Well here’s an example; a fellow Oblate caught an RCIA instructor saying to her pupils that the presence of God in the Eucharist was only “symbolic”.
They don’t but at least with an EF I can easily recognize a Catholic worship.
What makes you think that the TLM is 2000 years old? it is about 500 years old. At one time it was “new.” You are fearful of change, and you recall a Golden Age of the Church that never existed. It is this stubbornness that causes division in the Church. Those that insist that the Novus Ordo is inferior are really the source of the problem.
Not to mention parents and others who raise Catholics these days.
Unless you find a clear break in the Mass, it technically does go back to Christ.
I’ve been in IT for 35 years and I can tell you that I always welcome change if the changes make sense.
I sincerely hope you are active in the Catechetical ministries of your parish. If you are not, you have nothing to criticize. It is easy to sit on the sidelines and point without helping to resolve the problem. Or do you expect the Priest to do everything? He has enough to do. Lay participation is critical for the growth of the Church. So until you demonstrate you are doing something to remedy the problem, i would just as soon not have to deal with your incessant complaining about the state of RCIA, CCD and all the rest.
You make a valid point there. I have been asked by a local priest to instruct RCIA. My hestitation comes from what the local bishop might do to me once he hears the way I would teach it. The priest assures me that won’t happen but I still have my doubts.
The Novus Ordo does not contitute a “break”. And in case you didn’t know, all of the SAcraments have form and substance. The substance cannot change, the form can change. Thr liturgy, by definition, is form, and therefore can be changed. What cannot be changed are the words of consecration and the bread and wine. This does not mean that individual innovtions are allowed, but it does mean that if tomorrow the Church decided that vesntements wer unnecessary, she would be within her power to do so.
You’re right, it’s not. On the flip side of this coin in my city the Missionary Oblates of Mary Immaculate are the local liberal hotbed. You’re not one of THOSE Oblates, are you?
That would be true if only the EP1 were said at every Mass, at least in my opinion, but it’s only an option which is seldom used. It’s really the number of options available that constitutes the break.
The substance does not change but don’t forget lex orandi lex credendi. How many people believe in the Real Presence these days? I rest my case.
I am not sure why this is an issue.
Nice rhetoric, but what the heck does that mean? What kind of an argument is that? It has no more significance than telling me to start at the beginning. Are you implying that I might not teach what the Church teaches?If you teach what the Church teaches, there should be no problem.
You said you were asked to teach RCIA and were hesitant to do so because your were afraid your Bishop would not like how you taught.Nice rhetoric, but what the heck does that mean?
I dont think the problem lies so much with those who attend the EF so much as it is the insistance that those who prefer the EF be forced to acknowledge the OF as just another form of worship. And although some of you may feel perfectly fine about the OF I dont. I wont go to it under any circumstances. I avoid it. I drive an hour and 15 minutes instead of walking 3 blocks to avoid it. Do I look down on the people who go there? No , I dont. But some of them look down on me and trust me , by me being perfectly honest about how I feel - I am certain that the responses to this post will be fast and furious and thus prove my point.
Would you go to a Mass in the Ordinary Form if needed to satisfy your Sunday obligation? If the Pope came to your area, would you refuse to go to see him if it meant that you’d have to go to an OF Mass?
LOL, and if you really want a response to “prove your point,” let’s see how rational and fair-minded your opinions might sounds if they were voiced about anything else:
Be prepared fore the firestorm. This w=one is going to draw some ire, I can already see it coming.
You’re probably right. To be clear, I don’t want to say that Mr. Burns’ view are in any way racist (how could I know any such thing?), only to point out that “I don’t look down on you, all I’m saying is that I go an hour and fifteen minutes out of my way to avoid seeing you” isn’t exactly a paragon of tolerance.
for us Traditionals, we dont have the option to go to EF the Mass of always because the NO bishops dont allow it. so, the NO is in much greater advantage which leaves us without the matter of preference. so, the EF is the one being suppressed and feared.