Decriminalization and/or legalization of illicit drugs in the United States?

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Len Bias---------RIP !!!
Len Bias was a former University of Maryland basketball player who died from cardiac arrest attributed to cocaine use just two days after the Boston Celtics drafted him with the No. 2 overall pick in the 1986 NBA Draft. After spending the day of June 18, 1986, in Boston, meeting with Celtics officials and signing a multiyear shoe contract with Reebok, Bias flew home and spent some time at his family’s house in Landover. He then went to his College Park dorm room, where he hung out with some teammates and other friends. He briefly left campus and returned to his dorm room at around 3 a.m. At some point in the night, Bias used cocaine. He collapsed and went into convulsions at around 6:30 a.m…
and-----------------------------
drugabuse.gov/DrugPages/marijuana.html
casacolumbia.org/absolutenm/templates/OpEds.aspx?articleid=223&zoneid=29
casacolumbia.org/absolutenm/templates/OpEds.aspx?articleid=220&zoneid=29
and---------------------------------------------------
HERE’S A GUY WHO USED IT FOR HIS OWN PERSONAL USE----------RIP !!!
"On March 5, 1982, John Belushi was found dead in his room at Bungalow #3 of the Chateau Marmont on Sunset Boulevard in Los Angeles, California.[8] The cause of death was a speedball, a combined injection of cocaine and heroin. On the night of his death, he was visited separately by friends Robin Williams (at the height of his own drug exploits)[9] and Robert De Niro,[10] each of whom left the premises, leaving Belushi in the company of assorted others, including Cathy Smith. His death was investigated by forensic pathologist Dr. Ryan Norris among others, and it was officially ruled a drug-related accident.

Two months later, Smith admitted in an interview with the National Enquirer that she had been with Belushi the night of his death and had given him the fatal speedball shot. After the appearance of the article “I Killed Belushi” in the Enquirer edition of June 29, 1982, the case was reopened. Smith was extradited from Toronto, arrested and charged with first-degree murder. A plea bargain arrangement reduced the charges to involuntary manslaughter, and she served 15 months in prison[11].

So you stoners on here have fun…light up…but beeeeeeee careful !
 
d97c said:
Len Bias---------RIP !!!
Len Bias was a former University of Maryland basketball player who died from cardiac arrest attributed to cocaine use just two days after the Boston Celtics drafted him with the No. 2 overall pick in the 1986 NBA Draft. After spending the day of June 18, 1986, in Boston, meeting with Celtics officials and signing a multiyear shoe contract with Reebok, Bias flew home and spent some time at his family’s house in Landover. He then went to his College Park dorm room, where he hung out with some teammates and other friends. He briefly left campus and returned to his dorm room at around 3 a.m. At some point in the night, Bias used cocaine. He collapsed and went into convulsions at around 6:30 a.m…
and-----------------------------
drugabuse.gov/DrugPages/marijuana.html
casacolumbia.org/absolutenm/templates/OpEds.aspx?articleid=223&zoneid=29
casacolumbia.org/absolutenm/templates/OpEds.aspx?articleid=220&zoneid=29
and---------------------------------------------------
HERE’S A GUY WHO USED IT FOR HIS OWN PERSONAL USE----------RIP !!!
"On March 5, 1982, John Belushi was found dead in his room at Bungalow #3 of the Chateau Marmont on Sunset Boulevard in Los Angeles, California.[8] The cause of death was a speedball, a combined injection of cocaine and heroin. On the night of his death, he was visited separately by friends Robin Williams (at the height of his own drug exploits)[9] and Robert De Niro,[10] each of whom left the premises, leaving Belushi in the company of assorted others, including Cathy Smith. His death was investigated by forensic pathologist Dr. Ryan Norris among others, and it was officially ruled a drug-related accident.

