Darwin's Theory of Evolution is not scientific

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Uriel1:
There is no intermediate fossil record jut a load of missing links.
There is a load of found links that form exactly that fossil record you refer to.
So let’s look at the squid, octopus and nautilus. Nautilus is unusual in having an eye like ours, but with no lens. By what possible genetic mutation do you think a lens would a lens be able to develop in nautilus’ eye? There has been none postulated @Rossum, none at all. Why do you think that is my friend?
Whoever told you that none had been postulated was lying to you. Snails’ eyes (the ones on stalks) are similar to a Nautilus, but instead of being filled with seawater (as with the Nautilus) they are filled with transparent jelly. All evolution has to do is to tweak the consistency of the outer part of the jelly and it is a proto-lens. Snails are molluscs, as are cephalopods.
It’s because “Evolutionists” abuse micro-evolutionary theory and pretend it makes their case. Just try to explain Nautilus and let’s enjoy what you can’t explain
It’s because “Creationists” abuse evolutionary theory and pretend it makes their case. Their pretence of the failure to explain Nautilus lets everyone else see that all they have in their support is misrepresentation.

rossum
And sticking to the facts we can read
What genes tell us about pinhole- and camera-eye evolution in cephalopods
May 28, 2014 by LS
Nolan Lassiter (Pitzer College) and Ryan Madden (Pitzer College) [Edited by Lars Schmitz, as part of BIOL 167 “Sensory Evolution”, an upper division class at the W.M. Keck Science Department. Written for educational purposes only].

for illustrations see: What genes tell us about pinhole- and camera-eye evolution in cephalopods | Sensory Evolution

to be continued
 
The Nautilus is the only cephalopod that does not have a lens-bearing camera-type eye (Figure 1). It is, however, still a predator that forages and feeds on smaller organisms in the sand/dirt in the bottom of the ocean. It utilizes a pinhole eye (Figure 2) that doesn’t protect the retina from the water of its environment and lacks a refracting apparatus, and as a result is not considered to have strong vision. While it is able to differentiate basic objects, the Nautilus does not have as strong of eyesight as its cousin’s, the squids, which have lens-bearing camera-like eyes (Figure 3). How did the eyes of cephalopods evolve?

To explore the genetic control of development of pinhole and camera-type eye in cephalopods, Sousounis et al. (2013) utilized next-generation RNA sequencing, targeting Nautilus and the Pygmy squid. RNA sequencing has revolutionized the exploration of gene analysis and its application in the study of evolution, by allowing researchers to examine phylogenetic relationships at a molecular level. Previous research had demonstrated that there are several common genes related to lens and photoreceptor development found in both Drosophila and human genomes (Halder et al. 1995) that potentially could also be similar to those found in molluscs. Essentially, by identifying genes responsible for eye development one can reconstruct the complex evolutionary path to vertebrate and invertebrate eyes.

Sousounis et al. examined the RNA transcriptomes that were “marked” in developing Nautilus and Pygmy squid eyes. Then the contigs, or overlaps between sliced RNA fragments of various length, were compared to examine what genes are responsible for developing the Nautilus pinhole-type eye as opposed to a camera-type eye in squid. Basically, the researchers were able to enrich the RNA and examine exactly what sections of the genome specifically guide the sequencing and assembly of the eye. This examination also allowed for comparison of the contigs to that of Drosophila and human eyes. There were many interesting findings in the study that led to a more directed hypothesis and remained in line with previous discoveries regarding the differences in vertebrate and invertebrate photoreceptors (Fernald, 2006).

Genes involved in nucleic-acid binding proteins were overexpressed in squid and not Nautilus. Genes involved in metabolic and catalytic function were overexpressed in Nautilus early eye development (Figure 4). Sousounis et al. think that this is a consequence of the faster and more complex morphogenesis of the squid eye

to be continued
 
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Many genes that are used in assembling the cephalopod eyes are similar to human homologues, whereas genes that are part of photoreceptor assembly show a mix of similarities to both humans and flies. Interestingly, the Sousounis team observed a lot of crossover in the genes involved in eye development between all four species, suggesting that eye morphology is largely conserved in beginning stages of development, but then has a few very important genes that help in differentiation and ultimately give rise to the diversity of eye types we have today.
The Sousounis team may also have identified a gene that is centrally important for developing the lens (Figure 5 shows their general approach to this problem). Pygmy squid have CAP1 gene while the Nautilus expresses a slightly different version, called capt. Capt has been found to be involved in morphogenesis in Drosophila, an organism with a compound eye (but not with a single, big lens like in vertebrates and squid). One hypothesis is that the presence and absence of capt and CAP1 might help determining if the eye will have a lens or not. Another gene that may potentially be involved in lens formation is NF1/Nf1, which shows similarities to both human and fly genes.

