Darwin's Theory of Evolution is not scientific

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It was first observed recently and not in the wild but in German aquariums. It is a new species, or do you have a fossil Marbles Crayfish from the Precambrian? Crustaceans fossilise very well because they have hard shells.
That a different kind of crayfish is discovered means only that it is new in the sense that one has not been discovered before. It is illogical to infer that its progenitors were any different than themselves. More evidence is required.
 
Slavery, when the OT if that Darwin’s Theory of Evolution is not scientific !
What’s pretty funny here is that, when @Buffalo brought up the subject of “old paradigms”, @rossum replied “irrelevant!”. You, then, look at his reply and exclaim “irrelevant reply!” 🤣
 
Forgive me for saying so, OP, but you seem to be saying that archaeology and forensics and all things historical are outside of the realm of science.

This is not true. For instance, radiometric dating is only believed because it gives the same ages (within what becomes the margin of error) for things that come from the same era and gives accurate ages for things whose age is known by other means.

OK, so…the theory of evolution has actually found two fossils of different ages, postulated the older belongs to a group that could be an ancestor of the other, and predicts an intermediate form belonging to an intermediate age. For instance, evolutionary theory said there ought to have been a creature between dinosaurs and birds. Later, such a creature was found (Archaeopteryx).

Now, you might quarrel with whether or not that is actually such evidence, but please let us not have any arguments that it is impossible for such evidence to exist. It is not.

There is an objection to evolution that says there is no known mechanism by which one population with one number of chromosomes gives rise to a second population with a different number of chromosomes. This is a serious question, because of course mutations that change the number of chromosomes in the genome typically render the mutated individual unable to reproduce. The problem is that it is impossible to improve a negative. It is reasonable to say “what would be the mechanism?” but you can’t say “we don’t know the mechanism, therefore X is impossible.” That violates the rules of logical proof.

What we must not say is that a field of investigation that still has open questions is not science at all. That is totally wrong. There are a lot of observations that might have an explanation different than Darwin’s, but the problem is that so far people just shoot down Darwin without coming up with an alternative hypothesis that does a better job of explaining what is known.

Those who don’t want to believe that Darwin’s theories can have a shred of truth to them have to ask why they’re so invested in this theory being wrong. This is the state of the question–that is why they teach it in school. No one has a better explanation. Yes, we might come up with a better one, but it’s just as likely that we’ll come up with a better understanding of gravity (which is also still kind of a black box phenomenon.)

The Vatican does not see an inherent conflict between the mechanism being as Darwin proposed and what faith reveals about the origin of creation. Why do you?
 
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Forgive me for saying so, OP, but you seem to be saying that archaeology and forensics and all things historical are outside of the realm of science.
They would be historical science, not empirical science.
 
To PetraG,

First, a reference to what is taught in schools. Next, an appeal to religious authority. Why is evolution so important? This has been discussed in a number of threads going back years. There is no guide book regarding how a virus might mutate (a built-in ability) or how bacteria will modify themselves when exposed to a harmful substance (another built-in ability - Horizontal Gene Transfer). The same lack of a guide book makes drug discovery very expensive.

No one is aided by accepting the theory but they are not part of the list. The ‘full compliance’ list. All I see here is a desire to get full compliance. Evolution has no practical scientific use today. Would Biologists do anything differently if they thought evolution was false? Of course not. In a race to determine what the myriad parts of a living cell do, they are using a tear it apart approach, including genetic knock-out experiments, to speed things up. Perhaps if I had a billion dollars, I get could get the best and brightest to work on a cure to whatever ails me. What they have is an interdisciplinary approach called bioinformatics - bioinformatics combines biology, computer science, mathematics and statistics to analyze and interpret biological data.

As far as the origin of man, science is missing important pieces of information. The Church has that information and does integrate that information correctly. Criticism of this theory is warranted.
 
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The Vatican does not see an inherent conflict between the mechanism being as Darwin proposed and what faith reveals about the origin of creation. Why do you?
Because it is philosophy and no empirical proof exists.
 
And was overturned recently.
Being incorrect did not make the postulate unscientific. That is my point.

If we only taught what was known thoroughly and with certainty, then (a) we wouldn’t have much to teach and (b) we wouldn’t be training anybody to think like a scientist.
 
Because it is philosophy and no empirical proof exists.
No, it is a hypothesis that explains a very large body of evidence and no alternative has been proposed.
“A miracle occurred” is not an alternative. That is the diagnosis of exclusion, not a scientific theory.
To PetraG,

First, a reference to what is taught in schools. Next, an appeal to religious authority. Why is evolution so important? This has been discussed in a number of threads going back years. There is no guide book regarding how a virus might mutate (a built-in ability) or how bacteria will modify themselves when exposed to a harmful substance (another built-in ability - Horizontal Gene Transfer). The same lack of a guide book makes drug discovery very expensive.

No one is aided by accepting the theory but they are not part of the list. The ‘full compliance’ list. All I see here is a desire to get full compliance. Evolution has no practical scientific use today. Would Biologists do anything differently if they thought evolution was false? Of course not. In a race to determine what the myriad parts of a living cell do, they are using a tear it apart approach, including genetic knock-out experiments, to speed things up. Perhaps if I had a billion dollars, I get could get the best and brightest to work on a cure to whatever ails me. What they have is an interdisciplinary approach called bioinformatics - bioinformatics combines biology, computer science, mathematics and statistics to analyze and interpret biological data.

