Darwin and the case for 'militant atheism'

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Just for the record, I’m a Catholic born and bred… as a child, I played as much with Dinosaurs as the happy heathen next door (nasty little fella that he was)

My skepticism regarding evolutionism (or any other great scientismic ‘truth’) is wholly born of my having an ever increasing skepticism proportionately towards the ever inflating proclamation of conclusive knowledge by Mainstream science, which, upon investigation, always fails to have the kind of justifiable foundation we’re all vigorously taught to believe in, equalled in dogmatisms only by those of, say, full-on evangelicals, or perhaps, other religions (perhaps including our own) in other dark ages.

And based in the same kind of intolerant, dogmatic, superstitious self-righteousness. Except perhaps more so… :rolleyes:
 
TheAtheist said:
Just want to point out something. Fighting off the occasional “sieges” from Biblical literalists, I got rather curious about what those of the Jewish faith interacted with Genesis.

It was to my utter shock and surprise, that if i understand both the archaeological and historical evidence correctly, the “2nd Temple” version of Judaism never actually took the story of Genesis to be literally true. In fact, one could say it wasn’t that important at all - merely a story to symbolically illustrate the power of their God.

I want to clarify this statement utterly though. This isn’t saying there was a disingenious belief in their God. By all means no, the devotional aspect was quite strong. It is saying however that Genesis was not utilized in the manner it is today by some religious folk.

To which i must credit the intelligence of the folks living in 516 BCE. 😉
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True, but then this can so easily end up with the same kind of position of, say, the historic Sadduccees, or modern Zen Buddhism. It’s all very reasonable,but so is… more than I think either you or St. Anastasia can bring yourselves to consider.
 
StAnastasia said:
Accusations of “heresy” have no meaning for me. I never expected the Spanish Inquisition.
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No Inquisition? Well…Oh…OK…I’ll wheel my rack back into the garage :D.
Just trying to lighten things up.😉
 
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Siddhartha:
Hi, Siddhartha -

Gee, it didn’t quote your text.
Well, I’m not here to argue, anyway.

My computer has no speakers, and somethings about with the video card, because video clips play soooo ssslloooooow. So, can’t watch your TED making speech video.

Just always wanted to say “Hi” to an evangelical evolutionist 👋
 
donsnow said:
No Inquisition? Well…Oh…OK…I’ll wheel my rack back into the garage :D.
Just trying to lighten things up.😉
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Donsnow, thanks for the lightening! My fourteen-year-old was supposed to build a machine implementing two of the six simple machines. He built a magnificent siege engine (lever and wheel); now I realize he could have build a Catholic rack a la Spanish Inquisition! That would have incorporated the pulley, including plane, and lever

StAnastasia
 
StAnastasia said:
Donsnow, thanks for the lightening! My fourteen-year-old was supposed to build a machine implementing two of the six simple machines. He built a magnificent siege engine (lever and wheel); now I realize he could have build a Catholic rack a la Spanish Inquisition! That would have incorporated the pulley, including plane, and lever

StAnastasia
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You’re welcome :).

My little military mind likes the siege engine, better than the rack :p.
 
Praise Darwin. Evolve beyond belief.

Evolve beyond belief? Can we tell our genes what to do? It was our genes, not us, that chose to make our brains better. In the past, poor, unintelligent humans thought the thunder came from the gods, who were obviously angry at them. But thanks to our always evolving and naturally selected genes, we got smarter, so we don’t need god/gods/spirituality anymore. Isn’t random mutation and natural selection wonderful?

Apparently, those who believe in no gods/god/superstition will not be subject to those things they perceive are wrong with religious people. They won’t harm anyone or cheat anyone or steal from anyone. They won’t threaten anyone with total destruction, like the former USSR.

Peace,
Ed
 
G01 said:
No it isn’t. There were definitely volcanoes and bad weather before humans existed. We know this. And it is not against Catholic teaching to hold this view.
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And at least one big asteroid, at the K-T boundary, -65GA.
 
TheAtheist said:
Just want to point out something. Fighting off the occasional “sieges” from Biblical literalists, I got rather curious about what those of the Jewish faith interacted with Genesis.

