Depression

[pabloSD]

Dear Brothers and Sisters,

I’ve been on medication for depression and anxiety for more than a year, but I know that I’ve suffered from these conditions since I was a little boy. Many factors have contributed to this, including sexual molestation, an overprotective mother, and low self-esteem.

I’ve seen many people in my life who have had it even rougher than myself, but when they joined a Protestant “Christian church,” they usually have a new life, they are born-again, sort-of-speak.

How could I learn Catholic spiritual “techniques” to help me overcome depression and anxiety? I hardly can concentrate when praying these days. Economic, family problems, have made my conditions even worse. And I’m afraid I will lose my wife and two children because I’m always numbed with all the medications I take.

I know I don’t have to leave the Church to find peace. In fact, I know that Our Lord’s peace is within the Church. I experience that when I have Communion.

Do you have any advice for me?
Thanks.
En Cristo,
Pablo

 

[vsedriver]

Focus on doing for others instead of worrying about yourself. Pick the chore your wife hates the most and do it for her. Play with your children every chance you get. Reflect on the joys God has given you and not what you don’t have. Be grateful for the little things in life.

You are a lucky man to have a wife and children. Hasn’t God provided for you? Trust that he will continue to provide for your needs.

 

[Oren]

I have struggled with depression and anxiety for my whole life. I became Catholic in 2003. The two did not mix. At least in my case. In fact, it seemed to exacerbate the problem. I would have more anxiety because of feeling guilty about sins and since I was depressed I couldn’t cope with it in a healthy way.
But, for a year now, everything has completely turned around. I’m completely off my medication. There are a couple of reasons for that.
I always thought that my depression was chemical and that I couldn’t control it without medication because I’ve had it at least since the third grade and it has been so severe. But, since I’ve been stable for a whole year without antidepressants, I’ve had to rethink that. I think it was due to an unstable environment growing up, parental abandonment and emotional neglect. Once I stopped holding a grudge about that, it’s hold over my life has disappeared, and the depression with it.
I thought there would be a magic change instantly when I became Catholic. The problem was, I was attached to sin and I didn’t have enough trust in God. I wouldn’t get out of his way or even my own. The most important thing you can do is give up sin and pray with as much trust in God as you can.
Other important things:
I started taking thyroid medication. Now, I don’t know if there are any underlying physical issues that are contributing to your depression, but you should definitely be aware of the huge role that it can play and if there are any issues then you should get them resolved immediately.
I started exercising and stopped eating gluttonously. I’m trying to get away from being lazy and sitting around a lot too.
I tried really hard to put my family before myself in things like doing chores and treating them kinder.
I got a dog and that helped me just by getting out and taking her for a walk every day, taking care of her, playing with her, having companionship.

If you are numb from your meds…consider all your options. Try different kinds…ultimately try to get off them if it’s possible. Are you in therapy? Therapy never worked for me, but for some people it can really help. Try to get a spiritual director.

I don’t know if there are any ‘techniques’. I had to hit rock bottom for all this great stuff to happen for me. But…practicing the presence of God, consoling the heart of Jesus and meditating on scripture have all given me peace and joy since I hit that bottom. Do all you can to get to know Jesus more and be his friend.

If you want to talk just pm me.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

How could I learn Catholic spiritual “techniques” to help me overcome depression and anxiety? I hardly can concentrate when praying these days. Economic, family problems, have made my conditions even worse. And I’m afraid I will lose my wife and two children because I’m always numbed with all the medications I take.

I know I don’t have to leave the Church to find peace. In fact, I know that Our Lord’s peace is within the Church. I experience that when I have Communion.

I like your questions. To me, a church that cannot help you with things like this are of questionable value. It’s nice to go around thinking we’re going to heaven after we die, but if it can’t make our lives better in the here and now then IMO what good is it?

As a former sufferer of severe bipolar disorder, I am no stranger to depression. But now it’s gone. I have none now, and no mania.