For future investigations, it would be very interesting to utilize either gene add-in or gene knockout methodology to further explore gene functions in the morphogenesis of eyes. For example, one could inhibit or alter the function of the NF1/Nf1 gene, thought to be involved in lens development. Through this analysis the development and exact role of the NF1/Nf1 gene could be further understood. For more insight into early lens development the same approach could be used but instead inhibit the CAP1 gene. Sousounis et al. provide an important piece to the puzzle of eye evolution, but many more pieces remain to be discovered.
 
I suggest you look up what it means, as it is certainly not a bully point
In a previous post I asked you to explain your understanding of it. Please do.

By “scoring bully points” I mean you appear to be using the Bible to put other people down. If you are not, please explain.

I can read the Bible, and I can read biblical commentary, but I can’t read your mind and know what your intention is. So please justify your frequent use (or abuse) of that passage.
 
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Many genes that are used in assembling the cephalopod eyes are similar to human homologues, whereas genes that are part of photoreceptor assembly show a mix of similarities to both humans and flies.
Thank you for posting that. It is part of the evidence for common ancestry. The LCA of humans, cephalopods and files – probably some sort of bilateran – had photoreceptors, but had not yet really developed eyes.

Eye development came later, with arthopods going for compound eyes, while cephalopods and vertebrates went for camera eyes.

In all cases the physics of light constrained development of a working eye, so there are examples of convergent evolution present.

rossum
 
Is it common sense that the speed of light is the only constant in space-time, resulting in the fact that to a photon travelling billions of light years to hit the retina the entire trajectory happens instantaneously, although to the the person attached to the retina it took billions of years?
I know this was only an aside to use as an intro to what you really wanted to say about genomes and reproduction, but I think the misunderstanding about science that your aside represents is critical to clear up before trying to tackle evolution.

You ask skeptically if it is common sense that the speed of light being a constant causes a photon to experience a trip of billions of light years as if it were only an instant, while to us it looks like it took billions of years. Well, your premise, that a photon could even have a perception of time, is nonsense. So whatever “common sense” you are appealing to, it does not challenge the facts of Einsteinian Special Relativity, to which you appear to be referring. I suppose what you are really challenging is the much more reasonable conclusion that an object travelling very fast experiences time passing more slowly than objects at rest. Even that scenario requires some qualification and restatement before it can even be considered.

What do we mean by an object experiencing the passing of time? Well, we have lots of ways. Many of them have been built into objects we call clocks. There are candles that burn down, grains of sand falling through a narrow tube of glass, swinging pendulums, oscillating crystals of quartz. All of these “clocks” measure the passage of time. A person aging can also be considered a clock, but probably less accurately than a candle burning down, since people age differently. So for simplicity, let’s stick to inanimate objects. Since your original scenario involved an inanimate photon, that should be no problem.

Next we have your description of a one-way trip taken by the photon. Without some universal sense of “now,” there is no way start a one-way trip taken by a clock and measure, independently of the clock itself, how long its trip took. So if we want to compare a moving clock to a stationary clock, the moving clock has to make a round-trip.

So now we have the following experiment. One clock is stationary and the other clock goes very fast on a round-trip. The clocks start out synchronized. So the nearest actual testable scenario to the one you described is have two clocks and comparing them after one of them goes very fast and comes back to where it started. Your “common sense” would tell you that the clocks would still be synchronized (to within the known stability of the clocks in question). Relativity says otherwise. Not only that, the experiment has been performed a number of times with real clocks, and they do deviate exactly to the extent predicted by relativity. So much for “common sense.”
 
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think the misunderstanding about science that your aside represents is critical to clear up before trying to tackle evolution.
In a communication that does not make sense it is important to try to discern where the problem lies - in the explanation, in the phrasing of the explanation, or in the understanding of the explanation.

I suppose your reply served some useful personal purpose. It sounds out of touch with what I was trying to say that what is common sense does not necessarily explain as fully a phenomenon as does a view that is outside the box. I thought the example of light was common knowledge that would illustrate the point. You took it upon yourself to belabour the obvious while being quite presumptuous about what I know.

