death

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billcu1

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I believe if I am correct that the church teaches that hell or gahenna as Jesus was speaking of is not so much a place as a state of being. Now when everyone came to Jesus about someone being dead he would say “they sleep…” So what does the church teach that the death process is?
 
Death is the separation of soul and body. This separation does violence to the person, because the body and soul were made to work together. (We do *not *believe that the soul is the “true self” imprisoned in a worthless shell, as some people believe.)

Immediately after death the soul goes to Heaven, Purgatory, or Hell. At the end of time, the body of each person (with a few exceptions) will be resurrected and reunited to his soul; then the Last Judgment. More on this in the catechism.

I don’t think the Church has formally defined whether hell is a physical place (the catechism neither affirms nor denies it), but I believe it is the consensus of theologians, or at least was for a long time, that it does have a physical component. How else could the damned occupy it with their resurrected physical bodies?

You’ll find an interesting discussion on this topic in this thread from a few years ago.
 
Death is the separation of soul and body. This separation does violence to the person, because the body and soul were made to work together. (We do *not *believe that the soul is the “true self” imprisoned in a worthless shell, as some people believe.)

Immediately after death the soul goes to Heaven, Purgatory, or Hell. At the end of time,** the body of each person (with a few exceptions) will be resurrected and reunited to his soul;** then the Last Judgment. More on this in the catechism.

I don’t think the Church has formally defined whether hell is a physical place (the catechism neither affirms nor denies it), but I believe it is the consensus of theologians, or at least was for a long time, that it does have a physical component. How else could the damned occupy it with their resurrected physical bodies?

You’ll find an interesting discussion on this topic in this thread from a few years ago.
The part in bold — what are you alluding to? Who are the “exceptions?”
 
Who are the “exceptions?”
Our Lord (who Ascended into Heaven), Our Lady (who was Assumed into Heaven), Elijah the Prophet (who was taken up in a chariot of fire), and anyone else who went to Heaven in a similar manner.
 
Death is the separation of soul and body. This separation does violence to the person, because the body and soul were made to work together. (We do *not *believe that the soul is the “true self” imprisoned in a worthless shell, as some people believe.)

Immediately after death the soul goes to Heaven, Purgatory, or Hell. At the end of time, the body of each person (with a few exceptions) will be resurrected and reunited to his soul; then the Last Judgment. More on this in the catechism.

I don’t think the Church has formally defined whether hell is a physical place (the catechism neither affirms nor denies it), but I believe it is the consensus of theologians, or at least was for a long time, that it does have a physical component. How else could the damned occupy it with their resurrected physical bodies?

You’ll find an interesting discussion on this topic in this thread from a few years ago.
Your penultimate paragraph seems to me to make sense. I thought it was generally considered that hell was indeed a physical place - or in my way of thinking rather a place of confinement out of which those in hell could not escape from.
 
Iv’e said it too many times before, but the night my father died, he appeared in my room, started with an apology for 25 years of deliberate, vindictive cruelty which destroyed my confidence, we argued and talked, and at the very end he gave this absolutely terrifying scream and disappeared. I think he’s in hell, going by the scream.

I suppose in one way what he saw coming and which terrified him so much was a “state of being”, insomuch as one could call the vision of hell given by Mary to the 3 children at Fatima a “state of being”.
“She opened Her hands once more, as She had done the two previous months. The rays [of light] appeared to penetrate the earth, and we saw, as it were, a vast sea of fire. Plunged in this fire, we saw the demons and the souls [of the damned]. The latter were like transparent burning embers, all blackened or burnished bronze, having human forms. They were floating about in that conflagration, now raised into the air by the flames which issued from within themselves, together with great clouds of smoke. Now they fell back on every side like sparks in huge fires, without weight or equilibrium, amid shrieks and groans of pain and despair, which horrified us and made us tremble with fright (it must have been this sight which caused me to cry out, as people say they heard me). The demons were distinguished [from the souls of the damned] by their terrifying and repellent likeness to frightful and unknown animals, black and transparent like burning coals. That vision only lasted for a moment, thanks to our good Heavenly Mother, Who at the first apparition had promised to take us to Heaven. Without that, I think that we would have died of terror and fear”.
When the temple curtain had been torn in two, and the earthquake hit at Christ’s death on the cross, we are informed that -

Matthew 27:52 NIV -
The tombs broke open and the bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life.
From the time of Christ then, judgement is immediate after death, and we no longer just “sleep”.

As for resurrecting bodies, I think we’ll be given a new body altogether, and not something patched up out of the material of this world, otherwise a baby would remain a baby, a nonegenarian would still be in his wheelchair and so on. In any case, this universe is going to pass away at the Second Coming. It will disappear, so God’s not going to pull out bits of it just to resurrect a new body. There will be a new heaven and a new earth.

To my understanding then, judgement takes place immediately after death. Those condemned to Hell remain and are tormented in spiritual form only, since there is hardly any point in giving them a new body. Those in Purgatory will probably stay spiritual creatures only until they reach heaven. Only those in heaven will receive new bodies.

John 5:28 NIV
“Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice, and come out–those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned.”
Obviously the resurrection of the dead at Christ’s own death, with the torn curtain and massive earthquake, was the very beginning of that time, and it continues today. Hence my father could be apologising in my bedroom, probably within minutes or seconds of his own death, and then go to his eternal fate.
 
I believe if I am correct that the church teaches that hell or gahenna as Jesus was speaking of is not so much a place as a state of being. Now when everyone came to Jesus about someone being dead he would say “they sleep…” So what does the church teach that the death process is?
i don’t know that this is any help to you but i seem to remember that the Kingdom was described as being ‘at hand’ and something else about ‘in the twinkle of an eye’, - seem to suggest the place/state of death/eternal-life begins right beside us or in us and extends out from there to eternity.
gahenna was divided into two regions, the ‘good’ were obviously ‘conscious’, though described before the Resurrection as ‘being asleep’, because they were in a state of being comforted, in ‘Abrahams comfort’.
 
Your penultimate paragraph seems to me to make sense. I thought it was generally considered that hell was indeed a physical place - or in my way of thinking rather a place of confinement out of which those in hell could not escape from.
What was it about this place called Ghenna that Jesus alluded to as being hell. What was he trying to say there. They say the cannanites worshiped their gods there. Maybe even Abraham his god.
 
What was it about this place called Ghenna that Jesus alluded to as being hell. What was he trying to say there. They say the cannanites worshiped their gods there. Maybe even Abraham his god.
Sorry I cannot really answer your question; Jesus did not enlarge - or so it appears.

However, as may have been hinted at by others, when the damned are resurrected bodily at the parousia, then their bodies presumably must occupy some space somewhere.

God Bless
 
i think hell is a state of being, because it talks about the evil spirit returning back to their
houses and dwelling there also about people who have devils that have entered into them.
the book of job is interesting to read about the state of the evil spirit.
 
i think hell is a state of being, because it talks about the evil spirit returning back to their
houses and dwelling there also about people who have devils that have entered into them.
the book of job is interesting to read about the state of the evil spirit.
With respect that is as it may be said; but it doesn’t really alter the dialogue in progress because you are referring here to that which may or may not occur prior to the parousia; for it is not until the Parousia occurs that the bodies of all (whether or not it is to Heaven or hell) are resurrected.

Regards
 
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