Death During Lent

[Th0t]

My girlfriends mom claims that the Glory is closed for those who die during Lent and aren’t able to enter Heaven until Holy Week starts. Can someone please provide me examples from Scripture and from the Church’s documents to refute her claim?

…

Side note: (My girlfriend wanted me to mention this) Her mother is a little closed-minded and doesn’t really accept anything we tell her. She even claimed that Psalm 22 was what King David was feeling at the time he wrote it and was not what Christ was going through on the cross! And that the bible is based on what people thought and not what actually happened. >.< All at the same time while claiming to be a Catholic!!! Please pray for her re-conversion (pleaded by my girlfriend) She used to believe but because my girlfriend’s dad’s death, her mom’s brother’s death and her mom’s sister’s death, her mom feels that there is no God because if there was He wouldn’t let that happen and she wouldn’t be suffering. She only goes when “The feeling hatches inside me to go (cuando me nace).” A lot of stuff going on with my girlfriend’s mom and her sister. Pray for them.

 

[LilyM]

Surely when someone makes such a bizarre claim as that Heaven is ‘closed for business’ during Lent the onus is on them to prove the claim, either from scripture or Magisterial teaching, and not for you to refute it. So ask gf’s Mom where either scripture or the Magisterium teaches such a ridiculous notion.

Prayers for gf’s Mom.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

Surely when someone makes such a bizarre claim as that Heaven is ‘closed for business’ during Lent the onus is on them to prove the claim, either from scripture or Magisterial teaching, and not for you to refute it.

Prayers for gf’s Mom.

Besides… would the thief on the cross be a possible explanation? Jesus said he would be in Heaven that day.

Some Lent reading: newadvent.org/cathen/09152a.htm

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Besides… would the thief on the cross be a possible explanation? Jesus said he would be in Heaven that day.

Some Lent reading: newadvent.org/cathen/09152a.htm

The “Thief” didn’t go directly to Heaven, he went to “Paradise”. Christ didn’t say today you will be with Me in Heaven. The gates of Heaven were still closed because Christ had not yet rose from the dead and Ascended. Remember that the graves of the Saints were opened by the earthquake and they walked the earth for 40 days. Most likely the Thief went to the Limbo of the Fathers, where those who were justified in the Old Testament waited.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

The “Thief” didn’t go directly to Heaven, he went to “Paradise”. Christ didn’t say today you will be with Me in Heaven. The gates of Heaven were still closed because Christ had not yet rose from the dead and Ascended. Remember that the graves of the Saints were opened by the earthquake and they walked the earth for 40 days. Most likely the Thief went to the Limbo of the Fathers, where those who were justified in the Old Testament waited.

Thanks for that clarification. I have misunderstood this for some time. Can you add more?

Shalom

 

[thistle]

Thanks for that clarification. I have misunderstood this for some time. Can you add more?

Shalom

As others have said its not up to us to refute some baseless claims. Its up to your girlfriend’s mum to give you some evidence to support her assertion. Then come back here with it and we can discuss. If she can’t give you anything then you have your answer!

 

[JacktheCatholic]

As others have said its not up to us to refute some baseless claims. Its up to your girlfriend’s mum to give you some evidence to support her assertion. Then come back here with it and we can discuss. If she can’t give you anything then you have your answer!

 

[JacktheCatholic]

The “Thief” didn’t go directly to Heaven, he went to “Paradise”. Christ didn’t say today you will be with Me in Heaven. The gates of Heaven were still closed because Christ had not yet rose from the dead and Ascended. Remember that the graves of the Saints were opened by the earthquake and they walked the earth for 40 days. Most likely the Thief went to the Limbo of the Fathers, where those who were justified in the Old Testament waited.

I thought you should read this:

“Amen I say to thee, this day thou shalt be with me in paradise”. According to the prevailing interpretation of Catholic theologians and commentators, paradise in this instance is used as a synonym for the heaven of the blessed to which the thief would accompany the Saviour, together with the souls of the righteous of the Old Law who were awaiting the coming of the Redeemer. In II Corinthians (xii, 4) St. Paul describing one of his ecstasies tells his readers that he was “caught up into paradise”. Here the term seems to indicate plainly the heavenly state or abode of the blessed implying possibly a glimpse of the beatific vision.

But read it all: newadvent.org/cathen/14519a.htm

Shalom

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I thought you should read this:

But read it all: newadvent.org/cathen/14519a.htm

Shalom

Ok, it sounds much the same, however I have never read this before.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

Ok, it sounds much the same, however I have never read this before.

I have pondered about the thief because if he did go to heaven then I had to reconcile this with the End of Time or Judgment Day. In this I found reconciliation with the understanding that when we die the first death we are no longer bound to space and time but rather we become like the angels and Jesus himself in that we exist outside of space and time and so we are taken to our judgment immediately and not after some long wait. That if we go through purgatory before we can get close to God that this too happens outside of space and time. So that when Jesus said to the thief that he would see paradise that day it was the way of saying that when we die our first death we will find ourselves at the end of time and standing at judgment with Jesus and all souls from the beginning anf the end of time. That we will know our lot.

I do not know if my uderstanding fully conforms to acceptable Catholic theology but I believe it does.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I have pondered about the thief because if he did go to heaven then I had to reconcile this with the End of Time or Judgment Day. In this I found reconciliation with the understanding that when we die the first death we are no longer bound to space and time but rather we become like the angels and Jesus himself in that we exist outside of space and time and so we are taken to our judgment immediately and not after some long wait. That if we go through purgatory before we can get close to God that this too happens outside of space and time. So that when Jesus said to the thief that he would see paradise that day it was the way of saying that when we die our first death we will find ourselves at the end of time and standing at judgment with Jesus and all souls from the beginning anf the end of time. That we will know our lot.

I do not know if my uderstanding fully conforms to acceptable Catholic theology but I believe it does.

Pope John Paul II had a series of teachings on Judgement and Purgatory, Heaven and Hell. You might try and find them.