Decline gift etiquette

[Xantippe]

Yep, so it sounds like he has picked the shirts himself and continues with an interest in them. That is way too much interest for a supposed generic thankyou gift.

Right.

And it sounds like more emotional involvement than a hand-me-down item would generate.

I really wish you had given them back, right away. You did have an out when he asked if it fit–you could have said (vaguely) that the shirts didn’t work for Teenage Daughter.

But I know hindsight is 20/20–it’s hard to think when you’re on the spot…

There might still be an out. For instance, “Teenage Daughter’s Dad doesn’t think that we can keep such a generous gift.”

Ask your husband–he might be very happy to be the fall guy for this situation. (I use this one occasionally on tradesmen–“That seems a little high. I should talk to my husband about it before we do anything.”)

Does Teenage Daughter need to be in this particular organization?

 

[Xantippe]

Quite frankly, attention or no, you are well within your rights to tell him (or rather have your husband tell him) “don’t ever talk to my daughter again - do you understand me?? Never again.”

You aren’t besmirching his reputation unfairly with others, or anything like that - you are simply taking steps to protect your daughter. Now of course, if you have more reasons to suspect him of nefarious ends, you’d have an obligation to not simply stop at protecting your own children.

Adult men don’t go around giving gifts to anyone not in their family, short of possibly their own employees/staff, especially teenagers, most especially girls. That’s ridiculous. What kind of dude buys shirts for a teenage girl?

Generally, two kinds - clueless, socially inept guys, and ill-intended perverts.

It is one thing to hope for the former, but I would plan for the latter. I get not wanting to think ill of people, and give them the benefit of the doubt, but when it comes to protecting children, I plan for the worst. You cannot undo harm once it occurs.

I think it’s valuable to have a male opinion on whether or not it’s normal for an unrelated male to give this sort of gift. I also ran it past my husband and he was weirded out, too.

My husband doesn’t even buy his **own **teenage daughter clothing gifts, let alone for teenagers outside our family.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

Update:

Giver has asked me once and teenager twice if the tops fit. Both of us have responded with a generic, “They were fine. Thank you.”

The first time he asked teenager, she was passing through and it was a quick occasion. On the other occasion, I was approached and was passing through.

The second time he asked teenager, he had sought her out in a location he knew she would be at. He was surprised to discover I was in an adjacent hall as he passed through and said a quick “hello” without any eye contact. As I entered the area where he and teenager were, he looked visibly uncomfortable and spoke on a superficial topic and quickly left without making eye contact with me. Teenager told me he had initially inquired about the shirts before I entered the room.

The fact that he entered a location where he is not normally looked extremely suspicous and out of place. He seemed to know she was there, but was completely unaware that I was there as well.

In addition, he has offered in general to all the people to transport anyone to certain group activities (which we did not take him up on) – knowing said activities is something teenager has had an interest in. Luckily, teenager did not attend event.

Teenager has been placed in recognizable position of leadership (through unrelated circumstances), publicly thanked, and made to feel very important and respected. She has been treated in an “adult-like” capacity. Although very mature and reserved, teenager is still “immature” in her worldview and street smart. The public acknowledgements has made her express, in private with her family, how talented and needed she is there.

There is nothing that I can quite put my finger on, outside of a “strong suspicion” of his attempts towards impropriety.

Peace.

+JMJ+

Whatever activity it is that your daughter is in that causes her to have contact with this guy, can you bow out?

I’m not sure what his function is, but if he has a supervisor, please contact the supervisor.

Asking “did you like the shirts?” is one thing. If the shirts fit is a little too personal.

I’m not understanding what the function of the guy is…

Is he a teacher, scout leader, youth minister, band leader, drama club teacher, piano teacher? something like that? Then his gift was inappropriate, him going to try to find your daughter as well. He must have a supervisor. Notify the supervisor with this information. Don’t handle this on your own.

If he is a lay person that your daughter did errands for in a social setting, then stop them from interacting.

I think at this point, the shirts can go to good will for all that matters.

