Depressing article about abortion

[deMontfort]

deMontfort:

Oh you could repeat the class in college. In grade school it might mean you have to repeat the entire year.

That is what I was talking about. Unlike “you failed in this life, you go to hell for never ending torture”.

That failed class still goes on your academic record permanently regardless of whether you take the class or not and it still counts against your grade point average. If you go to a school with academic standards then that hit to your GPA could very well be a problem.

 

[Sophia]

That failed class still goes on your academic record permanently regardless of whether you take the class or not and it still counts against your grade point average. If you go to a school with academic standards then that hit to your GPA could very well be a problem.

Different countries have different ways to deal with this type of question. But, be as it may a failed test / exam / class do not result in eternal damnation. This kind of “one strike and you are out” is the brainchild of some psychopath.

 

[Pup7]

Different countries have different ways to deal with this type of question. But, be as it may a failed test / exam / class do not result in eternal damnation. This kind of “one strike and you are out” is the brainchild of some psychopath.

In the US, it certainly can. It can keep people out of certain graduate and even undergraduate programs that require a minimum GPA. And as we pay out of pocket to go to school here, most people cannot afford to keep taking classes to increase their grade point average.

I’m only about three or four years younger than deMontfort. I have nieces in college as we speak. This stuff hasn’t changed here - it still works this way.

 

[Sophia]

It can keep people out of certain graduate and even undergraduate programs that require a minimum GPA.

The way the US organizes the higher education is a not general across the world. And besides, why do you draw a parallel between not being allowed in certain level of education and eternal torture?

 

[Pup7]

Pup7:

It can keep people out of certain graduate and even undergraduate programs that require a minimum GPA.

The way the US organizes the higher education is a not general across the world. And besides, why do you draw a parallel between not being allowed in certain level of education and eternal torture?

Excuse me?

You did that, not me. Please, feel free to quote where I said what you’re implying.

I said this:

In the US, it certainly can. It can keep people out of certain graduate and even undergraduate programs that require a minimum GPA. And as we pay out of pocket to go to school here, most people cannot afford to keep taking classes to increase their grade point average.

Where did I say “this applies everywhere else”? I didn’t. I’m married to a non-US citizen and am fairly well traveled. I know that higher education isn’t the same everywhere, which is why I specifically said “IN THE US”.

Again, please provide a direct quote where I’ve equated failing a test with eternal torture. I haven’t.

 

[steve-b]

Sorry, he never revealed it to me. Or anyone I know.

Sure He did.

As an example, from a secular source

the historian Josephus, no favor for Christianity, wrote the following.
The year is ~90.
Works of Flavius Josephus

Josephus talks about the Jesus who was crucified.

From “War of the Jews” Bk 2, ch 9
2. Now Pilate, who was sent as procurator into Judea by Tiberius, sent by night those images of Caesar that are called ensigns into Jerusalem. This excited a very among great tumult among the Jews when it was day; for those that were near them were astonished at the sight of them, as indications that their laws were trodden under foot; for those laws do not permit any sort of image to be brought into the city. Nay, besides the indignation which the citizens had themselves at this procedure, a vast number of people came running out of the country. These came zealously to Pilate to Cesarea, and besought him to carry those ensigns out of Jerusalem, and to preserve them their ancient laws inviolable; but upon Pilate’s denial of their request, they fell (9) down prostrate upon the ground, and continued immovable in that posture for five days and as many nights.

Footnote 9
(9) We have here, in that Greek MS. which was once Alexander Petavius’s, but is now in the library at Leyden, two most remarkable additions to the common copies, though declared worth little remark by the editor; which, upon the mention of Tiberius’s coming to the empire, inserts first the famous testimony of Josephus concerning Jesus Christ, as it stands verbatim in the Antiquities, B. XVIII. ch. 3. sect. 3, with some parts of that excellent discourse or homily of Josephus concerning Hades, annexed to the work. But what is here principally to be noted is this, that in this homily, Josephus having just mentioned Christ, as “God the Word, and the Judge of the world, appointed by the Father,” etc., adds, that "he had himself elsewhere spoken about him more nicely or particularly.

From "Antiquities" Bk XVIIII, ch 3 sect 3

1. Now there was about this time Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man; for he was a doer of wonderful works, a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews and many of the Gentiles. He was [the] Christ. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, (9) those that loved him at the first did not forsake him; for he appeared to them alive again the third day; (10) as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him. And the tribe of Christians, so named from him, are not extinct at this day.

Footnotes:
9. A.D. 33, April 3.
10. April 5.

Other references in Josephus

That’s an example from a secular source.

to be cont.

 

[Sophia]

You did that, not me. Please, feel free to quote where I said what you’re implying.

I guess there was a misunderstanding. I was reflecting on the idea that God practices the “one strike and you are out” by closing the “book” at the time of death. I compared it to the idea that it is cruel not to give a second chance if one fails an exam, and I was astonished that this is practiced in the US. Now it became clear that the failing student is allowed to repeat the class if necessary. This is still very “unloving”, but not as bad as the eternal torture for just one irrelevant but “mortal” sin. Sorry, I did not realize that you were a latecomer.

 

[Sophia]

Sure He did.

None of that is an evidence for the alleged miracles performed by Jesus. And if the quote is genuine (which is doubtful, many analysts consider it a later addition), it was still not relevant to the heaven/hell dichotomy.

You are under the impression that the Bible is some kind of an authority. It is not.

 

[steve-b]

(continued)

steve-b:

If Heaven and Hell didn’t exist, or if there was no Hell just heaven, then there would be no need for judgement final or interim, if everyone goes to heaven or if everyone just dies…

Yep. That is how a loving person would organize the “afterlife”.

steve-b:

No one is more loving than God. No one.

Here’s how Jesus defined love for Him. It’s put in the form of a conditional statement.

John 14:15 Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition (RSVCE)
15 “If you love me, you will keep my commandments.

How many people actually do that ?

Re: the prodigal son story.
Did the Father love the prodigal son even though that son left? Yes
But until that son turned from his current life and return to his father, full of remorse, what did his father say?

Lk 15:
" 24 for this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found.’ And they began to make merry."

the father said to his other son

Lk 15:
32 It was fitting to make merry and be glad, for this your brother was dead, and is alive; he was lost, and is found.

Who told the story? Jesus. The one who sacrificed Himself for us so we “could” be saved. Saved from What? Hell. But to benefit from Jesus work, we have to do things His way.

 

[steve-b]

steve-b:

Sure He did.

None of that is an evidence for the alleged miracles performed by Jesus. And if the quote is genuine (which is doubtful, many analysts consider it a later addition), it was still not relevant to the heaven/hell dichotomy.

You are under the impression that the Bible is some kind of an authority. It is not.

Sophia

As Augustine wrote
Ignorance of scripture is ignorance of God.

Aquinas wrote (paraphrased)
for one who has faith no explanation is necessary, for one without faith no explanation is sufficient

 

[OsculeturMeOsculo]

Actually people are dumb and obstinate enough to choose hell and reject God.

 

[steve-b]

steve-b:

Sure He did.

None of that is an evidence for the alleged miracles performed by Jesus.

To that specific point, Josephus connected Jesus death with His resurrection from the dead 3 days later.

How did you miss

"He was [the] Christ. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, (9) those that loved him at the first did not forsake him; for he appeared to them alive again the third day; (10) as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him. And the tribe of Christians, so named from him, are not extinct at this day.

Footnotes:
9. A.D. 33, April 3.
10. April 5.