The “spiritual journey” I’ve been on the last 10 years has done everything to change me, and the Lord has healed me of the “disease.” (I’m convinced it was spiritual, emotional, and social – not some physical or chemical issues with my mind.) And I’m talking about healing; solving my “mental software” issue to the point it’s all good now – not just symptoms under control like medicine can do. The Divine Therapist (aka Holy Spirit) can bring true healing.

The typical route is to get going on your own personal “dark night of the soul,” (St. John of the Cross stuff) preferably under guidance by a spiritual director but always under the guidance of the Holy Spirit whether one realizes it or not. It is a way to become purified while still on this earth; basically getting a good chunk of “purgation” out of the way. Also, contemplative prayer forms helped me, not just the forms themselves but lectures about them and about the spiritual journey. (CCC 2700-2724)

Basically by the time we are 7 years old we have formed a persistent “false self” that will be the bushel over our light for the rest of our lives. The spiritual journey is basically an exercise to go through allowing the false self to collapse (the “self” the Jesus says we must deny) and the true self to emerge. This is roughly correlated to a lot of things, in my own experience and opinion. Such as, entering Christ’s kingdom (now, not heaven after we die), being born of the spirit, moving on the the “second half” of life as one SD calls it, becoming spiritually mature, climbing to the top of the mountain, etc.

As you mature spiritually, you will start to bear fruit, and that fruit will annihilate your depression:

Gal 5:22-23
In contrast, the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.

Oh yeah, did I mention getting a “spiritual director?” That’s a good thing, but really good ones can be hard to find.

Alan

 

[triumphguy]

Self esteem issues, issues due to being sexually abused and depression are all different.

I can tell from reading your post that you are fully aware that Clinical depression can be helped by the right medication, and diet and exercise help too.

Psychological issues may need to be worked through in counselling, and healing will probably be required - which is where the Church (our Church) can come in - the Sacrament of Reconciliation may help a great deal, as can spiritual counselling.

Self esteem is in a way the easiest to deal with: to raise your self esteem you need to achieve things, and raise your belief in yourself. Helping others is a good way to start actually, as was mentioned by another poster. Working in a garden, or with animals can help too.

Don’t be too convinced by the Born Again enthusiasm. Healing takes work - and that work brings it’s own little miracles too.

I did get married and have kids, and a successful career in teaching, but I felt like I had to go through a ten or fifteen year sidetrack to get there.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Don’t be too convinced by the Born Again enthusiasm. Healing takes work - and that work brings it’s own little miracles too.

I’m not sure what you mean by this. Don’t be too convinced by what? Jesus told us we must be born again to enter the kingdom. Is this not something to be achieved, and upon entering the kingdom can we not look forward to great psychological healing? If you don’t think so, then I invite you to continue and/or step up your own journey.

John 3:5
Jesus answered, “Amen, amen, I say to you, no one can enter the kingdom of God without being born of water and Spirit."

Healing often does take much work, but that is up to the Spirit to decide in terms of His strategy. Sometimes a single experience – not necessarily a positive one – can do more to change me than much work over a long time would have done by itself. Also how much work it takes is highly individual and is based on many things such as our circumstances and how thick our “skulls” are. Don’t expect to be healed with a magic wand or something, but the healing itself is a gift and not an achievement – the work is in preparing yourself to receive the gift.

So to say, “I’ve healed myself” IMO can be boastful and/or presumptuous. To say, “I have received healing,” is less troublesome. We can work all we want for as many years as we want; as long as we understand the healing comes from God, it isn’t like quid pro quo – i.e. “I do this much stuff for that many years and I’m such and such percent healed” – you know, that kind of thing.

A group that was ignored were the sex offenders, and it was the group I worked with the most. Long story short, and missing out lots of details, the inmates that had made my guts twist, and made me want to vomit was the group that helped me heal. And no we didn’t all get airy-fairy with each other - I worked with a psychiatric hospital to develop an effective program based on honesty and trust.