 

[revert_jen]

Update:

Giver has asked me once and teenager twice if the tops fit. Both of us have responded with a generic, “They were fine. Thank you.”

Why does she still have them? There were a lot of good ideas here about ways to give them back without offense.

I’m just wondering if the situation is more complicated than we realize or something.

–Jen

 

[mommy_k]

I personally would pick up the phone and call the gift giver–and say that he caught you and your daughter by surprise regarding the gift. I would be polite and very direct.

I would tell him that you did not have a chance to talk to him aabout it, and act puzzled as to why he gave your daughter this gift. I would mention that the teen came to you and explained about him asking about it too, and then tell him that you cannot accpet this gift and that’s why he did not get a proper thank you. (The may have been fishing for one).

If this is parish or catholic school related the gift giver should have been trained in virtuus, and should know better–it is never wise to be alone with a child or teen, no matter how pure intentions are.

 

[jmj777]

I’m just wondering if the situation is more complicated than we realize or something.

Yes, this situation is extremely more complicated and delicate than I can possibly elaborate on.

Mommy k – I do believe he is trying so hard to fish for a proper thank you. The fact that he is determined to see if it was accepted is really disturbing. He doesn’t seem to have any reservations about asking me. Socially inept or cunning? Naive or bad intentions?

In general, giver is an awkward kind of person – someone who is unsure of himself or with being assertive. Although, he holds a prominent position, he seems to feel comfort with our family as we have shown him acceptance and respect that others have not shown.

I’m leaning towards naive. But at the same time, his adjusting his schedule to make himself more accessible or to have easier access to teenager is very troubling.

Peace.

+JMJ+

 

[pnewton]

I personally would pick up the phone and call the gift giver–and say that he caught you and your daughter by surprise regarding the gift. I would be polite and very direct.

Honest goes a long way. Sometimes the simple, direct approach is the best. Simply tell him how you feel and give it back. If he is the naïve, awkward type, you can explain to him the reason so he can learn propriety and how to avoid this in the future. Take the role of a concerned teacher. Parent him, in a way. If this is grooming behavior, it will also serve as notice that you are aware of the danger of sexual predation and know how to guard against it.

 

[Xantippe]

Honest goes a long way. Sometimes the simple, direct approach is the best. Simply tell him how you feel and give it back. If he is the naïve, awkward type, you can explain to him the reason so he can learn propriety and how to avoid this in the future. Take the role of a concerned teacher. Parent him, in a way. If this is grooming behavior, it will also serve as notice that you are aware of the danger of sexual predation and know how to guard against it.

This will be very hard to pull off, but the best if you can manage it.

 

[KnitNut]

The other difficult part of this situation is that I have yet to reveal this to my DH who I believe wholeheartedly will aggressively confront the giver. DH will not see this in any positive light. Yet, continuous and regular contact with giver will still be inevitable, thus making this situation very sticky.

The giver is someone we see quite often and we are familiar with. The giver also knows the dynamics of our family. The sensitive nature of our “relationship” with him is such that I don’t want to create a mountain out of a possible molehill – by returning gift and/or advising my dh, when in all possibility it may be with the purest of intentions.

However, my dh would be enraged should he find out in the future somehow and I didn’t reveal it to him.

Has this part been addressed? I’m not sure what family dynamics would support withholding information about inappropriate contact by an adult male, with your husband’s daughter. When he finds out (it’s not a matter of “if”, especially if you’re always around this gift-giver guy), he’d certainly be within reason to be upset…I know my husband would be, under these circumstances.

Honestly, the longer you let this fester, the worse it’s going to get. I’m not sure why the tiptoeing around the “relationship”…but especially if this is someone in authority (whether over your daughter, or perhaps you as well, or perhaps your husband), it needs to be sorted out now. If you can’t do it on your own, get your pastor to come with you to mediate (and to verify what actually happened, so gift-giver doesn’t escalate somehow). But nip. it. in. the. bud. He has inquired no fewer than THREE times about the FIT of the clothing. He has adjusted his schedule to seek out your daughter absent your knowledge/supervision. What is it going to take?