Two months later, Smith admitted in an interview with the National Enquirer that she had been with Belushi the night of his death and had given him the fatal speedball shot. After the appearance of the article “I Killed Belushi” in the Enquirer edition of June 29, 1982, the case was reopened. Smith was extradited from Toronto, arrested and charged with first-degree murder. A plea bargain arrangement reduced the charges to involuntary manslaughter, and she served 15 months in prison[11].

So you stoners on here have fun…light up…but beeeeeeee careful !
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And they died because it was legal and regulated?

And since the major decriminalization will probably be with pot, your examples don’t fit your usage of “stoner”.

Oh, by the way more people die from alcohol and cigarettes, in addition to more from legal drugs than illegal. I realize that it doesn’t bolster the legalization argument from a safety standpoint, but my major point is that we have lost the war on drugs and society would be better off if we didn’t have to fight it any longer.

Peace
 
Cease with the personal remarks and remain on topic.
Thank you.
 
d97c said:
Len Bias---------RIP !!!
Len Bias was a former University of Maryland basketball player who died from cardiac arrest attributed to cocaine use just two days after the Boston Celtics drafted him with the No. 2 overall pick in the 1986 NBA Draft. After spending the day of June 18, 1986, in Boston, meeting with Celtics officials and signing a multiyear shoe contract with Reebok, Bias flew home and spent some time at his family’s house in Landover. He then went to his College Park dorm room, where he hung out with some teammates and other friends. He briefly left campus and returned to his dorm room at around 3 a.m. At some point in the night, Bias used cocaine. He collapsed and went into convulsions at around 6:30 a.m…
and-----------------------------
drugabuse.gov/DrugPages/marijuana.html
casacolumbia.org/absolutenm/templates/OpEds.aspx?articleid=223&zoneid=29
casacolumbia.org/absolutenm/templates/OpEds.aspx?articleid=220&zoneid=29
and---------------------------------------------------
HERE’S A GUY WHO USED IT FOR HIS OWN PERSONAL USE----------RIP !!!
"On March 5, 1982, John Belushi was found dead in his room at Bungalow #3 of the Chateau Marmont on Sunset Boulevard in Los Angeles, California.[8] The cause of death was a speedball, a combined injection of cocaine and heroin. On the night of his death, he was visited separately by friends Robin Williams (at the height of his own drug exploits)[9] and Robert De Niro,[10] each of whom left the premises, leaving Belushi in the company of assorted others, including Cathy Smith. His death was investigated by forensic pathologist Dr. Ryan Norris among others, and it was officially ruled a drug-related accident.

Two months later, Smith admitted in an interview with the National Enquirer that she had been with Belushi the night of his death and had given him the fatal speedball shot. After the appearance of the article “I Killed Belushi” in the Enquirer edition of June 29, 1982, the case was reopened. Smith was extradited from Toronto, arrested and charged with first-degree murder. A plea bargain arrangement reduced the charges to involuntary manslaughter, and she served 15 months in prison[11].

So you stoners on here have fun…light up…but beeeeeeee careful !
Click to expand...
Really? You can die from a drug overdose? Thanks for the heads up because we really didn’t have any idea that drugs are bad.
 
Oh, by the way more people die from alcohol and cigarettes, in addition to more from legal drugs than illegal.
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That doesn’t bolster the legalisation argument. That just says that legalisation leads to an increase in use.
No, the alternative is individual liberty, even the liberty to do stupid or harmful things, and government in its rightful place.
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That is a false liberty. Only God grants true freedom.
 
JLChamberlain said:
portarica;6269087:
Reply to D97c
This is so stupid. What happened to the mafia when prohibition ended. Did they go out of business? No! They became worse because they started to hook people on drugs.
QUOTE]

The most irritating aspect of prohibition was the birth of the American mafia. The government’s decision to outlaw the use and production of alcohol made Al Capone, Johnny Torrio and Bugs Moran notorious and wealthy. Al Capone stole ballot boxes and even murdered voting officials. With so much money to be made, gang wars erupted into bloody violence like the St. Valentine’s Day Massacre.

When alcohol became legal there was less violence because the mafia got out of the distribution of alcohol. The same will be true when drugs are legalized. The government has given the mafia and criminals a monopoly on the sale of drugs by making drugs illegal.
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CPA2 said:
JLChamberlain;6273610:
portarica;6269087:
Reply to D97c
This is so stupid. What happened to the mafia when prohibition ended. Did they go out of business? No! They became worse because they started to hook people on drugs.
QUOTE]

The most irritating aspect of prohibition was the birth of the American mafia. The government’s decision to outlaw the use and production of alcohol made Al Capone, Johnny Torrio and Bugs Moran notorious and wealthy. Al Capone stole ballot boxes and even murdered voting officials. With so much money to be made, gang wars erupted into bloody violence like the St. Valentine’s Day Massacre.

When alcohol became legal there was less violence because the mafia got out of the distribution of alcohol. The same will be true when drugs are legalized. The government has given the mafia and criminals a monopoly on the sale of drugs by making drugs illegal.
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The government does not use effective methods to attack the problem. Like rewarding law enforcement with cash rewards for making busts. And rewarding citizens for information leading to those busts. Waiting for citizens to step forward to “do the right thing” will never work. 9-11 would have been prevented by information from an informant in the Middle East who was willing to cooperate if he would get paid. But the arrogance of those in charge thought that they were getting paid to do a job and wouldn’t allow some informant to tell them how to run things. Things should be changed to allow informants to benefit from the tremendous risks they take.
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portarica said:
JLChamberlain, lets just look at two of your conclusions.

1.) " is easier to buy pot than cigarettes for children. Children are the best advertisers for other children."

2.) And make it easier for children to get their hands on it and think that all drugs are OK.

If it is now easier for kids to get pot than cigarettes and we regulate pot like cigarettes, then your second conclusion is wrong.

So is your first or second conclusion wrong?

Peace
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Not at all. A child walking in a store to buy cigarettes has virtually zero chance of getting them. But a child on a playground, talking to friends about pot? At least one of his friends will have an older brother that will sell them anything. Do you think they will buy cigarettes or pot?
 
portarica said:
JLChamberlain:" cost thousands of dollars to treat drug addicts on the street without arresting them. Your arguements are weak. A drug pusher in China who pushes drugs on the Chinese gets executed. But a drug grower in China who exports to the US to poison Americans is rewarded by the government. Why is that?
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It costs $29,000 + a year to incarcerate a person. out patient treatment is cheaper than that and even a combination of treatments would be cheaper than the 29,000.

As to china, they kill people for opposing anything the government says. I guess you would like them to kill people who are opposed to abortion. Seeing how the Chinese killed more of there own people beginning with Mao than any other entity in human history probably lends moral support for your killing drug dealers argument, if China says so it must be OK.

But then again they put poison in their milk and cat food.

Peace

Your way: You will increase the amount of drug addicts in the country even if they never go to jail. Does that make these people model citizens?

Now look up the cost of drug treatment per year. And one drug addict today means ten tomorrow.

Why weren’t people smoking pot during prohibition? Do you think that society had something to do with the self regulation of not trying it?
 
JLChamberlain said:
Not at all. A child walking in a store to buy cigarettes has virtually zero chance of getting them. But a child on a playground, talking to friends about pot? At least one of his friends will have an older brother that will sell them anything. Do you think they will buy cigarettes or pot?
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Where did the older brother get the pot? From some place easy like the drug dealer or was he of age and got it legally?

And what was the source?- the Mexican drug cartel or the government?

And which source empowers criminals more?

The more one considers the issue, the clearer it becomes that the present system is not only ineffective, but leads to more heinous outcomes that are not considered in the usual consideration of the drug problem.

Distill it down to pot for ease of discussion, legalizing it would free up resources for more critical police work (terrorism perhaps, also would take money away from terror groups in s.america, Columbia in particular.)