The Truth shall set you free. The peace the world gives is conditional and temporary; the peace Jesus gives is eternal and unconditional. Honesty and trust between people go a long way toward healing – problem is so many of us don’t even know how to be completely honest with ourselves, much less another person, due to how we were brought up. I can see how that could be quite a learning experience.

I did get married and have kids, and a successful career in teaching, but I felt like I had to go through a ten or fifteen year sidetrack to get there.

That’s a good story. I’m glad you got back on track; these things can take quite a bit of time, but once you’re “there” you know it.

Alan

 

[triumphguy]

I’m not sure what you mean by this… Alan

It sounds like Pablo is concerned that he’s concerned that by not joining a Protestant Church he may be missing out “on a new life, they are born-again”

Catholics believe that we are born again in Baptism, not by some spiritual/emotional moment where we are “slain in the spirit,” or “receive Jesus into our hearts.”

I’m saying you don’t need to have the same evangelical style experiences to experience healing in the Catholic Church. We don’t go in for emotionalism in the same way. I saw lots of guys turn to Jesus in jail, but what they were seeking was the instant cure, the quick healing that would mean they did’nt have to do the hard work on themselves, so their “Jesus fix” didn’t stick. I’m saying don’t be convinced that we need that style of experience in order to be healed.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

It sounds like Pablo is concerned that he’s concerned that by not joining a Protestant Church he may be missing out “on a new life, they are born-again”

Catholics believe that we are born again in Baptism, not by some spiritual/emotional moment where we are “slain in the spirit,” or “receive Jesus into our hearts.”

Yeah, it often seems a bit hokey, but I don’t know. I see people “receive Jesus into their hearts” and then remain jerks, so there must be more to it than that. What I have found is that spiritual growth or aha moment (revelation or whatever) can show me a new way to look at things, a new way to approach things, etc. But until I am tested it’s hard to actually see how that is going to pan out. It sounds nice to say, "if a brother does this I’m not going to be angry because blah blah blah … " but when he actually does it, THEN I can try on my new spiritual clothes and see how they work.

I’m saying you don’t need to have the same evangelical style experiences to experience healing in the Catholic Church. We don’t go in for emotionalism in the same way. I saw lots of guys turn to Jesus in jail, but what they were seeking was the instant cure, the quick healing that would mean they did’nt have to do the hard work on themselves, so their “Jesus fix” didn’t stick. I’m saying don’t be convinced that we need that style of experience in order to be healed.

Agreed. I’m not sure what to make of some of these people who have TV “healing” ministries – get a parade of wheelchairs and people are standing up one right after another, having received 10 seconds of spiritual guidance – maybe it’s a nice emotional experience but statistically I don’t see it happening. I don’t know that these men who supposedly bring down the healing are strong enough to bypass the immune systems almost all of us have against spiritual growth.

That said, I did the “slain in the spirit” thing once a long time ago, at a charismatic convention. I wasn’t “into it” much at the time, but it was cool and the bishop said Mass at the end. Really, really bizarre experience for me in particular; I’ve written about it recently. Actually the falling/laying on the floor bit was kind of nice. Nothing magic, but very relaxing.

Alan

 

[Oren]

I like your questions. To me, a church that cannot help you with things like this are of questionable value. It’s nice to go around thinking we’re going to heaven after we die, but if it can’t make our lives better in the here and now then IMO what good is it?

As a former sufferer of severe bipolar disorder, I am no stranger to depression. But now it’s gone. I have none now, and no mania.

The “spiritual journey” I’ve been on the last 10 years has done everything to change me, and the Lord has healed me of the “disease.” (I’m convinced it was spiritual, emotional, and social – not some physical or chemical issues with my mind.) And I’m talking about healing; solving my “mental software” issue to the point it’s all good now – not just symptoms under control like medicine can do. The Divine Therapist (aka Holy Spirit) can bring true healing.