 

[Xantippe]

Has this part been addressed? I’m not sure what family dynamics would support withholding information about inappropriate contact by an adult male, with your husband’s daughter. When he finds out (it’s not a matter of “if”, especially if you’re always around this gift-giver guy), he’d certainly be within reason to be upset…I know my husband would be, under these circumstances.

Honestly, the longer you let this fester, the worse it’s going to get. I’m not sure why the tiptoeing around the “relationship”…but especially if this is someone in authority (whether over your daughter, or perhaps you as well, or perhaps your husband), it needs to be sorted out now. If you can’t do it on your own, get your pastor to come with you to mediate (and to verify what actually happened, so gift-giver doesn’t escalate somehow). But nip. it. in. the. bud. He has inquired no fewer than THREE times about the FIT of the clothing. He has adjusted his schedule to seek out your daughter absent your knowledge/supervision. What is it going to take?

The husband knows so that part is under control.

 

[jmj777]

Dh and I are taking steps to remove our entire family from place. We’re seeking another place that will replace our involvement there. It will certainly raise eyebrows and we will inevitably run into people who will inquire.

Until then, we will blatantly and physically interject ourselves in any and all of our children’s activities there, which in itself will raise eyebrows.

This situation has become life changing for our family. We will no longer assume giver’s behavior was harmless, and instead, are seeing it as warning signals that we cannot ignore. Thankful that God has given us this sign before it could have possibly progressed into something unspeakable.

The evil one has seriously been at work to make our family life so very difficult. I humbly ask you for your prayers.

Peace.

+JMJ+

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Dh and I are taking steps to remove our entire family from place. We’re seeking another place that will replace our involvement there. It will certainly raise eyebrows and we will inevitably run into people who will inquire.

Until then, we will blatantly and physically interject ourselves in any and all of our children’s activities there, which in itself will raise eyebrows.

This situation has become life changing for our family. We will no longer assume giver’s behavior was harmless, and instead, are seeing it as warning signals that we cannot ignore. Thankful that God has given us this sign before it could have possibly progressed into something unspeakable.

The evil one has seriously been at work to make our family life so very difficult. I humbly ask you for your prayers.

Peace.

+JMJ+

Your last posts have been alarming. If you feel there is danger, (which I think there is now) you need to report this immediately and never be around that person immediately. Although you have tried to be vague (which is not necessary and quite unhelpful) I think people reading this can make a good guess as to what the situation is now. You need to report this immediately and stop posting on here about this. That you still had the shirts a day ago is alarming as well and shows you are not acting decisively or appropriately.
You should never be around this person again and if you feel you have to be around him anytime then you are not in a position to protect your family.

 

[KnitNut]

Dh and I are taking steps to remove our entire family from place. We’re seeking another place that will replace our involvement there. It will certainly raise eyebrows and we will inevitably run into people who will inquire.

Until then, we will blatantly and physically interject ourselves in any and all of our children’s activities there, which in itself will raise eyebrows.

This situation has become life changing for our family. We will no longer assume giver’s behavior was harmless, and instead, are seeing it as warning signals that we cannot ignore. Thankful that God has given us this sign before it could have possibly progressed into something unspeakable.

The evil one has seriously been at work to make our family life so very difficult. I humbly ask you for your prayers.

Peace.

+JMJ+

Thank you for the good update - please secure your family’s safety!

At this point, given this person’s role involving children, I would strongly suggest bringing the shirts to his boss with an explanation and a request that the boss return the shirts to the giver. That may dampen the giver’s enthusiasm for bonding with teens, at the very least. His boss really needs to know that he is singling out children for gifts in his professional capacity. And the boss (or the program director, or the security person, or the volunteer coordinator!) is the person who really should handle this from here on out. You may feel sad or concerned that the giver is “getting into something ugly”…but he made the choice to cross the boundary, and clearly he needs help immediately. It is notoriously hard to get child predators to control themselves…it has to come from the outside.

