Daughter wants to leave the church

[Kid_Charlemagne]

i can sense her frustration now someone on a thread here said something like “women cannot be priests but they have the privilege of being mothers” maybe now I understand why angry feminists are attacking the church (I’m not supporting women priests, but there is a better way to explain it people!)

She can become a nun, can’t she?

Or is being a bride of Christ not “cool” enough?

 

[Kid_Charlemagne]

Furthermore, when it comes to daughters you have to start inoculating them against feminist propaganda at a young age. Leaving it to 15 is rather late. Your daughter should already be aware by now that feminism is at war with God and Holy Mother Church, that it’s a form of cultural Marxism, that it echoes Lucifer’s cry of “Non Serviam!” and glorifies the disobedience of Eve, and that all the prominent feminists like Betty Friedan, Gloria Steinem, Bella Abzug, etc were atheistic, Communist, Jews who were possessed of a maniacal hatred of Our Lord, Our Lady, and Holy Mother Church. And that the goal of these people is the destruction of the family unit and the damnation of the maximum number of souls possible, through means such as fornication, homosexuality, abortion, etc.

To repeat, your daughter would already know all this. Shame on you if she doesn’t.

Then secondly, you have to promote traditional ways. With my daughters, they were taught from a young age to be feminine, soft spoken, deferential, caring, etc. They were taught to dress like a girl in dresses and so on. They took sewing classes and music classes. For sports and exercise they took tennis. Their mother taught them how to do all domestic chores and be good cooks, and made sure to model good wifely behavior in front of them, e.g. submitting to the husband as the head of the household. They learned to talk like ladies and not to use crude language or swear in public or in mixed company. They will learn enough of a skill and have enough education to support themselves while single, but it has been impressed upon them that the goal should be to find the right man, get married, and have babies that they raise in the Faith. And that if they’re lucky, they may end up housewives…like their mother, which is the best job in the world. They have been taught that they will respect their future husband as the head of the household and submit to his leadership and decisions. They will make excellent wives and mothers.

This is how we raised our daughters. But sad to say, I think we are in the majority nowadays…even among Catholics! Did you raise your daughter in this way? If not, then what did you expect?

I’ll end with this lovely quote from Bishop Richard Williamson: “The best university for a young lady is her mother’s kitchen.”

 

[Oneofthewomen]

WOW!! You really did not just quote a Bishop who was illicitly ordained and kicked out of the SSPX for his extreme views, did you?

OP, i strongly advise you, that if you want your daughter to stay in the Church-
DO NOT TAKE ANY OF THIS ADVICE!!

Furthermore, when it comes to daughters you have to start inoculating them against feminist propaganda at a young age. Leaving it to 15 is rather late. Your daughter should already be aware by now that feminism is at war with God and Holy Mother Church, that it’s a form of cultural Marxism, that it echoes Lucifer’s cry of “Non Serviam!” and glorifies the disobedience of Eve, and that all the prominent feminists like Betty Friedan, Gloria Steinem, Bella Abzug, etc were atheistic, Communist, Jews who were possessed of a maniacal hatred of Our Lord, Our Lady, and Holy Mother Church. And that the goal of these people is the destruction of the family unit and the damnation of the maximum number of souls possible, through means such as fornication, homosexuality, abortion, etc.

To repeat, your daughter would already know all this. Shame on you if she doesn’t.

Then secondly, you have to promote traditional ways. With my daughters, they were taught from a young age to be feminine, soft spoken, deferential, caring, etc. They were taught to dress like a girl in dresses and so on. They took sewing classes and music classes. For sports and exercise they took tennis. Their mother taught them how to do all domestic chores and be good cooks, and made sure to model good wifely behavior in front of them, e.g. submitting to the husband as the head of the household. They learned to talk like ladies and not to use crude language or swear in public or in mixed company. They will learn enough of a skill and have enough education to support themselves while single, but it has been impressed upon them that the goal should be to find the right man, get married, and have babies that they raise in the Faith. And that if they’re lucky, they may end up housewives…like their mother, which is the best job in the world. They have been taught that they will respect their future husband as the head of the household and submit to his leadership and decisions. They will make excellent wives and mothers.