As far as the origin of man, science is missing important pieces of information. The Church has that information and does integrate that information correctly. Criticism of this theory is warranted.
I love it when people say “there is no guidebook” and then turn around and object that basic research is pointless. The most important advances in applied research come from the unexpected things discovered by basic “what is this ever going to be good for?” research.
Why is evolution so important? … Evolution has no practical scientific use today… As far as the origin of man, science is missing important pieces of information.
Well, they’re never going to find those pieces if it is pointless to even look!!
“Move away, move away, nothing to see here…”

If there were some discovery that proved Darwin was wrong, it would mean that an alternative proposal for the physical mechanism by which the different species arose has been discovered or demonstrated. Are you kidding? What if the way to make a new species was found, one that didn’t require waiting around for some rare-as-hen’s-teeth mechanism for the genesis of an entirely new species of animal or plant? There would be an utter explosion of research in that area! There would be congresses convened to consider the bio-ethical implications of using the information to generate new species.
 
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I never wrote “basic research is pointless.” I follow advances in basic research almost daily. That kind of research has a practical value. Evolution? I think people will be just fine without it. It will not guide basic research on things alive today.

I could offer you a pine tree that’s gone missing for 150 million years. I wonder how it survived considering the various things that can happen in 150 million years.
 
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o_mlly:
Do not paraphrase too much the language used in science papers to elevate what is offered as provisional to be fact, especially when peers report skepticism of even the provisional claim.
Look at just about any pro-evo paper. This is the language you will see:

It is thought
Perhaps
Might be
Could be
Could have
Might have
etc
and on and on…
Yep…just like a Horoscope.
 
Being incorrect did not make the postulate unscientific. That is my point.

If we only taught what was known thoroughly and with certainty, then (a) we wouldn’t have much to teach and (b) we wouldn’t be training anybody to think like a scientist.
The empirical findings that are observable, repeatable and predictable are the one’s that count.
 
I have listed two long term frauds which evolutionists taught for up to 120 years knowing them to frauds; that WAS NOT SCIENTIFIC…
That’s all? Just two? That is hardly enough to condemn the theory, which does not rest on those frauds.
I follow the Church’s interpretation.
And then some…
No, it is because there is no empirical evidence.
Empirical evidence has been presented in this very thread at least 200 times, and in none of those times did you engage in a convincing refutation.
It was I who introduced the constant speed of light as yet another error of science…
What you introduced is the normal process of science refining its theories. What are you hoping to do? Throw doubt on all of science just because the field advances a little? So in order to prove that the Theory of Evolution is not scientific, you only solution is to prove that nothing is scientific!
You make my point. Darwin’s science is limited to observing variation. Why would would have to make a 5 year voyage to the Galapagos islands to observe what is apparent in one’s own family?..
To gather confirming evidence in other, simpler settings. The advantage of the Galapoagos Islands is that it proved isolation that made evolution easier to observe and analyze.
 
I never wrote “basic research is pointless.” I follow advances in basic research almost daily. That kind of research has a practical value. Evolution? I think people will be just fine without it. It will not guide basic research on things alive today.

I could offer you a pine tree that’s gone missing for 150 million years. I wonder how it survived considering the various things that can happen in 150 million years.
The thing is that you aren’t the arbiter of questions that ought to interest other people.

If someone finds sea creatures in an area that is a long way from an ocean or finds an unknown species of pine somewhere that has been too cold for that kind of forest for a very long time, that’s pretty interesting. One might ask, for instance: if the temperatures keep rising (never mind why they are rising we do not need to go there, too), what sorts of plants might be growing where? What might die out? What might flourish? Could we possibly need this information to make agricultural adjustments that will prevent mass famines and societal upheaval?

We are seeing an era of rather rapid change. Maybe it won’t last. Maybe the change will keep getting faster, though. Who knows what information might be relevant a lot sooner than any of us think it will?
The empirical findings that are observable, repeatable and predictable are the one’s that count.
That relegates a lot of what Einstein did to a bin other than the “ones that count.”
 
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That’s all? Just two? That is hardly enough to condemn the theory, which does not rest on those frauds.
That would be like investigating one or two claims of a miraculous cure, finding them to be fraudulent, and concluding that all claims of miraculous cures are therefore fraudulent. It is not logical.

I’m getting to the point where I think it is pointless to have a conversation about science on this forum. I don’t know why, but this place attracts a lot of Catholics who are hostile to science.
 
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“hostile to science”? Not me. Evolution, on the other hand, is the topic.
 
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
Absence of evidence is indicative, and science is happy to use it until evidence does turn up. At that point science will adjust to incorporate the newly found evidence.

For a long time science thought that coelacanths were extinct. When live coelacanths were found, science adjusted. Science knows that it only has imperfect knowledge, so it has the processes to incorporate new knowledge as it is discovered.

Until such time Precambrian horse fossils are found, science will work on the basis that there were no horses, or other vertebrates, in the Precambrian. When you unearth contrary evidence, let your nearest scientist know.

rossum
 
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And was overturned recently.
No it was not. Do you have a reference to a scientific paper showing that. You need to understand the biological definition of “transitional”. Specifically, time is not of any great importance. Finding a bird dated before Archaeopteryx does not invalidate Archaeopteryx as a transitional. A transitional is defined in terms of sharing characteristics of the earlier clade and the later clade. Archaeopteryx shares traits so it is a transitional.

Abraham Lincoln was earlier than modern Europeans. That does not invalidate many Americans being descended from Europeans.

rossum
 
More news.

Well established theories on patterns in evolution might be wrong​

 
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