 

[pnewton]

This will be very hard to pull off, but the best if you can manage it.

I approach such tasks like they are worth trying, but not for everybody. For some, like this OP, withdrawing is the seen as the best and safest course. I congratulate her on her courage to take that step. Now will come the step of explaining, which really needs to be done, but without slander. For this, take the advise of Joe Friday and give “just the facts” devoid of speculation and conclusions. Likewise any report should have the same information. The man should be given both the presumption of innocence and the scrutiny his behavior demands.

In the end, look at all the good that may be done. Just discussing this here, and as you explain this elsewhere to acquaintances and appropriate others, you may save someone from a terrible ordeal.

 

[Little_Sheep]

Dh and I are taking steps to remove our entire family from place. We’re seeking another place that will replace our involvement there. It will certainly raise eyebrows and we will inevitably run into people who will inquire.

Until then, we will blatantly and physically interject ourselves in any and all of our children’s activities there, which in itself will raise eyebrows.

This situation has become life changing for our family. We will no longer assume giver’s behavior was harmless, and instead, are seeing it as warning signals that we cannot ignore. Thankful that God has given us this sign before it could have possibly progressed into something unspeakable.

The evil one has seriously been at work to make our family life so very difficult. I humbly ask you for your prayers.

Peace.

+JMJ+

Wow - Godspeed to you and your family!

 

[LongingSoul]

I approach such tasks like they are worth trying, but not for everybody. For some, like this OP, withdrawing is the seen as the best and safest course. I congratulate her on her courage to take that step. Now will come the step of explaining, which really needs to be done, but without slander. For this, take the advise of Joe Friday and give “just the facts” devoid of speculation and conclusions. Likewise any report should have the same information. The man should be given both the presumption of innocence and the scrutiny his behavior demands.

In the end, look at all the good that may be done. Just discussing this here, and as you explain this elsewhere to acquaintances and appropriate others, you may save someone from a terrible ordeal.

I also think it should be an open issue around the place without being accusatory. We don’t know the exact set up of this situation but it sounds like it is prudent of you to keep it out of your story for some reason… but letting others know that “we don’t feel comfortable with “guys” position here or company”, at least puts it out there somewhat in the open.

Predators can pull off such innocence that sometimes the only alarm bells will be openness on the part of those affected. ie. Bill Cosby, Rolf Harris.

 

[jmj777]

Update:

After much thought, we returned gift to giver, *discreetly *and privately, with short but concise explanation of avoiding any misunderstanding of gift.

Giver has since let others know he is saddened and took offense. Others criticize the return. We are seen as overreactive and insensitive to giver.

When we’re asked, we just say we were trying to avoid any misunderstandings. Still viewed as being unrealistic.

Not understanding why giver chose to reveal this to others when no one else but us knew about this exchange.

Peace.

+JMJ+

 

[Xantippe]

Update:

After much thought, we returned gift to giver, *discreetly *and privately, with short but concise explanation of avoiding any misunderstanding of gift.

Giver has since let others know he is saddened and took offense. Others criticize the return. We are seen as overreactive and insensitive to giver.

When we’re asked, we just say we were trying to avoid any misunderstandings. Still viewed as being unrealistic.

Not understanding why giver chose to reveal this to others when no one else but us knew about this exchange.

Peace.

+JMJ+

I’m really glad you returned the stuff.

I think how he handled this revealed a lot about him.

As to your last question–because he doesn’t have the sort of common sense, tact and discretion that a person in his position ought to have.

 

[revert_jen]

I’m really glad you returned the stuff.

I think how he handled this revealed a lot about him.

As to your last question–because he doesn’t have the sort of common sense, tact and discretion that a person in his position ought to have.

I agree. I think that his handling of the issue at least means his primary goal was not benefitting your daughter, or he would not gossip about your family to people whose business it is not. (That doesn’t mean his intention was in any way sinister, but it may have been a case of feeling good about how generous he was.)

–Jen

 

[LongingSoul]

At the very least he just sounds so unprofessional especially to hold a supervisory position.