This is how we raised our daughters. But sad to say, I think we are in the majority nowadays…even among Catholics! Did you raise your daughter in this way? If not, then what did you expect?

I’ll end with this lovely quote from Bishop Richard Williamson: “The best university for a young lady is her mother’s kitchen.”

 

[AClaire11]

WOW!! You really did not just quote a Bishop who was illicitly ordained and kicked out of the SSPX for his extreme views, did you?

OP, i strongly advise you, that if you want your daughter to stay in the Church-
DO NOT TAKE ANY OF THIS ADVICE!!

That poster has also said the concept of marital rape is a lie of cultural Marxism and told the victim of infidelity to suck it up because she’s damaged goods now. Please disregard whatever he says.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

That poster has also said the concept of marital rape is a lie of cultural Marxism and told the victim of infidelity to suck it up because she’s damaged goods now. Please disregard whatever he says.

It’s always easier to hold women down to appear superior in comparison than it is to hold yourself to high standards, make personal improvements, and be a strong leader. That’s all we’re seeing here.

 

[ConfusedLucy]

Furthermore, when it comes to daughters you have to start inoculating them against feminist propaganda at a young age. Leaving it to 15 is rather late. Your daughter should already be aware by now that feminism is at war with God and Holy Mother Church, that it’s a form of cultural Marxism, that it echoes Lucifer’s cry of “Non Serviam!” and glorifies the disobedience of Eve, and that all the prominent feminists like Betty Friedan, Gloria Steinem, Bella Abzug, etc were atheistic, Communist, Jews who were possessed of a maniacal hatred of Our Lord, Our Lady, and Holy Mother Church. And that the goal of these people is the destruction of the family unit and the damnation of the maximum number of souls possible, through means such as fornication, homosexuality, abortion, etc.

To repeat, your daughter would already know all this. Shame on you if she doesn’t.

Then secondly, you have to promote traditional ways. With my daughters, they were taught from a young age to be feminine, soft spoken, deferential, caring, etc. They were taught to dress like a girl in dresses and so on. They took sewing classes and music classes. For sports and exercise they took tennis. Their mother taught them how to do all domestic chores and be good cooks, and made sure to model good wifely behavior in front of them, e.g. submitting to the husband as the head of the household. They learned to talk like ladies and not to use crude language or swear in public or in mixed company. They will learn enough of a skill and have enough education to support themselves while single, but it has been impressed upon them that the goal should be to find the right man, get married, and have babies that they raise in the Faith. And that if they’re lucky, they may end up housewives…like their mother, which is the best job in the world. They have been taught that they will respect their future husband as the head of the household and submit to his leadership and decisions. They will make excellent wives and mothers.

This is how we raised our daughters. But sad to say, I think we are in the majority nowadays…even among Catholics! Did you raise your daughter in this way? If not, then what did you expect?

I’ll end with this lovely quote from Bishop Richard Williamson: “The best university for a young lady is her mother’s kitchen.”

What would worry me with this is what if those girls couldn’t live up to your idea of womanhood? What if they were useless in the kitchen? What if they couldn’t find a husband or cant have children? Would they still be able to value themselves as women and children of God or would they just feel like worthless failures?

If I was ever lucky enough to have a child of my I own I really like to think I would love them for who they are even if it isn’t what I expected and support them in whatever they were good at so long as it wasn’t immoral. People aren’t simple gender stereotypes they are people and it can be really harmful to try and force someone to be someone they are not.

 

[Lou2U]

I’ve been reading through this thread for a while now, but I wanted to give a bit of advice. As others have said, keep talking to your daughter and let her say what she wants. Instead of you leading with talk about religion, how about you bring it up to her and just let her talk. Always thank her for telling you her opinions and say how much you appreciate them. As well as this, though, make sure you spend time with her talking about other things - her friends, interests, hobbies, current events - to make sure you don’t make her feel the only thing you care about is her spirituality.

