Definition of Sloth?

[Akimos]

How does the church define physical and spiritual sloth?

Would doing something all-day actively (eg: Video Games ) be considered sloth?

 

[jegow]

How does the church define physical and spiritual sloth?

Would doing something all-day actively (eg: Video Games ) be considered sloth?

One of my favorite things, video games. For someone who really enjoys gaming, when I get the time, I can say yes, if you game all day it is considered a form of sloth. Why? Well … because there are greater things to be done in one’s life than play games. As enjoyable as the prospect is of being in front of my Xbox for a whole day I know I would carry guilt for not praying that day, for not reading a bit, for not taking care of myself by working out and so on. Doing something like gaming all day would be us putting our wants at highest priority and not God’s - God does not intend us to be gaming 24/7 … if he ever does, I’ll be the first person to let you know. I have tons of games that need finishing!

This could also be compared to slothfulness when a person decides they are going to sleep all day. Sleep is good - but it is not meant for a person to stay at it for 24 hours. All things in moderation. There always needs to be a balance. In one way to keep our spiritual life in check and the other to keep our own wants and desires for gaming or sleep or whatever to never get so out of hand that they infringe upon our desire to be holy people.

Hope that helps.

 

[LilyM]

For some people ‘playing games all day’ is in fact a livelihood and source of income. If you’re a reviewer for the media, or someone who is paid to test or design games for example.

The question is - what are your other duties and obligations, and is the gameplaying interfering with any of it?

Is other work or study not being done (or done half-heartedly rather than to the best of your abilities)?
Is housework not being done? Or personal grooming (had to mention it - it tends to be one of the first things that slides for the serious computer addict)?
Are you spending plenty of time in prayer? Spending some of that spare time in charity or volunteer work? We have obligations to God and neighbour, y’know.
Is your social life suffering (and no, playing games with other game players is NOT having a social life )?
Are you getting enough fresh air, sleep and exercise, eating enough and eating healthy?
Are you seeing plenty of your family and friends, and doing plenty of recreational activities other than gaming?

If all these other needs are being met, then the occasional day of gaming is fine.

 

[Joe_Kelley]

For Spiritual Sloth, I use a definition from the Baltimore Catechism

SLOTH - Distaste for spiritual things because their attainment requires too much labor. It is opposed to the virtue of charity. It is the source of failure to perform works of piety and mercy.

 

[Akimos]

I see personal grooming as a low priority anyway…XP

Basically, very basically, as long as you don’t spend all day?

Give up some time to excersise, prayer and whatnot?

For a nolife session, I mean.

 

[LilyM]

I see personal grooming as a low priority anyway…XP

Basically, very basically, as long as you don’t spend all day?

Give up some time to excersise, prayer and whatnot?

For a nolife session, I mean.

‘Give up some time to exercise, prayer and whatnot’? No way. Your other tasks are your priorities, and your gaming is the distraction and diversion, not the headline or feature activity of your day or your life. You should be focusing on doing all the other stuff and then ‘giving up some time’ to gaming, not the other way around.

Let’s assume that you’re between 16 and 65, for example, and not a stay-at-home parent. In such a case your first priority is paid work, study and/or job hunting. So you’ll need to be spending a minimum 8 hours a day five days a week on one or some combination of these.

After you do that, then think of all the other things that need doing (shower daily, household chores, exercise three days a week at least, sleeping 6 or 7 hours every day, an hour or so of prayer daily, etc etc). THEN prioritise real-life face-to-face contact with other people - family and friends. Devote at least as much time to it as you do to solitary recreations.

Then, and only then, think about how much time you have left over and maybe ‘give some of it up’ to your gaming. But have other hobbies for your solo time as well - and spend at least as much time on them as you do on your gaming.

It’s all about balance, variety and priorities, dude.

 

[Akimos]

I see what you’re getting at, and of course you’d need to devote time to studies and/or work. I mainly mean while on holiday, though.

Also, I don’t see myself as a very social person…Socializing is rather very hard for me, and i’d rather fufill obligations to my neighbour from “behind the scenes”, if you get what I mean…Donating to charity and prayer.