At issue was the claim that the theory of evolution was simply common sense. I suppose in the same way that it might be common sense to suppose that space-time can be explained in terms of Euclidean geometry.
 
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At issue was the claim that the theory of evolution was simply common sense.
It is. By observation there is variation within species. By common sense some of those variations are more successful at reproducing themselves than other variations.

At heart, that is all that Darwin says.

rossum
 
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LeafByNiggle:
think the misunderstanding about science that your aside represents is critical to clear up before trying to tackle evolution.
In a communication that does not make sense it is important to try to discern where the problem lies - in the explanation, in the phrasing of the explanation, or in the understanding of the explanation.

I suppose your reply served some useful personal purpose. It sounds out of touch with what I was trying to say that what is common sense does not necessarily explain as fully a phenomenon as does a view that is outside the box. I thought the example of light was common knowledge that would illustrate the point. You took it upon yourself to belabour the obvious while being quite presumptuous about what I know.

At issue was the claim that the theory of evolution was simply common sense. I suppose in the same way that it might be common sense to suppose that space-time can be explained in terms of Euclidean geometry.
I see. You were using Relativity in exactly the opposite manner than I had assumed, showing that things that are true are not necessarily common sense. I did indeed get it wrong. However in my defense, I have heard many people who oppose evolution do so on the grounds that it didn’t make “common sense.”

Earlier you said:
I’ll begin my criticism of evolution, as you define it, with the assertion that there is no mechanism that adequately describes the process by which alleles are formed. Nor is there any satisfactory explanation regarding how there developed the larger, encompassing process that is the connection between the allele and the phenotype, which it should be noted exists at a different ontological level in its being part of the environment.
I fail to see why this question is necessarily one that evolution should address. In its most basic form, Darwinian evolution states only that genetics change randomly and that those changes are filtered by natural selection. Darwinian evolution does not say what the mechanism is for those changes, only that they are random, as far as we can tell, that is, not teleological. Evolution does not have to explain how life got started. It doesn’t have to talk about cosmic rays, or chemical effects. It only states what it states. You cannot criticize a theory for what it fails to explain.
 
Misled? No, merely different opinion as to how to balance different, and contradictory, design elements.

rossum
 
I am not a scientist but evolution makes more practical sense than a literal interpretation of Genesis. Would we need to disregard the entire geologic record and all we know of geological history?
 
I am not a scientist but evolution makes more practical sense than a literal interpretation of Genesis. Would we need to disregard the entire geologic record and all we know of geological history?
…and I don’t entirely disagree with you. There is some micro-evolution, but less macro-evolution and human intelligence has not changed much since we first walked the earth. If we have been here for 600,000 years do you really think we stayed static for 595,000 years in a stone age before then moving to the space age in 5000 years?
 
There is no fossil record of intermediate human beings. Piltdown man was a forgery, as was Java man 1891 which involved an ape skull cap and a human leg bone found 15 yds apart which were claimed to be evidence of a walking ape. 2 Wadjak skulls found in the same strata were kept secret for 30 years.

Why did these anthropologists do this? maybe to try to fool the public into thinking there was no God

And who was the likely culprit? Bowden (2012) points to Fr Teilhard de Chardin S.J.

Teilhard de Chardin (1881-1955), was a philosopher, theologian, paleontologist and geologist who took part in the discovery of Peking Man. In the 1920s he was subjected to disciplinary measures from the Holy Office and his own order for views he expressed in unpublished writings; but that did not stop his work. He went on to conceive the idea of the Omega point (a maximum level of complexity and consciousness toward which he believed the universe was evolving, and which he identified with Christ as the Logos, or “Word” of God). He also developed the concept of the noosphere (the sphere of thought). Will Pope Francis remove the Vatican’s ‘warning’ from Teilhard de Chardin’s writings? | America Magazine
 
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Maybe you are expecting the wrong thing.

The chain metaphor that “missing link” implies would have us looking for straight lines, when the reality of evolution is much more discursive. Not every fossil creature can be slotted in as a direct ancestor to something alive today. That’s why paleontologists have come to abhor the term: it obscures the true pattern of evolutionary change.
Read more: What’s a "Missing Link"? | Science | Smithsonian Magazine
 
another forgery; the STN573 fossil of 1995 showed that austalopitthecus was an ape-like creature with thumbs on its feet, not big toes, yet it was still being held responsible for the 3.5 m year old Laetoli footprints many years later
 
And Homo Habilis? Home Erectus? Homo heidelbergensis?

All fake?
 
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