The typical route is to get going on your own personal “dark night of the soul,” (St. John of the Cross stuff) preferably under guidance by a spiritual director but always under the guidance of the Holy Spirit whether one realizes it or not. It is a way to become purified while still on this earth; basically getting a good chunk of “purgation” out of the way. Also, contemplative prayer forms helped me, not just the forms themselves but lectures about them and about the spiritual journey. (CCC 2700-2724)

Basically by the time we are 7 years old we have formed a persistent “false self” that will be the bushel over our light for the rest of our lives. The spiritual journey is basically an exercise to go through allowing the false self to collapse (the “self” the Jesus says we must deny) and the true self to emerge. This is roughly correlated to a lot of things, in my own experience and opinion. Such as, entering Christ’s kingdom (now, not heaven after we die), being born of the spirit, moving on the the “second half” of life as one SD calls it, becoming spiritually mature, climbing to the top of the mountain, etc.

As you mature spiritually, you will start to bear fruit, and that fruit will annihilate your depression:

Gal 5:22-23
In contrast, the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.

Oh yeah, did I mention getting a “spiritual director?” That’s a good thing, but really good ones can be hard to find.

Alan

I can’t agree with you more. Your experience seems a lot like mine, superficially. I’ve been thinking a lot lately that many people’s problem, including my own, is that we believe that we can’t control ourselves. Whether because of chemicals or nature or nurture, we’re taught that we can’t change ourselves. Of course in some cases, that is true, but in cases like yours and mine, we bought into the lie for many years and were freed when we let Jesus in.
Your description of the false self is really profound. Did you learn that from a certain source/sources or did you formulate that yourself after experience?

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Your description of the false self is really profound. Did you learn that from a certain source/sources or did you formulate that yourself after experience?

A lot of it I put together myself from what different people say and from my own experience. But some of the teachings along these lines I’ve had are from sources that some Catholics don’t consider valid. That doesn’t bother me, because I read all the accusations and found this is one way that I believe the enemy keeps us from progressing. There are occasional concerns over what some of these people do that may be valid, but much of it is misrepresentation and misunderstanding. Other than that, it is simply the false self – fortified by years of fear, bribes, and cheap behavior contests in the name of God – that seems to be preventing them from hearing words that could heal them if their false self weren’t in the way of it getting in.

Not surprising though, because I believe that our faith itself, at least the way it is presented to us as children, is responsible for some of the “toughest” parts of our false self. These are the things we have told ourselves we believe with no proof – and we’ve seen inconsistencies and hypocrisy on the part of the lay and even religious to the extent we know they are not practicing what they preach – so we just kind of “store” this information and these hangups with a “do not disturb” sign enforced by the false self and powered by its three energy centers:

1. power/control
2. affection/esteem
3. security/comfort

These things are so important to our false selves, that everything we do, say, and think becomes filtered through these “energy centers” and when our psyche finds out there might be a connection with an energy center, it loves to hook it up. For example, when we were little we didn’t like to answer certain kinds of questions because if we were wrong we’d be made fun of, punished, or otherwise harmed. This directly attacks our affection/esteem fortress and by consequence it can trigger the others as well. So now, even answering our own questions honestly becomes impossible, because of the cloaking device we have deployed over our real feelings, lest they escape and become trampled upon. It is absolutely amazing sometimes when you talk to people who are intelligent and educated, when it comes to certain topics they just CAN-NOT seem to “get it.” This is where hypocrisy builds – we know something is wrong but we have no idea how to get at it. This is where Jesus expended a lot of energy, especially directed at the false selves of the scribes and pharisees.