 

[LilyM]

I see what you’re getting at, and of course you’d need to devote time to studies and/or work. I mainly mean while on holiday, though.

Also, I don’t see myself as a very social person…Socializing is rather very hard for me, and i’d rather fufill obligations to my neighbour from “behind the scenes”, if you get what I mean…Donating to charity and prayer.

Again, even if you’re on holiday I’d be loath to spend all or the majority of my time in front of the video games. Not good for the mind or the body (or anything else, really). Make sure you spend an equal amount of time or more doing other things, outdoors if possible.

Now I’m not a particularly sociable creature myself, but when God said in Genesis ‘it is not good for the man to be alone’ I think He meant it.

Of course I need to draw a distinction here. On the one hand there’s ‘I feel a bit uncomfortable in social situations’ and on the other hand there’s ‘I sweat, have palpitations and nearly pass out at the idea of having to make small talk with people.’ And if it’s that extreme, it can hinder you in all sorts of ways (for example it can seriously hamper success at work), but can also be treated under the care of a psychologist.

One thing that I find helpful is to focus on practical works of mercy. Being in the legal field, for example, a few weeks ago I helped give a workshop to a group of homeless young people about their legal rights (for example, if police want to search or arrest them or something).

That was good for me because I had a practical task to focus on and something to do, and it was an area of law that I knew a reasonable amount about and so I was not too far out of my comfort zone. At the same time, some of the kids (and adults) I talked to were amazing and inspiring, and I really ended up enjoying it.

God calls on us to give of whatever gifts we have. Money is a gift, and its a good thing to give generously when you can. But so are our time and our abilities - and we shouldn’t squander those either.

Think about your abilities and resources - we all have something, and can do something. If you can cook, volunteer for a soup kitchen, if you can type, offer to help with the admin work at your parish. If you can do account books, help out at your local St Vincent de Paul shop. If you have computer skills, maybe volunteer to set up or maintain someone’s web page or something.

Heck, just having a drivers’ licence and/or car is something - help out with Meals on Wheels, take Holy Communion to the housebound on Sundays, that sort of thing.

 

[Akimos]

I understand your point of view, but is there anything in the catechism that reflects wha you’re saying?

Should I ask my priest?

I presumed that nolifing all day was bad, but doing heaps of different things each day all the time…x_X

 

[LilyM]

I understand your point of view, but is there anything in the catechism that reflects wha you’re saying?

Should I ask my priest?

I presumed that nolifing all day was bad, but doing heaps of different things each day all the time…x_X

I don’t think it requires consultation with a priest.

And I would heartily endorse ‘doing heaps of different things all day’ during your holidays - as long as ‘heaps of different things’ doesn’t mean ‘heaps of different video games/tv shows/assorted ways of sitting around on my butt in front of a screen’.

There’s a relevant precept of the Church mentioned in the Catechism:

"2043 … The fifth precept (“You shall help to provide for the needs of the Church”) means that the faithful are obliged to assist with the material needs of the Church, each according to his own ability.

The faithful also have the duty of providing for the material needs of the Church, each according to his own abilities."

Now ‘abilities’ here can and obviously does also mean ‘resources’ - after all, money isn’t an ability, but if we have a goodly amount of it we are obliged to give some to support the Church. In the same way, your time is a resource, and you obviously have more of it than you need to do your own tasks - so are obliged to give some of it to help support the Church.

Mind you, ‘Church’ in this paragraph isn’t just the bodies filling the pews either - it is the Body of Christ, meaning all humanity. Hence Jesus telling us to help our neighbour in the story of the Good Samaritan and telling us to do corporal works of mercy because ‘what you do to the least of these, you do to Me’. So doing charitable work would count as well, even if it’s not directly related to your local parish.

 

[rayne89]

I understand your point of view, but is there anything in the catechism that reflects wha you’re saying?

Should I ask my priest?

