Denial of Purgatory

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Is the denial of purgatory heretical?

If a Catholic denies this doctrine should he be considered a heretic?
 
RJames said:
Is the denial of purgatory heretical?

If a Catholic denies this doctrine should he be considered a heretic?
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Well, by denying a teaching of the Church, does one automatically become a heretic?

What do you think?🙂
 
from webster online.

1: a dissenter from established religious dogma ; especially : a baptized member of the Roman Catholic Church who disavows a revealed truth

So if Purgatory is a revealed truth, which it is, and someone disavows it, then yes, by its very definition they would be a heretic. Purgatory isn’t a little “t” tradition, especially because it’s implicitly referred to in the Bible. 👍 HTH
 
RJames said:
Why do you rephrase the questions? I was specific and you made it general. Here’s the questions once again:
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CCC 2089 Incredulity is the neglect of revealed truth or the willful refusal to assent to it. "Heresy is the obstinate post-baptismal denial of some truth which must be believed with divine and catholic faith, or it is likewise an obstinate doubt concerning the same; apostasy is the total repudiation of the Christian faith; schism is the refusal of submission to the Roman Pontiff or of communion with the members of the Church subject to him."
 
thistle said:
CCC 2089 Incredulity is the neglect of revealed truth or the willful refusal to assent to it. "Heresy is the obstinate post-baptismal denial of some truth which must be believed with divine and catholic faith, or it is likewise an obstinate doubt concerning the same; apostasy is the total repudiation of the Christian faith; schism is the refusal of submission to the Roman Pontiff or of communion with the members of the Church subject to him."
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So a heretic is an obstinate denier OR positive doubter. So the positive doubter is also a heretic.

Does this apply to every Catholic?
 
1edyson said:
from webster online.

1: a dissenter from established religious dogma ; especially : a baptized member of the Roman Catholic Church who disavows a revealed truth

So if Purgatory is a revealed truth, which it is, and someone disavows it, then yes, by its very definition they would be a heretic. Purgatory isn’t a little “t” tradition, especially because it’s implicitly referred to in the Bible. 👍 HTH
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How do you know purgatory is a dogma of the Church?
 
RJames said:
How do you know purgatory is a dogma of the Church?
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Quote=RJames
Does this apply to every Catholic?
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Yes --it applies to every Catholic.

newadvent.org/cathen/12575a.htm

Purgatory

Catholic doctrine

Purgatory (Lat., “purgare”, to make clean, to purify) in accordance with Catholic teaching is a place or condition of temporal punishment for those who, departing this life in God’s grace, are, not entirely free from venial faults, or have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions.

The faith of the Church concerning purgatory is clearly expressed in the Decree of Union drawn up by the Council of Florence (Mansi, t. XXXI, col. 1031), and in the decree of the Council of Trent which (Sess. XXV) defined:
"Whereas the Catholic Church, instructed by the Holy Ghost, has from the Sacred Scriptures and the ancient tradition of the Fathers taught in Councils and very recently in this Ecumenical synod (Sess. VI, cap. XXX; Sess. XXII cap.ii, iii) **that there is a purgatory, and that the souls therein are helped by the suffrages of the faithful, but principally by the acceptable Sacrifice of the Altar; the Holy Synod enjoins on the Bishops that they diligently endeavor to have the sound doctrine of the Fathers in Councils regarding purgatory everywhere taught and preached, held and believed by the faithful" **(Denzinger, "Enchiridon", 983).
 
Walking_Home said:
Yes --it applies to every Catholic.

newadvent.org/cathen/12575a.htm

Purgatory

Catholic doctrine

Purgatory (Lat., “purgare”, to make clean, to purify) in accordance with Catholic teaching is a place or condition of temporal punishment for those who, departing this life in God’s grace, are, not entirely free from venial faults, or have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions.

The faith of the Church concerning purgatory is clearly expressed in the Decree of Union drawn up by the Council of Florence (Mansi, t. XXXI, col. 1031), and in the decree of the Council of Trent which (Sess. XXV) defined:
Code: 
"Whereas the Catholic Church, instructed by the Holy Ghost, has from the Sacred Scriptures and the ancient tradition of the Fathers taught in Councils and very recently in this Ecumenical synod (Sess. VI, cap. XXX; Sess. XXII cap.ii, iii) **that there is a purgatory, and that the souls therein are helped by the suffrages of the faithful, but principally by the acceptable Sacrifice of the Altar; the Holy Synod enjoins on the Bishops that they diligently endeavor to have the sound doctrine of the Fathers in Councils regarding purgatory everywhere taught and preached, held and believed by the faithful" **(Denzinger, "Enchiridon", 983).
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So a parish priest, who eithers denies or positively doubts the Catholic doctrine of purgatory, is a heretic and should be cast out by his parishoners if their Bishop will not remove him.
 