Furthermore, when it comes to daughters you have to start inoculating them against feminist propaganda at a young age. Leaving it to 15 is rather late. Your daughter should already be aware by now that feminism is at war with God and Holy Mother Church, that it’s a form of cultural Marxism, that it echoes Lucifer’s cry of “Non Serviam!” and glorifies the disobedience of Eve, and that all the prominent feminists like Betty Friedan, Gloria Steinem, Bella Abzug, etc were atheistic, Communist, Jews who were possessed of a maniacal hatred of Our Lord, Our Lady, and Holy Mother Church. And that the goal of these people is the destruction of the family unit and the damnation of the maximum number of souls possible, through means such as fornication, homosexuality, abortion, etc.

To repeat, your daughter would already know all this. Shame on you if she doesn’t.

Then secondly, you have to promote traditional ways. With my daughters, they were taught from a young age to be feminine, soft spoken, deferential, caring, etc. They were taught to dress like a girl in dresses and so on. They took sewing classes and music classes. For sports and exercise they took tennis. Their mother taught them how to do all domestic chores and be good cooks, and made sure to model good wifely behavior in front of them, e.g. submitting to the husband as the head of the household. They learned to talk like ladies and not to use crude language or swear in public or in mixed company. They will learn enough of a skill and have enough education to support themselves while single, but it has been impressed upon them that the goal should be to find the right man, get married, and have babies that they raise in the Faith. And that if they’re lucky, they may end up housewives…like their mother, which is the best job in the world. They have been taught that they will respect their future husband as the head of the household and submit to his leadership and decisions. They will make excellent wives and mothers.

This is how we raised our daughters. But sad to say, I think we are in the majority nowadays…even among Catholics! Did you raise your daughter in this way? If not, then what did you expect?

I’ll end with this lovely quote from Bishop Richard Williamson: “The best university for a young lady is her mother’s kitchen.”

No, not shame on the OP at all. Your views sound incredibly extreme to me, and I know most Catholics on this board did not or are not raising their children in this way. I hope (if you have any sons) that you taught them how to do chores and how to cook, not to use crude language and I hope you added on the rest of that Bible verse to them:

22 Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. 24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.

25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing[a] her by the washing with water through the word, 27 and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28 In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29 After all, no one ever hated their own body, but they feed and care for their body, just as Christ does the church— 30 for we are members of his body. 31 “For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh.”** 32 This is a profound mystery—but I am talking about Christ and the church. 33 However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband.
**

I also hope you took into consideration your own children’s hopes and aspirations as well. Being a mother is wonderful, yes, but the CC does not teach that all women should have lots of children, only that they be open to life, not that they should have to marry. I’m thinking about the effects it could have if one of your children is infertile, but sees all their self worth as wrapped up in motherhood, which I hope has not happened.

Finally, there is no teaching that women must be housewives, or that this is what women should aspire to. I hope your children know this. But, as you say, 15 is too late to suddenly implement these regulations on the OP’s daughter.

OP - listen to your daughter. She is her own person, with her own beliefs and values. Listen to them, listen to her, and you will be able to influence her in the way you see best.

Lou

 

[Lou2U]

What would worry me with this is what if those girls couldn’t live up to your idea of womanhood? What if they were useless in the kitchen? What if they couldn’t find a husband or cant have children? Would they still be able to value themselves as women and children of God or would they just feel like worthless failures?

If I was ever lucky enough to have a child of my I own I really like to think I would love them for who they are even if it isn’t what I expected and support them in whatever they were good at so long as it wasn’t immoral. People aren’t simple gender stereotypes they are people and it can be really harmful to try and force someone to be someone they are not.

This is exactly what I was thinking of. And how much pressure it puts men under to support their families single handedly. If it works and both parties are happy, then great. If it doesn’t, what effects will it have on a marriage between two people who have been told a woman should aspire to be a housewife and the man should provide everything necessary for this to happen?

Lou

 

[Sarcelle]

This is exactly what I was thinking of. And how much pressure it puts men under to support their families single handedly. If it works and both parties are happy, then great. If it doesn’t, what effects will it have on a marriage between two people who have been told a woman should aspire to be a housewife and the man should provide everything necessary for this to happen?

Lou

If you go around the conservative Christian blogosphere, you will see a lot of this teaching. Women must be wives and mothers. It is virtually unthinkable for these folks to envision women as full individuals by themselves but women are at best an accessory to a man, cooking, cleaning and bearing children for him and additionally must have the personality of a timid Church mouse.

The daughter has probably gone out to the Catholic blogosphere and learned of this view. No wonder she wants to leave the Church.

 

[phil19034]

my 15 year old daughter despises most christian churches, including Catholicism She believes in God but she basically wants to be a liberal christian…you know those people that do whatever they want and call themselves a christian, they focus on the relationship and not “religion” and rules…

I asked her why and she told me she doesn’t like the Church’s stance on SSA, sex and that she feels religion is for “guys”. i always thought the church is too feminine…

she hates the complementarian idea, how women apparently in the church are valued because they can give birth, not because of who they are…she doesn’t like how christians are hateful people…

We still make her follow us for Mass, but there’ll be a time when we cannot do so.

please pray for her and advice will be good!

To the OP - I highly recommend buying a subscription to FORMED – formed.org.

If your parish doesn’t have a subscription, you can buy a personal one for $9 per month.

With a Google Chromecast, Roku, etc. you can play the videos on the TV.

With FORMED, start family movie/TV night with FORMED videos and discuss the videos after. Make it a mandatory family event several times a week.

Godspeed and God Bless

 

[Kid_Charlemagne]

WOW!! You really did not just quote a Bishop who was illicitly ordained and kicked out of the SSPX for his extreme views, did you?

Bishop Williamson gets it from both sides. From modernists like you, because he refuses to accept the innovations of V2 where they conflict with age-old teachings of the Church. And from sedevacantists, because he refuses to say that it’s a fact that there has been no true pope since Pius XII. (Although, the teachings of Bergoglio are so extreme and anti-Catholic that it’s getting harder and harder to defend that the man is a valid pope.)

But if you listen to Bp. Williamson’s sermons on YouTube, you will see that he is fully in accord with the holy and ancient Catholic Faith. But he ACTUALLY BELIEVES IT, which I guess nowadays does mark him as extreme. Or “excessively rigid” and therefore “full of hate”, as Bergoglio recently put it. (My goodness, just think how “filled with hate” must have been the attendees of the Holy Council of Trent - my, what with all those pronouncements of “anathemas” against heretics and such!)

Whatever. This is getting too far off the topic here. The quote from him stands on its own, I believe. A debate about his status or that of the Society belongs on another thread.

 

[Oneofthewomen]

Consider yourself reported!

Bishop Williamson gets it from both sides. From modernists like you, because he refuses to accept the innovations of V2 where they conflict with age-old teachings of the Church. And from sedevacantists, because he refuses to say that it’s a fact that there has been no true pope since Pius XII. (Although, the teachings of Bergoglio are so extreme and anti-Catholic that it’s getting harder and harder to defend that the man is a valid pope.)

But if you listen to Bp. Williamson’s sermons on YouTube, you will see that he is fully in accord with the holy and ancient Catholic Faith. But he ACTUALLY BELIEVES IT, which I guess nowadays does mark him as extreme. Or “excessively rigid” and therefore “full of hate”, as Bergoglio recently put it. (My goodness, just think how “filled with hate” must have been the attendees of the Holy Council of Trent - my, what with all those pronouncements of “anathemas” against heretics and such!)

Whatever. This is getting too far off the topic here. The quote from him stands on its own, I believe. A debate about his status or that of the Society belongs on another thread.

