Dating outside the Catholic faith

[ThatOneDudeAlex]

responses in bold

Just to make sure I made the correct point, I was trying to explain that I disagree with “dating for fun”, I was not endorsing it. Poor wording on my end

 

[ExLibris]

2 Corinthians 6:14 definitely applies to this. And the phrase, “There is no salvation outside the Church” was also written in Extra Ecclesium Nulla Salus, which as a Catholic you must accept as infallible.

From Thomas Aquinas:

  	 				  He says therefore, Do not be mismated [bear the yoke] with  unbelievers. Here it should be noted that a yoke is anything which binds  several to do something. Hence, because some come together sometimes to  do something good, which is from God, and some to do something evil,  which is from the devil, we speak of God’s yoke and the devil’s yoke.  God’s yoke is charity, which binds a man to serve God: “Take my yoke  upon you” (Matt. 11:29). But the devil’s yoke is for doing evil: “The  yoke of his burden” (Is. 9:4). Therefore he says this: Do not be  mismated, i.e., do not take part in works of unbelief, with unbelievers;  and this for two reasons. First, because there were some among them who  considered themselves wiser, not refraining from idolatry; as a result  they scandalized the lowly. But there were others who took part with the  Jews in the traditions of their elders. Hence, the Apostle exhorts them  and says, do not be mismated with unbelievers, i.e., do not communicate  with the Jews in the traditions of the Law or with Gentiles in the  worship of idols, for both groups were unbelievers.

“A Christian is a Christian.”

That’s oversimplifying this.

Does she accept Benedict XVI as the Vicar of Christ?
Does she accept his infallibility in matters of faith and morality?
Does she accept transubstantiation?

If it were a non-Christian service, I’d understand, but given the circumstances, I don’t. Yes, there are obviously differences, but aren’t the basics the same? Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying I’d ever consider anything but Catholicism, but I don’t see the harm in attending a different Christian service occasionally if you keep faithful to the Church.

You’re getting into dangerous territory here.

Hi,

In the first place a Catholic has no business attending Protestant church services even occasionally. To participate in a heretical worship service and especially a communion service can be sinful for a Catholic because such an act is an affirmation of what we believe to be untrue. To attend an ecumenical service or a wedding or baptism is allowed, but Catholics are not allowed to attend such churches for the main reason of worship. Now if there are no Catholic churches in the vicinity on a Sunday, Catholics are allowed to participate in the Liturgy of Churches whose clergy are validly ordained such as the Eastern Orthodox Churches—including the reception of the Eucharist. Although we consider them to be in schism (not in union with the Pope) with the Catholic Church, such Churches are not heretical and share our basic beliefs.

Fr. Vincent Serpa, O.P.

You submit to a heretical and alien dogma.

 

[Redratfish]

2 Corinthians 6:14 definitely applies to this. And the phrase, “There is no salvation outside the Church” was also written in Extra Ecclesium Nulla Salus, which as a Catholic you must accept as infallible.

**You take its meaning out of it. The saying does not mean that Non Catholics cannot be saved. Anyone with a decent understanding of the saying can tell you this, protestants may be saved through the Church indirectly. **
From Thomas Aquinas:

“A Christian is a Christian.”

That’s oversimplifying this.

Does she accept Benedict XVI as the Vicar of Christ?
Does she accept his infallibility in matters of faith and morality?
Does she accept transubstantiation?
No, YOU are exaggerating this, calling the girl non Christian because she is baptist. She is not Catholic, we have made that point already. There are differences between the two, this has also been stated. At least twice by yourself and by others. The OP understands, and has said so.

You’re getting into dangerous territory here.
In your opinion? I fail to see where he has said anything untrue.

You submit to a heretical and alien dogma.

YOU are cherry picking quotes that fit your agenda. There are many Ask and Apologetic that say that you may attend a Protestant service but not participate, which has ALSO been brought up. He has said that he is attending his own Church first and foremost. He is not saying that they are equal, and that he knows there are differences. Your point has been made. Either contribute something else to convince him, or quit bashing him, and anyone else in a relationship with a Non Catholic.

PS. Do not try to use Aquinas against this. Aquinas was referring to non Christians. The Protestant reformation had not happend yet. and wouldn’t for another 300 years after his death.

 

[laszlo]

Sorry to digress but you are not a Eucharistic Minister. The priest is the Eucharistic Minister. A lay person cannot be that. You are an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion (EMHC).

I am sorry but according to the human logic the genus (Eucharistic Minister) includes all subgroups, in this case the Ordinary and Extraordinary Ministers. Both are authorized bu the Church to distribute the Eucharist, and no Catholic layman or member of the lower clergy can dispute this authorization rightfully. Both are Eucharistic MInisters.

 

[Stylites]

Sorry, but I don’t see the reason for 16 year old Catholics to be dating.

 

[SouthpawLink]

If it were a non-Christian service, I’d understand, but given the circumstances, I don’t. Yes, there are obviously differences, but aren’t the basics the same? Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying I’d ever consider anything but Catholicism, but I don’t see the harm in attending a different Christian service occasionally if you keep faithful to the Church.

This attitude [indifferentism, i.e. all Christian churches are basically the same] is exactly what the Roman Pontiffs repeatedly condemned in the 19th and early 20th centuries:

papalencyclicals.net/Leo12/l12ubipr.htm
papalencyclicals.net/Greg16/g16mirar.htm
papalencyclicals.net/Greg16/g16singu.htm
papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9exulta.htm
papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9aposto.htm
papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9singul.htm
papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9syll.htm
papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9quanto.htm
papalencyclicals.net/Pius11/P11MORTA.HTM

“Protestantism is nothing more than another form of the same true Christian religion, in which form it is given to please God equally as in the Catholic Church” – condemned (Pope Bl. Pius IX, Syllabus of Modern Errors, n. 18; 8 December 1864: Denz. 1718 ).

Protestantism is a false form of Christianity, of which its existence is not willed by God, nor is its worship pleasing to Him.

“The holy universal Church teaches that it is not possible to worship God truly except in her and asserts that all who are outside of her will not be saved” (Pope Gregory XVI, Studio Iugiter Studio, n. 5; 27 May 1832; cf. Pope St. Gregory the Great, Moralia in Job, XIV: 5).

“Judged entirely as a system of teaching and cult, every non-Christian religion is a false one, since it is not the religion which God revealed and which He wishes to be followed. Furthermore, every Christian sect which is not Catholic is also false, since it does not accept and practice the whole content of Revelation” (Msgr. Palazzini, Dictionary of Moral Theology, p. 1032; pub. in Baltimore, 15 April 1962).

God bless!

Edited to add:

205. How does a Catholic sin against faith?
A Catholic sins against faith by apostasy, heresy, indifferentism, and by taking part in non-Catholic worship.

206. Why does a Catholic sin against faith by taking part in non-Catholic worship?
A Catholic sins against faith by taking part in non-Catholic worship when he intends to identify himself with a religion he knows is defective.

catholicity.com/baltimore-catechism/lesson16.html

A prayer from that same catechism:

“Almighty and everlasting God, whose will it is that all men be saved and that none should perish: look upon the souls deceived by the guile of Satan, so that the hearts of those who have gone astray may put aside the perverseness of heresy, and, being truly repentant, may return to Your unity. Through Christ Our Lord. Amen” (p. 83)

 

[morganc12]

I am in much the same position as you, but my boyfriend and I will be seniors in college this fall. He is a Baptist, and a very faithful man. He also wants to be an Evangelist, which makes things much more complicated. I really don’t know what to tell you, but I do agree that I’d rather be with someone who is genuinely passionate about Christ and living a good Christian life, than a nominal Catholic.

It’s a lot to think about, even if you’re only sixteen. I’m not that much older than you, but it only gets more complicated once the idea of marriage becomes a clearer, much more possible outcome of dating.

 

[josephback]

This is also something I’ve greatly considered. I feel certain that I’m solid enough in my faith so I cannot me shaken. If I start to feel I’m being drawn away from the Church, I assure you I’ll speak with my family, priest, (or the lovely members of CAF )

If it were a non-Christian service, I’d understand, but given the circumstances, I don’t. Yes, there are obviously differences, but aren’t the basics the same? Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying I’d ever consider anything but Catholicism, but I don’t see the harm in attending a different Christian service occasionally if you keep faithful to the Church.

You might think you’re unshakable, but if you marry this girl then regardless of whether she converts, you’re going to suffer from “please the wife” syndrome. A happy wife is a happy marriage, and eventually one of you is going to be forced either to surrender or compromise in the religion category. When that happens(and it WILL), who’s it gonna be? Interfaith relationships are just an unwise thing

Also, speaking as a former Protestant, they are NOT the same. It’s very subtle the ways that the Truth is skewed and corrupted. If it was okay there would’ve never been a split.

 

[ExLibris]

**You take its meaning out of it. The saying does not mean that Non Catholics cannot be saved. Anyone with a decent understanding of the saying can tell you this, protestants may be saved through the Church indirectly.
**

You’re talking about CCC 847, and I would agree. However, by the original poster’s own admission, the girl in question has a Catholic mother and seems interested in the Bible. So, it could be successfully argued that there is no ignorance of the Church.

**No, YOU are exaggerating this, calling the girl non Christian because she is baptist. She is not Catholic, we have made that point already. There are differences between the two, this has also been stated. At least twice by yourself and by others. The OP understands, and has said so.
**

I am well aware that the point was made she was not Catholic. Perhaps I should have put some context to how I took Aquinas’ quote.

Aquinas uses mismated, to be matched in an inappropriate manner.

Or what fellowship does light have with darkness?

Do your mate yourself with the enlightened in the light of the true and most perfect faith or do you mismate yourself with those clouded in the darkness of error and heresy?

Did God not separate darkness and light himself?

Genesis 1:17-18

God set them in the dome of the sky, to shed light upon the earth, to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. God saw how good it was.

In your opinion? I fail to see where he has said anything untrue.

By untrue I take that to mean dangerous in terms of faith. He admitted to attending heretical church services. Typically, one should only do so because of ecumenism or grave reason.

YOU are cherry picking quotes that fit your agenda. There are many Ask and Apologetic that say that you may attend a Protestant service but not participate, which has ALSO been brought up. He has said that he is attending his own Church first and foremost. He is not saying that they are equal, and that he knows there are differences. Your point has been made. Either contribute something else to convince him, or quit bashing him, and anyone else in a relationship with a Non Catholic.

What accord has Christ with Beliar?

The members of Beliar refuse to submit to the members, or yoke, of Christ.

I’m sorry that I have made you so overtly upset. I don’t believe I am bashing anyone.

 

[Stavros]

As a convert who is married to a baptized, but non-practicing, Catholic (he was baptized as ann infant, but was never catechized or confirmed, and does not identify himself as Catholic), I cannot express to you the heartbreak of living in a dual-faith home.

Also, as many of the others have said, you are only 16, and serious dating is for adults and those who have discerned their vocation to be married, and who are ready to support a wife and family. As I always find a good answer for hard questions from the priests at Audio Sancto, I’d highly recommend listening to these homilies from an amazing priest. This priest often says “I am not here to make you feel good, I am here to make you be good.” And I’m warning you - in these sermons, he’s not kidding. These are hard to listen to, but they could make a huge difference in the path for your life.

• Top Seven Sins That Will Send You To Hell
• Occasions of Sin and Company Keeping
• Kissing a Vocation Goodbye

 

[Bezant]

Hi all! I have a question that I feel a bit silly asking, but feel the need to put out there.

I was born, and have been raised, in a very Catholic household. I’m sixteen years old. I’m an usher and a Eucharistic Minister in my parish. I go to church every weekend, go on multiple retreats every year, etc…

Back in April, I met a girl I really liked, and we started dating. She is a Baptist. Also active in her church, she goes weekly, and helps with a youth group. Both of us take religion very seriously. We’ve talked about God, and everything, and have no problem with one another’s faith. At my age, it seems that most Catholics are only Catholic by title. I know few teenagers that actually go to, or even care about church.

My parents really like this girl as well, but have mentioned to me that they wish she were Catholic. Her mother is Catholic, while the rest of her family is Baptist, so I don’t think her family cares either way.

The point I’m getting to is this. Is it wrong for me to date a non-Catholic, even though she’s a religious person? Let me reiterate that I’m only sixteen. It’s not like I’m thinking about marriage or anything; I don’t think it’s a big deal. Thanks for any assistance in answering!

Since you’re not considering marriage, your ‘uneven yoke’ is not a problem in my eyes. Even then, neither you nor your families would seem overly opposed.

As for casual dating, that’s all right as well, as long you understand the risks involved and make it clear in the beginning; those who don’t are particularly unhappy when the relationship ends.

 

[TemplarJPN]

If it were a non-Christian service, I’d understand, but given the circumstances, I don’t. Yes, there are obviously differences, but aren’t the basics the same? Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying I’d ever consider anything but Catholicism, but I don’t see the harm in attending a different Christian service occasionally if you keep faithful to the Church.

That’s a very dangerous approach to faith. They are heretics and attending their services makes them believe you agree with them.

