M
Madeline616
Guest
Hi OrangeOwl,
Thanks for highlighting that important point; Jimmy Akin’s post was awesome and very insightful.
I understand Jimmy’s statement that the detraction must gravely harm the person of whom we speak ill in order to fulfill the requirement of mortal sin. I’m also taking into account, though, that in his post, he is trying to calm the fears of someone who states that that have obsessive-compulsive tendencies, and might at times suffer from scrupulosity.
It’s often impossible to tell what kind of harm might come to a person’s reputation after I speak ill of them, or disclose their faults and failings to another. Once the words are out of my mouth and into the ears of another, I have potentially started a chain-reaction of gossip that could cause great harm or distress to the person being spoken about.
In Fr. Groeschel’s 2007 program to which I referred, (when he stated that detraction is a mortal sin) he was talking about people gossiping about a particularly well-known priest who had fallen into scandal (an affair with a woman). I’m not sure that people gossiping about this priest caused him any more grave harm than had already been caused…he had already left his position to live with this woman, but Fr. Groeschel still firmly stated that such talk was, in fact, detraction, and a mortal sin.
To use your example, I might tell my neighbor the seemingly trivial fact that Suzie got a speeding ticket for going 65 in a 55mph zone. My friend might tell a friend whose child is in a carpool with Suzie, and word might spread that she is a careless driver. It seems a little far fetched, but who knows?
It just seems more prudent not to mention the faults and failings of others; it just can’t help us to obtain holiness, regardless of which priest or apologist feels that a particular instance it’s crossing the line into mortal sin or not.
I definitely understand the whole “need to vent” issue and have struggled with it so much myself. My own weakness is why I’m so interested in this post. Jimmy Akin’s post has helped me to understand that maybe, if I’m venting to a very trusted confidant, and I feel that my emotional distress over a situation is an objectively valid reason to speak to, say, my husband who I know will spread the word no further, this may not be as serious a sin as I had once believed.
I have to say, though, that I have heard more than one priest say that “objectively valid reason” is limited to a serious situation, where, for instance, an unrepentant child molester moved in next door and you want to warn your neighbor.
I just wanted to close with a story that emphasizes the idea that we have no idea what type of harm (even grave harm) may come to a person based on our disclosure of their faults and failings. I’ve heard the story many times, but fellow member Shin posted it so eloquently in another thread, that I’m borrowing an excerpt from his post here:
"One day a woman came to see St. Philip Neri. She was known for her wicked tongue and she used to gossip about other people, telling all the bad things they had done. This indeed was very wrong because when she talked to someone about the faults and sins of another person, that person would many times be looked upon as a bad person, by other people!
St. Philip gave the woman some money and asked her to go to the market and buy a chicken that had just been killed and to pluck all the feathers off, as she walked home with the chicken.
The woman was proud of the fact that St. Philip had asked her to do something for him. She went to the market, bought the chicken, and on her way home she picked off every single feather and made that chicken as clean as a whistle! Then with a smile she handed the chicken to St. Philip Neri.
He thanked the woman and then said, “Now go back once more, and gather up all the feathers of the chicken you just plucked!”
The poor woman didn’t smile anymore. She said, “But that is impossible, Father! The wind has scattered the feathers in every direction!”
Then St. Philip scolded, “Let this be a lesson to you, for it is exactly the same with your wicked words. Just as the chicken feathers have been scattered by the wind in every direction, so have your wicked words been scattered in every direction by other people, repeating your stories!”
Thanks for highlighting that important point; Jimmy Akin’s post was awesome and very insightful.
I understand Jimmy’s statement that the detraction must gravely harm the person of whom we speak ill in order to fulfill the requirement of mortal sin. I’m also taking into account, though, that in his post, he is trying to calm the fears of someone who states that that have obsessive-compulsive tendencies, and might at times suffer from scrupulosity.
It’s often impossible to tell what kind of harm might come to a person’s reputation after I speak ill of them, or disclose their faults and failings to another. Once the words are out of my mouth and into the ears of another, I have potentially started a chain-reaction of gossip that could cause great harm or distress to the person being spoken about.
In Fr. Groeschel’s 2007 program to which I referred, (when he stated that detraction is a mortal sin) he was talking about people gossiping about a particularly well-known priest who had fallen into scandal (an affair with a woman). I’m not sure that people gossiping about this priest caused him any more grave harm than had already been caused…he had already left his position to live with this woman, but Fr. Groeschel still firmly stated that such talk was, in fact, detraction, and a mortal sin.
To use your example, I might tell my neighbor the seemingly trivial fact that Suzie got a speeding ticket for going 65 in a 55mph zone. My friend might tell a friend whose child is in a carpool with Suzie, and word might spread that she is a careless driver. It seems a little far fetched, but who knows?
It just seems more prudent not to mention the faults and failings of others; it just can’t help us to obtain holiness, regardless of which priest or apologist feels that a particular instance it’s crossing the line into mortal sin or not.
I definitely understand the whole “need to vent” issue and have struggled with it so much myself. My own weakness is why I’m so interested in this post. Jimmy Akin’s post has helped me to understand that maybe, if I’m venting to a very trusted confidant, and I feel that my emotional distress over a situation is an objectively valid reason to speak to, say, my husband who I know will spread the word no further, this may not be as serious a sin as I had once believed.
I have to say, though, that I have heard more than one priest say that “objectively valid reason” is limited to a serious situation, where, for instance, an unrepentant child molester moved in next door and you want to warn your neighbor.
I just wanted to close with a story that emphasizes the idea that we have no idea what type of harm (even grave harm) may come to a person based on our disclosure of their faults and failings. I’ve heard the story many times, but fellow member Shin posted it so eloquently in another thread, that I’m borrowing an excerpt from his post here:
"One day a woman came to see St. Philip Neri. She was known for her wicked tongue and she used to gossip about other people, telling all the bad things they had done. This indeed was very wrong because when she talked to someone about the faults and sins of another person, that person would many times be looked upon as a bad person, by other people!
St. Philip gave the woman some money and asked her to go to the market and buy a chicken that had just been killed and to pluck all the feathers off, as she walked home with the chicken.
The woman was proud of the fact that St. Philip had asked her to do something for him. She went to the market, bought the chicken, and on her way home she picked off every single feather and made that chicken as clean as a whistle! Then with a smile she handed the chicken to St. Philip Neri.
He thanked the woman and then said, “Now go back once more, and gather up all the feathers of the chicken you just plucked!”
The poor woman didn’t smile anymore. She said, “But that is impossible, Father! The wind has scattered the feathers in every direction!”
Then St. Philip scolded, “Let this be a lesson to you, for it is exactly the same with your wicked words. Just as the chicken feathers have been scattered by the wind in every direction, so have your wicked words been scattered in every direction by other people, repeating your stories!”
), but I wanted to point out why it’s an important distinction. See the following:
