De-Baptism and leaving the Church

[EasterJoy]

Why do I want to officially leave? Because for a long time I was actively involved in my Parish while having no conviction that anything of what the priest said was true. One day I said to myself " you’re acting like a complete hypocrite" so I ceased all involvement.

If I were to continue to be registered “Catholic” it would only deepen my hypocrisy (If that makes sense)

Actually, you might be relieved to know that being registered as a Catholic says nothing about what you think or intend today. It is a record of what sacraments you received in the past. Even if you sent a letter of defection, the record of your baptism and confirmation would still be kept, because these are sacraments that may not knowingly be repeated.

BTW, there are married couples whose marriage has last 60 years precisely because they stick it out through the times when they think, “if she could read my mind, we’d be divorced in a heartbeat.” That’s not hypocrisy. That’s fidelity. So that’s another reason you could continue to remain faithful to practicing a religion to which you have lost your emotional and intellectual connection: because you promised that you would. That’s not hypocrisy, either.

I left, I came back, and I’m glad I came back and wouldn’t leave if I had to do it again., but I understand your thinking right now. We pray that you come back, and as soon as possible.

You don’t have to send a letter. Just remember, we’re keeping the lights on for you.

 

[Alder]

You do realize that the priest is not God, right?

.

yes

We always have room for more hypocrites, so don’t let that stop you.

It’s better for everyone else if you are a hypocrite and outwardly do good things even though you are evil on the inside, than to be true to your evil self by doing evil deeds, thus harming both yourself and other people.

Also, there is a certain amount of merit in faking it until you make it - when you build up a habit, you begin to live it, and then finally it becomes part of who you are.

Don’t you find this offensive?

 

[Alder]

If you don’t mind me asking, what was the priest ssaying that was false?

I don’t want to cause any problems on a forum like this so I’ll just say I could not longer say apostolic creed and leave it at that.

what specifically do you find wrong with infant baptisim and confirmation?

At the risk of this degenerating into a “parents rights to do such and such” debate I’ll just say I’m annoyed about having to carry around the loathsome title of “lapsed catholic.”

Anyways thank you everyone for your answers.

 

[LilyM]

I don’t want to cause any problems on a forum like this so I’ll just say I could not longer say apostolic creed and leave it at that.

At the risk of this degenerating into a “parents rights to do such and such” debate I’ll just say I’m annoyed about having to carry around the loathsome title of “lapsed catholic.”

Anyways thank you everyone for your answers.

Your parents gave you a Catholic spiritual DNA just like they gave you a biological DNA. You can do as little about the former as the latter. If, God forbid, you had inherited some biological genetic illness would you hate your situation so terribly? It would be an awfully counterproductive reaction to have. Not to mention an insult to your parents who most likely simply did what they thought best with decent motives.

 

[Alder]

Your parents gave you a Catholic spiritual DNA just like they gave you a biological DNA. You can do as little about the former as the latter.

Well you could get blasted with gamma rays.

If, God forbid, you had inherited some biological genetic illness would you hate your situation so terribly?It would be an awfully counterproductive reaction to have. Not to mention an insult to your parents who most likely simply did what they thought best with decent motives.

Wouldn’t the most productive thing be trying to cure said biological genetic illness? That’s why I’m here. I don’t that is an insult to my parents.

(I’m not trying to imply being a member of the Church is like having a biological genetic illness; I’m just using your analogy)

 

[thistle]

Hello

This may be a touchy subject so I’ll make this post as brief as possible.

I’ve recently left Catholicism but I’ve learned that I may still be listed as Catholic on a register somewhere.

Is there any way I can terminate my involvement in the Church formally? I don’t want to be associated with this organisation anymore.

BTW. I’ve been Baptized (infant baptism) and confirmed (parents)

Cheers

Once a Catholic always a Catholic.
For a start, baptism leaves an indelible mark which cannot be undone. You cannot be de-baptised.
Secondly, you will always be a Catholic even if you reject the Church and never go near it again. Even if you document to the Church that you are rejecting it the most the Church will do is acknowledge your rejection of it. However, The Church still considers you a Catholic.

 

[LemonAndLime]

Well you could get blasted with gamma rays.

Wouldn’t the most productive thing be trying to cure said biological genetic illness? That’s why I’m here. I don’t that is an insult to my parents.

(I’m not trying to imply being a member of the Church is like having a biological genetic illness; I’m just using your analogy)

I think that formally leaving the Church isn’t enough for you. You cannot rewrite the past. You cannot deny the past. You cannot stop being a lapsed or previous or ex Catholic. There is no cure for the past.

You need to accept this before you can move on.

 

[Lapey]

I don’t want to cause any problems on a forum like this so I’ll just say I could not longer say apostolic creed and leave it at that.

At the risk of this degenerating into a “parents rights to do such and such” debate I’ll just say I’m annoyed about having to carry around the loathsome title of “lapsed catholic.”

Anyways thank you everyone for your answers.

It’s not causing problems to have a discussion. You bring up many generic points but no specifics. That always causes me to suspect anger, or possibly the fact that you may be fighting what you know to be truth. I’ve been in both personal internal conflicts. Anger that I was dragged to church, and dragged through the sacraments, mostly because I knew that my thinking was right and the Church had to be wrong because the rights we have as Americans or whatever democracy one may belong to, the mentality of the Church just doesn’t fit our way of life and thinking.

It also brings up to a life decision, to either leave our former way of life and follow Jesus in His Church, or push away form that truth and continue down the fallen ways of man. The “rich young man” was given this personal choice face to face by Jesus, he chose his former way of life and left Jesus in sadness.

What I have come top realize is, God is not a democratic leader of His Church, He is a KING. It is His way or we choose to look away from Him and in turn move away from Him. He does not push us away, we push Him away.

I must ask and I hope you choose to answer, why would you disbelieve the creed? It can be backed up with historical and biblical teaching, Church Father writings back it up. This is supported even in the writings against the early Church heresies. Now we may choose to disagree with it, but that does not mean it is inaccurate, nor does it mean our opinion is more accurate. Now I will say we do most definitely have the right to disbelieve, however we do not have any right to be right.

Now to the title of “lapsed Catholic”, this was your choice to allow the truth you were taught to be forgotten, it is solely your choice to correct this. It’s time for you to be the adult that you claim to be and seek the truth. You must learn what you want to leave before you leave. If you do not, you will not be happy any where. No matter which way you choose to worship or not worship you will not find peace and joy.

Either way you choose to go, the only way you will not have that title that bothers you so much is to not be a lapsed Catholic. Only you can choose to change that, see Jesus has done everything that needs to be done to live in eternal bliss with Him; all we have to do is accept what He has done.

I urge you to seek the truth of why you question, but not as an American with all the rights human beings give, do it as a faithful servant of God!

 

[Alder]

I must ask and I hope you choose to answer, why would you disbelieve the creed? It can be backed up with historical and biblical teaching, Church Father writings back it up. This is supported even in the writings against the early Church heresies. Now we may choose to disagree with it, but that does not mean it is inaccurate, nor does it mean our opinion is more accurate. Now I will say we do most definitely have the right to disbelieve, however we do not have any right to be right.

It wasn’t my intention to start a debate. Given that this is a Christian forum for Christians It would not be appropriate to start one or to talk about personal views.

After reading some comments it seems that it’s not possible to leave the Church and even defection is no longer available.

However, I’m wondering if it’s possible make some indication that I don’t want be given the last rites if comatose (or anything like that)?

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

Baptism made you a member of our family. Someone can physically go away from their family, disown their family, and avoid their family however they are always a member of that family. A brother who leaves our home is a brother nonetheless.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

It wasn’t my intention to start a debate. Given that this is a Christian forum for Christians It would not be appropriate to start one or to talk about personal views.

After reading some comments it seems that it’s not possible to leave the Church and even defection is no longer available.

However, I’m wondering if it’s possible make some indication that I don’t want be given the last rites if comatose (or anything like that)?

You would but this sort of thing in your living will or your health care proxy forms. You must understand though that your next of kin usually trumps such documents so you must make your wishes perfectly clear to your next of kin.

If they decide that they want you to have the Anointing of the Sick then you will most likely get it.

 

[Lapey]

Baptism made you a member of our family. Someone can physically go away from their family, disown their family, and avoid their family however they are always a member of that family. A brother who leaves our home is a brother nonetheless.

Amen Father…the prodical son was greeted by his father when he saw him coming, he didn’t wait in the house or even on the porch; he ran to him and embraced him!

The son asked to be given his portion of the inheritance and then chose to leave his family, only to be welcomed home as royalty. How beautiful!!!

 

[LilyM]

It wasn’t my intention to start a debate. Given that this is a Christian forum for Christians It would not be appropriate to start one or to talk about personal views.