Pax Christi,

TemplarJPN :knight2:

 

[FromTheAshes777]

something else important to consider
say you do wind up marrying this young lady

would she submit to allowing you to raise your children Catholic?

 

[ThatOneDudeAlex]

That’s a very dangerous approach to faith. They are heretics and attending their services makes them believe you agree with them.

Pax Christi,

TemplarJPN :knight2:

This, I don’t understand.

I’m sure many of you have heard of Joel Osteen, a preacher from Texas who has a half-hour show every week of one of his sermons. He’s not Catholic, but is listening to him a bad thing? As far as I can tell, everything he teaches seems to be good stuff. Same with a non-denominational church I have attended before with my Boy Scout Troop. It’s nothing teaching against what the Catholic Church teaches. Just… doesn’t mention transubstantiation and other Catholic-only things.

Let me stress once again that when I went to this church service, I still went to Catholic mass that weekend. I would never think anything could take the place of it.

 

[SouthpawLink]

This, I don’t understand.

I’m sure many of you have heard of Joel Osteen, a preacher from Texas who has a half-hour show every week of one of his sermons. He’s not Catholic, but is listening to him a bad thing? As far as I can tell, everything he teaches seems to be good stuff. Same with a non-denominational church I have attended before with my Boy Scout Troop. It’s nothing teaching against what the Catholic Church teaches. Just… doesn’t mention transubstantiation and other Catholic-only things.

Let me stress once again that when I went to this church service, I still went to Catholic mass that weekend. I would never think anything could take the place of it.

Have you done any research on his teachings? Have you thoroughly studied the catechism so as to be able to spot any subtle heresy being taught by Mr. Osteen? From what I remember, he preaches a lot about how to live and he appears to push the “health and wealth” gospel. Just because his teachings seem to be good doesn’t mean that they actually are in point of fact. Here’s a Catholic blog that has a compilation of critiques of Osteen:

socrates58.blogspot.com/2008/01/protestant-critiques-of-joel-osteens.html

If these were the old days, when the Church was more careful to protect the flock from error* (pre-1960), then yes, regular viewing of Protestant sermons on TV would be forbidden by the Church because of the danger they present (flowery language disguises much falsehood). You don’t see anything blatantly wrong (i.e. no anti-Catholic message) so you’re led to believe it’s okay otherwise.

Here is an example of how the Church used to view non-Catholic newspapers, books and periodicals which defended heresy or immorality in general: users.uswest.net/~slrorer/Censorship.htm

• My opinion.

 

[Mamanurse]

That’s what I meant, actually Couldn’t think of the correct terminology, but thanks~

Ed, I thank you. This pretty much explains what I’ve thought throughout this whole thing. A Christian, is a Christian.

Is, “We don’t wanna’ be just friends.” a suitable answer? No disrespect or anything, I’m only kidding, but you have to see it from my point of view.

As an adult, (I’m assuming, since you’re married ) you’re able to think in that way, but imagine when you were my age. I don’t know of any teenager who didn’t want to date. I’ve found someone who’s a very nice, strong Christian, and I’m comfortable dating her. And to address your first point, I agree to a degree. Dating “for fun” can end up with selfish decisions, and bad choices. I, however, date to see the different types of people. For example, my last girlfriend was rather “clingy” and jealous. Ultimately, we broke up, but in the long run, I learned that when I am ready to get married, the person will have to be okay with me hanging out with other females.

Even though I’m not considering marriage right now, dating still helps me to find my future wife.

…I hope someone followed that

It is quite obvious that of your age…as you completely disregarded the portion of my response which states that I am married to a non-catholic. It is very difficult. He is Lutheran, a non practicing lutheran, but another faith altogether. And I can remember when I was your age, I’m not that old , I also remember wanting a catholic spouse. You came onto a catholic, mostly adult, forum asking for opinions…I’m just giving you mine. Good Luck.

 

[ExLibris]

This, I don’t understand.

I’m sure many of you have heard of Joel Osteen, a preacher from Texas who has a half-hour show every week of one of his sermons. He’s not Catholic, but is listening to him a bad thing? As far as I can tell, everything he teaches seems to be good stuff. Same with a non-denominational church I have attended before with my Boy Scout Troop. It’s nothing teaching against what the Catholic Church teaches. Just… doesn’t mention transubstantiation and other Catholic-only things.

Let me stress once again that when I went to this church service, I still went to Catholic mass that weekend. I would never think anything could take the place of it.

It starts with Joel Osteen and ends with John Hagee.

I can’t add anything more than anyone else has said.