I presumed that nolifing all day was bad, but doing heaps of different things each day all the time…x_X

There isn’t anything in the Catechism that reflects what Lily is saying because she’s giving her opinion. It is her opinion that playing video games, watching TV ect is not a good way to spend a vacation. That is a personal opinion. As long as your leisure activities do not hinder your responsibilities -religious & secular and they are not sinful themselves (such as watch pornography, visiting strip clubs, drag racing on public streets -some examples) how you spend your leisure time is up to you.

 

[Akimos]

Hm, I didn’t pick up on that…

Well, I’ll consult my priest when I go to confession this weekend and ask him some more specific questions.

Thanks everyone, Lily especially (Even if you’re biased against games…)

 

[LilyM]

There isn’t anything in the Catechism that reflects what Lily is saying because she’s giving her opinion. It is her opinion that playing video games, watching TV ect is not a good way to spend a vacation. That is a personal opinion. As long as your leisure activities do not hinder your responsibilities -religious & secular and they are not sinful themselves (such as watch pornography, visiting strip clubs, drag racing on public streets -some examples) how you spend your leisure time is up to you.

It’s not personal opinion, nor bias. I spend an awful lot of time on the computer, so I know whereof I speak and am not biased against it in any fashion. Rather I speak as an alcoholic who knows the dangers of drinking would in counselling other alcoholics.

Doing things that are harmful to your mental and physical health (and playing games for hours on end is indisputably both, as any health care professional can tell you) means you are failing in your moral duty to take care of your God-given body and brain. Not for nothing is your body called the temple of the Holy Spirit. What sort of temple do you want it to be? A solid, well-constructed one that can withstand any weather? Or not?

Remember the parable of the talents? We’ve got to use our time and other resources constructively and profitably, to build up the Kingdom. And not just hide them under a rock and neglect them and let them go to waste. This is not my personal opinion or bias, it’s teaching from Christ’s own lips.

Just ask yourself - what kind of servant are you being when you fritter away huge slabs of time (God’s time, His gift given to you to use for His greater glory and not just your own pleasure) sitting on your butt playing games?

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

How does the church define physical and spiritual sloth?

Would doing something all-day actively (eg: Video Games ) be considered sloth?

Only when you were supposed to be doing something else… like let’s say, homework? (mentally kicks himself reaaaal hard)

That and when you start looking like a zombie from the lack of sleep… but then again, isn’t that more of overindulgence a.k.a. gluttony?

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

Is your social life suffering (and no, playing games with other game players is NOT having a social life )?

Yes it is! (If you meet 'em in real life and they’re your buddies offline and online. Trust me I hang with a mix of both gamers and pseudo-socialites. Between either of the two halves, I feel myself more at home with kindred spirits. )

 

[LilyM]

Yes it is! (If you meet 'em in real life and they’re your buddies offline and online. Trust me I hang with a mix of both gamers and pseudo-socialites. Between either of the two halves, I feel myself more at home with kindred spirits. )

I said playing games with other gamers. If, as seems you do, meet fellow gamers in real life and do things with them other than gaming, as seems you do, then it’s a different kettle of fish.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

I said playing games with other gamers. If, as seems you do, meet fellow gamers in real life and do things with them other than gaming, as seems you do, then it’s a different kettle of fish.

Ah I see. I was sorta confused when you said “playing with other gamers”.

The thing is, online games aren’t the only ones gamers play. There are those that require you to actually meet fellow players (or at least reduce the need for internet). Take games that require a LAN connection or make use of the PSP Adhoc system. During my time as a net cafe owner, I’ve hard entire gangs of gamers come over and they got as much a bond between themselves as any other type of posse.

It really depends on what crowd you’re into. Computer/video games have as much chance of bringing friends together as other hobbies/sports (e.g. basketball, skateboarding, billiards, comic books, card collecting etc).

 

[Akimos]

I wish. Not in my neck of the woods, where everyone’s a sports jock. Those few that are gamers play stuff more like Mw2, Kz, Halo, ect, and I get the short end of the proverbial stick in group decisions and stuff.

But, hey. At least I’m not living in some place where gaming is taboo (though I’m not far off )