This isn’t a forum for us to merely slap each other on the back and say ‘ain’t it grand being Catholic’. It’s a forum for us to provide information and answers about our faith (“apologetics”) to everyone who comes, whether they agree or disagree with our views.

In other words PRECISELY the right forum to start a debate on anything to do with Catholicism, whatever your perspective is.

So don’t be scared or shy to tell us why you disagree with the Creed. In fact it’s exactly the thing you should do so that we can understand what point of view you’re coming from.

 

[jmcrae]

However, I’m wondering if it’s possible make some indication that I don’t want be given the last rites if comatose (or anything like that)?

You have to ask for the Last Rites - no one will give them to you without you or your next of kin specifically requesting it.

 

[CopticChristian]

You have to ask for the Last Rites - no one will give them to you without you or your next of kin specifically requesting it.

This is fabulous. You need not worry about being given the last rites. You have to ask for them. You may on your deathbed change your mind.

Now if you are comatose there is a possibility that a well meaning relative may ask that the last rites be given. In that case you would need to prepare a document that is called Advanced Directives. If you were to enter in the hospital you can spell out in the Advanced Directives, your last wishes.

Research Advanced Directives. These are legal documents. I do not know if they apply to Hospitals alone, auto accidents on the street, or eminent death outside a hospital.

You can make a choice now, get an Advanced Directive and rest easy.

You can reconsider your decision and get an Advanced Directive later.

You can speak to family and ask their (name removed by moderator)ut.

You can speak to anyone you trust and get (name removed by moderator)ut.

You can do nothing.

You have lots of choices.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

However, I’m wondering if it’s possible make some indication that I don’t want be given the last rites if comatose (or anything like that)?

If you are in the hospital at some point they will ask your religion, simply answer “none.” If they ask if you want a visit from the chaplain say, “no.”

If you are at home then there’s no need to worry, the priest won’t show up unless someone calls him.

 

[masuwerte]

Well you could get blasted with gamma rays.

Nah, that’s what turned Bruce Banner into the Incredible Hulk. And X-Rays turned a harmless lizard into Godzilla, so you wouldn’t want to go that route, either.

 

[beth40n2]

You would but this sort of thing in your living will or your health care proxy forms. You must understand though that your next of kin usually trumps such documents so you must make your wishes perfectly clear to your next of kin.

If they decide that they want you to have the Anointing of the Sick then you will most likely get it.

Great news for you is that…if your family gives you the annointing of the sick with the apolsotlic blessing you will be with Jesus. You will be so shocked when you get there that it is really the place to be, the alternative would be very hot forever.

 

[CopticChristian]

Great news for you is that…if your family gives you the annointing of the sick with the apolsotlic blessing you will be with Jesus. You will be so shocked when you get there that it is really the place to be, the alternative would be very hot forever.

This is kind of like the proof of God based on percentages. I cannot recall which it is. My recollection is this.

If there is a God and there is value in believing 1/3
If there is a God and I deny it then I lose something 1/3
If there is no God and in believing there is value in believing I bring value 1/3

So there is a 2/3 chance that believing in God brings you and the world value.

Gamma rays are out becuase of reasons stated.
Making a provision that if you are comatose and only if you are comatose that the last rites are given puts you in the 66 2/3 percentage that you bring value and you may benefit. These are better odds.

Choosing to while conscious have no last rites and choosing to deny yourself last rites while in coma puts you into a 33 1/3 chance of losing something. These are bad odds.

Jimmy the Greek and Vegas would go with the 66 2/3 option, go with the odds.

 

[Vico]

Hello,

Where?

Dan

There is still formal defection. Here is a reference to the Vatican issued Prot. N. 10279/2006 on formal defection:

vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/intrptxt/documents/rc_pc_intrptxt_doc_20060313_actus-formalis_en.html

What in now in effect is a change of canon law that struck formal defection from the marriage canons.

1086 §1 “A marriage is invalid when one of the two persons was baptised in the catholic Church or received into it -]and has not by a formal act defected from it/-], and the other was not baptised.”

1117 “The form prescribed above is to be observed if at least one of the parties contracting marriage was baptised in the catholic Church or received into it -]and has not by a formal act defected from it/-], without prejudice to the provisions of can. 1127 §2.”

1124 “Without the express permission of the competent authority, marriage is prohibited between two baptised persons, one of whom was baptised in the catholic Church or received into it after baptism -]and has not defected from it by a formal act/-], the other of whom belongs to a Church or ecclesial community not in full communion with the catholic Church.”