It would take corruption out of police forces,

It would lessen the costs of prisons.(29K/yr/person)

it would lessen crime and lessen the training of criminals in prison.(less crime and more poorly executed crimes).

Less people would move to other drugs due to lack of exposure to criminal elements.

Less murder and death along borders due to influence of foreign cartels. (also safer for border patrol agents who would be dealing with fewer drug traffickers).

Less violence among illegally using youths since pot smokers are less violent than drunks.

Increased sales of Oreos and milk would lift the nation out of present economic hole.

Peace
 
JLChamberlain said:
It costs $29,000 + a year to incarcerate a person. out patient treatment is cheaper than that and even a combination of treatments would be cheaper than the 29,000.

As to china, they kill people for opposing anything the government says. I guess you would like them to kill people who are opposed to abortion. Seeing how the Chinese killed more of there own people beginning with Mao than any other entity in human history probably lends moral support for your killing drug dealers argument, if China says so it must be OK.

But then again they put poison in their milk and cat food.

Peace
Click to expand...
Your way: You will increase the amount of drug addicts in the country even if they never go to jail. Does that make these people model citizens?

Now look up the cost of drug treatment per year. And one drug addict today means ten tomorrow.

Why weren’t people smoking pot during prohibition? Do you think that society had something to do with the self regulation of not trying it?

There are some interesting facts in the following cite: whitehousedrugpolicy.gov/publications/factsht/treatment/index.html

It is not only cheaper to treat people but the payoff in savings to society is 3X the cost.

Peace
 
No illegal drugs, not even marijuana, should be decriminalized or legalized. Why? Because they cause health problems and societal problems. That said, I personally wish that they would raise the age limit for cigarette smoking and alcohol drinking as well. People shouldn’t be allowed to buy cigarettes or alcohol until they are at least 22 or 23.

Illegal drugs do nothing but waste the brain away and cause family and societal problems. Not only that but they cause health problems in the one who is abusing such drugs as well. We do not need such drugs to be decriminalized or legalized!
 
Holly3278 said:
No illegal drugs, not even marijuana, should be decriminalized or legalized. Why? Because they cause health problems and societal problems. That said, I personally wish that they would raise the age limit for cigarette smoking and alcohol drinking as well. People shouldn’t be allowed to buy cigarettes or alcohol until they are at least 22 or 23.

Illegal drugs do nothing but waste the brain away and cause family and societal problems. Not only that but they cause health problems in the one who is abusing such drugs as well. We do not need such drugs to be decriminalized or legalized!
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Actually the decriminalization and tolleration of marijuana has led less drug usage across the Netherlands. That and the fact that it’s a lot less harmful than most drugs including alcohol.
 
Holly you are right. There are some people who can use drugs and never do anything wrong. The problem comes when you balance the costs of keeping it illegal and the costs of legalizing (with additional need to cover the increased use) and in effect encouraging what has been illegal to be now “ok” with society. I say it gets worse with the “decriminalization” (which is one step away from legalizing) or taking the sanctions off. The pro legalization folks have yet to make the case for the improving of the situation. The Len Bias and John Belushi examples show that the personal use argument (“Im staying in my own home and using so its ok”) is faulty. Its the availability of the drug…and even though it didnt keep those 2 from using, there are plenty who dont use because its illegal, and…what does it say when you tell them its ok to take it outside because its legal now?? You want someone working or driving when they have taken drugs??..imagine Len Bias outside and on drugs… You want an increased amount of driving while on drugs?, because if its legal to possess, you will have more use OUT of the home.
Catch em
Charge em
Offer treatment and rehab
Probation
Heavy fine
If busted…back to the slammer
NO LEGALIZATION
 