 

[kozlosap]

Bishop Williamson gets it from both sides. From modernists like you, because he refuses to accept the innovations of V2 where they conflict with age-old teachings of the Church. And from sedevacantists, because he refuses to say that it’s a fact that there has been no true pope since Pius XII. (Although, the teachings of Bergoglio are so extreme and anti-Catholic that it’s getting harder and harder to defend that the man is a valid pope.)

But if you listen to Bp. Williamson’s sermons on YouTube, you will see that he is fully in accord with the holy and ancient Catholic Faith. But he ACTUALLY BELIEVES IT, which I guess nowadays does mark him as extreme. Or “excessively rigid” and therefore “full of hate”, as Bergoglio recently put it. (My goodness, just think how “filled with hate” must have been the attendees of the Holy Council of Trent - my, what with all those pronouncements of “anathemas” against heretics and such!)

Whatever. This is getting too far off the topic here. The quote from him stands on its own, I believe. A debate about his status or that of the Society belongs on another thread.

So, you have set your daughters up so that they have no idea what not only the real world it’s, but of what the real HRCC is. I can’t imagine they will spend their entire lives under your perverted views of womanhood. Hopefully they will escape from your sick cult.

 

[matthewww]

So, you have set your daughters up so that they have no idea what not only the real world it’s, but of what the real HRCC is. I can’t imagine they will spend their entire lives under your perverted views of womanhood. Hopefully they will escape from your sick cult.

is he…what the young kids call it these days- a troll?

 

[matthewww]

update: nothing much has changed! her brother told me to just leave her alone. we do have a short family prayer time everyday, i don’t think that’s helping. we did have more random conversations, and she basically keep saying stuff along the lines of “the church is full of __” or “i hate being a girl, especially a religious one”… I know that being a secular girl is easier than a catholic one, but that doesn’t mean it is ok to be one. i got a couple of extra grey hairs…

 

[redbetta]

update: nothing much has changed! her brother told me to just leave her alone. we do have a short family prayer time everyday, i don’t think that’s helping. we did have more random conversations, and she basically keep saying stuff along the lines of “the church is full of __” or “i hate being a girl, especially a religious one”… I know that being a secular girl is easier than a catholic one, but that doesn’t mean it is ok to be one. i got a couple of extra grey hairs…

Hi, I’ve been following this thread and haven’t had time to respond until now. I’m an almost 20 year old Catholic female and, personally, I’ve never gotten any sexism from the Church. It sounds like she should make friends with devout Catholics. Also, there are a lot of people who are converts here that used to have the same point of view as your daughter. Maybe she can use your account and talk to them or ask them questions. I’m sure quite a few posters would be willing.

 

[ConfusedLucy]

It doesn’t sound like an easy situation for either of you. I hope she one day finds some good Catholics and a faith community where she feels comfortable, that’s what saved my faith and has kept it going through the years of not fitting in where I am.

 

[Sugabee43]

My now almost 21 year old, at 16 suddenly just refused to go to Mass with us. He said, “I’m not going, and you can’t make me.” Based on his particular personality and the fact that consequences, no matter what they were, had ZERO effect on him, we told him that we were disappointed and upset by that. We also told him that it was his choice and the consequence for that choice was between him and God.

Fast forward 4 1/2 years: he had an epiphany this past July, and began returning to Mass. He never received, because he knew he could not. I was grateful that he was just coming! One Sunday, he went to Mass alone due to scheduling, and came home with an ACTS retreat brochure and said he’d signed up!! His retreat occurred this past weekend, and while there, he went to Confession and is now receiving. I cannot TELL YOU the joy that fills our hearts!!
He is saying he’d like to go through RCIA and be confirmed, and I will be joyful whether that happens or not (because MY joy is in the Lord, not what my son does or doesn’t do).

All this to say, you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink. If you have instilled in her Catholic teaching and values, eventually… with lots of prayer on your part, and an openness to God on hers, she’ll return. I was raised in an extremely faith-filled family, and left the church in my 20’s, but returned. There is always hope.