RJames said:
So a parish priest, who eithers denies or positively doubts the Catholic doctrine of purgatory, is a heretic and should be cast out by his parishoners if their Bishop will not remove him.
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If a parish priest is leading souls into danger --and the bishop has been notified and will not act to correct the situation–the parishoners have the right to make this known to higher authority–Rome.
 
Walking_Home said:
If a parish priest is leading souls into danger --and the bishop has been notified and will not act to correct the situation–the parishoners have the right to make this known to higher authority–Rome.
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That is certainly their right, but what is their duty?

Also, a priest preaching a doubt of purgatory is certainly leading souls into error, that is obvious.
 
RJames said:
That is certainly their right, but what is their duty?

Also, a priest preaching a doubt of purgatory is certainly leading souls into error, that is obvious.
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For the good of the souls --I believe it would be the parishioners duty to make the situation known to Rome.
 
IMHO, the doctrine of Purgatory seems a no-brainer. Scripture tells us that no-one can see God unless he is sinless/spotless. Since I know that I am certainly not sinless and will assuredly not be perfect in this earthly life, the alternative to a place/state of purgation is Hell. Doesn’t make sense to me, since I don’t know of anyone that is spotless 🤷 . And since Scripture also tells us that we will be purified as by fire, 😉
 
RJames said:
And if it takes years? You just allow heresy to be preached?
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What would you recommend as an alternative? You can’t really take the law into your own hands, drive him from the Church and select a new Priest can you?

Of course not. The only possible path of action is to let his superiors know in no uncertain terns exactly what is going on.
 
palmas85 said:
What would you recommend as an alternative? You can’t really take the law into your own hands, drive him from the Church and select a new Priest can you?

Of course not. The only possible path of action is to let his superiors know in no uncertain terns exactly what is going on.
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Maybe --along with notifying higher authority – the word that purgatory is Church doctrine to held --could in some way be passed along to the parishioners.
 
Walking_Home said:
Maybe --along with notifying higher authority – the word that purgatory is Church doctrine to held --could in some way be passed along to the parishioners.
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I’ve read in other threads, that one could possible catch the priest preaching heresy by taping his homilies.

Certainly you could be proactive and perhaps help out with the printing of the Church bulletins, and writing a theology section yourself. How could a priest complain if you are helping out? What problem could he have with the printing of sections from the catechism?
 
palmas85 said:
What would you recommend as an alternative? You can’t really take the law into your own hands, drive him from the Church and select a new Priest can you?

Of course not. The only possible path of action is to let his superiors know in no uncertain terns exactly what is going on.
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I think you are underestimating the gravity of the sin of heresy and the gravity of the public crime of heresy. Why can’t the faithful cast out a heretic and then wait for his replacement?

The real tragedy here is the inaction of those in charge. I guess one can move to a different parish, but what about the others left behind?
 
Walking_Home said:
If a parish priest is leading souls into danger --and the bishop has been notified and will not act to correct the situation–the parishoners have the right to make this known to higher authority–Rome.
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I believe the correct method is the one the Bible gives - approach the priest FIRST. Talk to him, and try your best to show him the Truth. It may be he is simply doubting the “fire” portion of the Latin teaching on Purgatory - which is perfectly fine. Find out exactly what it is about the doctrine that he is doubting. There is a portion about the Latin teaching on Purgatory that is dogmatized. However, there is also a portion that is NOT dogmatized - it is OK to doubt this latter part.

Whatever the case, be more discerning, and judge with right judgment.

Blessings,
Marduk
 
mardukm said:
I believe the correct method is the one the Bible gives - approach the priest FIRST. Talk to him, and try your best to show him the Truth. **It may be he is simply doubting the “fire” portion of the Latin teaching on Purgatory - which is perfectly fine. ** Find out exactly what it is about the doctrine that he is doubting. There is a portion about the Latin teaching on Purgatory that is dogmatized. However, there is also a portion that is NOT dogmatized - it is OK to doubt this latter part.

Whatever the case, be more discerning, and judge with right judgment.

Blessings,
Marduk
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Why do you think its fine for a Latin priest to doubt a portion of Latin teaching.
 
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