d97c said:
Len Bias---------RIP !!!
Len Bias was a former University of Maryland basketball player who died from cardiac arrest attributed to cocaine use just two days after the Boston Celtics drafted him with the No. 2 overall pick in the 1986 NBA Draft. After spending the day of June 18, 1986, in Boston, meeting with Celtics officials and signing a multiyear shoe contract with Reebok, Bias flew home and spent some time at his family’s house in Landover. He then went to his College Park dorm room, where he hung out with some teammates and other friends. He briefly left campus and returned to his dorm room at around 3 a.m. At some point in the night, Bias used cocaine. He collapsed and went into convulsions at around 6:30 a.m…
and-----------------------------
drugabuse.gov/DrugPages/marijuana.html
casacolumbia.org/absolutenm/templates/OpEds.aspx?articleid=223&zoneid=29
casacolumbia.org/absolutenm/templates/OpEds.aspx?articleid=220&zoneid=29
and---------------------------------------------------
HERE’S A GUY WHO USED IT FOR HIS OWN PERSONAL USE----------RIP !!!
"On March 5, 1982, John Belushi was found dead in his room at Bungalow #3 of the Chateau Marmont on Sunset Boulevard in Los Angeles, California.[8] The cause of death was a speedball, a combined injection of cocaine and heroin. On the night of his death, he was visited separately by friends Robin Williams (at the height of his own drug exploits)[9] and Robert De Niro,[10] each of whom left the premises, leaving Belushi in the company of assorted others, including Cathy Smith. His death was investigated by forensic pathologist Dr. Ryan Norris among others, and it was officially ruled a drug-related accident.

Two months later, Smith admitted in an interview with the National Enquirer that she had been with Belushi the night of his death and had given him the fatal speedball shot. After the appearance of the article “I Killed Belushi” in the Enquirer edition of June 29, 1982, the case was reopened. Smith was extradited from Toronto, arrested and charged with first-degree murder. A plea bargain arrangement reduced the charges to involuntary manslaughter, and she served 15 months in prison[11].

So you stoners on here have fun…light up…but beeeeeeee careful !
Click to expand...
edwest2 said:
Effects of illegal drug use:

justice.gov/dea/demand/speakout/03so.htm

Peace,
Ed
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edwest2 said:
I hope the following helps to answer other questions and the costs issues related to enforcement, legalization and treatment:

justice.gov/dea/demand/speakout/05so.htm

Peace,
Ed
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d97c said:
Holly you are right. There are some people who can use drugs and never do anything wrong. The problem comes when you balance the costs of keeping it illegal and the costs of legalizing (with additional need to cover the increased use) and in effect encouraging what has been illegal to be now “ok” with society. I say it gets worse with the “decriminalization” (which is one step away from legalizing) or taking the sanctions off. The pro legalization folks have yet to make the case for the improving of the situation. The Len Bias and John Belushi examples show that the personal use argument (“Im staying in my own home and using so its ok”) is faulty. Its the availability of the drug…and even though it didnt keep those 2 from using, there are plenty who dont use because its illegal, and…what does it say when you tell them its ok to take it outside because its legal now?? You want someone working or driving when they have taken drugs??..imagine Len Bias outside and on drugs… You want an increased amount of driving while on drugs?, because if its legal to possess, you will have more use OUT of the home.
Catch em
Charge em
Offer treatment and rehab
Probation
Heavy fine
If busted…back to the slammer
NO LEGALIZATION
Click to expand...
All that occurred under the drugs illegal scenario! We made many drugs illegal to stop these problems, so it simply did not work. Today it is about the desire of some to be in control not about drug use. Drug use is not created nor stopped by congress. Spend a little, spend a lot, it has no substantial affect. Jail a few, jail many, it has no substantial affect. How many need to do jail time? (remember you can get a legal version from your doctor).
 
U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration

You will never convince me that drugs should be legalized and/or regulated for use among the populace. I am an IT contractor with DEA Headquarters in Arlington, VA. There is a brutal side to drugs that has nothing to do with money, corruption, or violence, and even when it comes down to that, I have access to information that most people here do not. Drugs are a lifestyle that should never be allowed to stand. (and that has nothing to do with religion)
 
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