The problem is that the false self is in effect with everything we do consciously, which is why we dispose ourselves to allowing the Holy Spirit in to repair and/or reinstall our mental operating systems. You know how Jesus said you can’t take over a strong man’s house without first binding the strong man? I see the false self as the strong man, and in order to do/say/think things it doesn’t want, you have to trick it, sneak by it, or overpower it. Good luck over powering it; that’s all I’ll say for now on that. As far as trick it, I’m thinking of some things I’ve done on my own that I have not tried to commit to writing. (I’m putting this together as I go – have lots of thoughts and feelings and ideas but not in verbal form.) As far as sneaking by it, this is where the “dark night” of the soul comes in. Seems to me the soul likes to remain protected by its ego and all, but in the “dark night” the soul is enticed to come out and look for its lover because it seems “quiet” and “safe.” For example, in contemplative prayer, you quit thinking your normal thoughts which your false self normally wants to filter, control, and color a bit before you think them, and allow the Holy Spirit to bypass the sentries at the gates of our mental fortress.

Some have a hard time allowing God to go digging and sweeping around in the much that is our mental/spiritual/emotional trash. Plus they grieve over lost parts of the false self. They have been taught since they were young that you must not let your faults show … but in the dark night they bubble to the surface. Once we decide we can let the Holy Spirit take the steering wheel from us, it gets much easier except for times of second-guessing, which will take place.

It’s like the predicament we’re in when we know we need help cleaning up a mess but we’re too embarrassed, or feel forbidden somehow, to allow someone else to come in a help us – and even do a large portion of the work. This is how it is with the Holy Spirit. We need to sit back and trust. It may tickle and itch a bit, but the pain is going to go away if we can just let Him have at our innermost thoughts and feelings. That part actually does get easier once having seen significant tangible progress. Some people are sustained by faith, but for myself, I like to see some results coming in before I dedicate the rest of my lifestyle to something that makes no sense but others have told me – like much of what others tell me about God. So I can’t say I’m a leader in faith, but I have taken an engineering approach to all this and even taken into considerations such as, “what about periods where I am doubting to the point of feeling agnostic – how do I deal with those periods and keep them from disrupting the growth process?” For me, I believe the Holy Spirit can heal any of us who can predispose ourselves to “hear” his silent groanings – and I don’t even think one has to be a Christian for this to happen. Christianity gives us a way to try to describe what we can do and what to look for when we are doing things that are designed to advance us spiritually. It’s like people say “spiritual but not religious.” To me that is a perfectly valid concept, as I see the whole point of religion is to develop our spirituality, not to replace it.

Alan

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Here are the Stanzas of the Soul, as laid out in the Dark Night of the Soul by St. John-of-the-cross. Every year it makes a little more sense to me and seems just a bit more delicious. When I read them, I feel like my whole psyche is like a young person madly in love with life or another person, and wanting to learn how to show it. It speak of complete trust as the souls offers its very life and sensory experiences to the stillness and peace brought about by being in union with the lover. It shows how the soul kept from its yearning of love will find an escape from its prison (the ego?). That’s my 2 cents anyway – other opinions differ.

Stanzas Of The Soul

1. One dark night,
   fired with love’s urgent longings

• ah, the sheer grace! -
  I went out unseen,
  my house being now all stilled.

1. In darkness, and secure,
   by the secret ladder, disguised,

• ah, the sheer grace! -
  in darkness and concealment,
  my house being now all stilled.

1. On that glad night,
   in secret, for no one saw me,
   nor did I look at anything,
   with no other light or guide
   than the one that burned in my heart.
2. This guided me
   more surely than the light of noon
   to where he was awaiting me

• him I knew so well -
  there in a place where no one appeared.

1. O guiding night!
   O night more lovely than the dawn!
   O night that has united
   the Lover with his beloved,
   transforming the beloved in her Lover.
2. Upon my flowering breast
   which I kept wholly for him alone,
   there he lay sleeping,
   and I caressing him
   there in a breeze from the fanning cedars.
3. When the breeze blew from the turret,
   as I parted his hair,
   it wounded my neck
   with its gentle hand,
   suspending all my senses.
4. I abandoned and forgot myself,
   laying my face on my Beloved;
   all things ceased; I went out from myself,
   leaving my cares
   forgotten among the lilies.