we intrude upon the enemy’s ground, the enemy gets angered. So protect yourself.

I don’t know specific prayers that saints use against evil spirits. I know that when I feel threatened, I always invoke the blood of Christ and pray angelic protection and the infilling of the Holy Spirit. I declare that evil spirits have no right to harm me or my family or my household.

One has to pray for protection when intruding on enemy soil, as you seem to be doing. The enemy might not attack you, but then again, he might. The enemy often retaliates when his soil is intruded upon. So pray for protection frequently in the name of Jesus. He is the authority, so prayer to him will keep you safe.

And also those spirits there may wait for a weak moment to attack, so you may feel strong and protected while there but the effects of being there interacting with those evil spirits might build up and surface as soon as a trial comes your way or something comes your way to upset you etc. or when/if tragedy hits. Then when you are vulnerable the effects of having been there may surface to try to get a person when they are down. So just be very careful and sure that that’s what you feel is okay for you to do as far as going there to minister. What you may think is not affecting your spirit might be there in hiding and building up for the “right moment” to attack then you won’t know what hit you or why. Even the strongest person has their weak moments.

 

[PaperMoon]

So, if a priest does something otherworldly it’s from God, but if anyone else does it then it’s demonic…sorry, but that’s just a little too convenient.

And you are right when you say that most pagans do not cast spells to harm. But there are always those that do, just like there are Christians that have murdered before. There are bad people in every religion. At least in Wicca, the rule is “to harm none.” So if they were wiccan, then it is against their own religion to harm you.

Also, (I’m speaking from a wiccan perspective here, because pagan is a rather broad term) wiccans don’t work with demons. It’s stupid to even attempt it. I work with the Great Spirit in my rituals, the same one that you worship. No demonic forces.

And remember, they are people, not evil little demons. Most wiccans are pretty open and won’t try to hunt you down for disagreeing with them. Really not much to worry about. But you always have to be careful with the people you talk to online.

Well any spirit that’s not the God of the Bible is demonic so that “great spirit” you work with for is demonic and NOT the God o f the Bible.