It was to my utter shock and surprise, that if i understand both the archaeological and historical evidence correctly, the “2nd Temple” version of Judaism never actually took the story of Genesis to be literally true. In fact, one could say it wasn’t that important at all - merely a story to symbolically illustrate the power of their God.

I want to clarify this statement utterly though. This isn’t saying there was a disingenious belief in their God. By all means no, the devotional aspect was quite strong. It is saying however that Genesis was not utilized in the manner it is today by some religious folk.

To which i must credit the intelligence of the folks living in 516 BCE. 😉
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Well, it depends on what you mean by “liberal” reading. A person of the times would have taken it to mean pretty much what a Jew would , without necessarily subscribing to its truth. No way we can erase from our minds what we believe and see the world as they did. Even apart from religion, our common sense and their common sense are very different.
 
StAnastasia said:
Accusations of “heresy” have no meaning for me. I never expected the Spanish Inquisition.
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NOBODY expects the Spanish Inquisition! Our chief weapon is surprise…surprise and fear…fear and surprise… Our two weapons are fear and surprise…and ruthless efficiency… Our three weapons are fear, surprise, and ruthless efficiency…and an almost fanatical devotion to the Pope… Our four…no… Amongst our weapons… Amongst our weaponry…are such elements as fear, surprise… I’ll come in again.😉

Just in case you are all too young to get the joke: youtube.com/watch?v=gldlyTjXk9A
 
4elise said:
"]NOBODY expects the Spanish Inquisition! Our chief weapon is surprise…surprise and fear…fear and surprise… Our two weapons are fear and surprise…and ruthless efficiency… Our three weapons are fear, surprise, and ruthless efficiency…and an almost fanatical devotion to the Pope… Our four…no… Amongst our weapons… Amongst our weaponry…are such elements as fear, surprise… I’ll come in again.]

4elise, I was weaned on Monty Python! I find humour an excellent way to defuse young earth creationist nonsense. One of the hobbies of people on Catholic Answers is threatening those who don’t agree with them with the fear of heresy, excommunication, hellfire and brimstone, and other imagined torments. Perhaps it is a legacy of the Inquisition that this fear of punishment has worked its way so deeply into the Catholic psyche.

StAnastasia
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StAnastasia said:
And at least one big asteroid, at the K-T boundary, -65GA.
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A lot more than one. Glenn Morton has a list of the ones that we know about.

It is a major problem for YEC Flood Geology. If most of geology happened in a year then Noah was getting about two tsunamis a week as all those meteorites hit.

rossum
 
StAnastasia said:
4elise, I was weaned on Monty Python! I find humour an excellent way to defuse young earth creationist nonsense. One of the hobbies of people on Catholic Answers is threatening those who don’t agree with them with the fear of heresy, excommunication, hellfire and brimstone, and other imagined torments. Perhaps it is a legacy of the Inquisition that this fear of punishment has worked its way so deeply into the Catholic psyche.

StAnastasia
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In the name of modernism, and the praise of men, anti-theists demand we bow down before the new priesthood, the new clerisy, scientists. They are the way and the truth, they will guide us, they will entertain us, and maybe come up with a few new snack foods. It is the new circumcision, the requirement to be considered a follower of the new truth, revealed not by God but by the mind of man.

They cry out for only one thing: Freedom from God. So they write blasphemies, tear pages out of the Bible, and even cover it in batter and deep fry it. They claim rationality but usually offer only emotion and a deep desire to rid themselves of guilt and judgement and sin. Modesty no longer exists for them.

“You praise me with your lips but your heart is far from me.”

Peace,
Ed
 
StAnastasia said:
4elise, I was weaned on Monty Python! I find humour an excellent way to defuse young earth creationist nonsense. One of the hobbies of people on Catholic Answers is threatening those who don’t agree with them with the fear of heresy, excommunication, hellfire and brimstone, and other imagined torments. Perhaps it is a legacy of the Inquisition that this fear of punishment has worked its way so deeply into the Catholic psyche.

StAnastasia
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Seems that I remember hearing this was said by Someone we should listen to… ***“Be not afraid” … *** Blessings! 😉
 
4elise said:
Seems that I remember hearing this was said by Someone we should listen to… ***“Be not afraid” … *** Blessings! 😉
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It’s always interesting to see how a persecuted sect – when it becomes the dominant religion in a polity – becomes persecutor in its own turn.
 
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