Detroit Archdiocese builds luxury hotel

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Not sure what to make of it either.

I could imagine the archdiocese using that money to help keep Catholic school afloat, bring tuition down, or a whole myriad of other things to help the poor. But what do I know.

Though at least there will be a Catholic NAB (New American Bible) in the night stand of each room in place of the customary Gideon, but I imagine most guests who frequent these establishments have little use for either.
 
maryalene said:
I just read this and am not quite sure what to make of it. What do you guys think? (mods, if this is the wrong forum, I apologize!)

catholic.org/national/national_story.php?id=23383
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Hmmm . . . .
The secrecy is disturbing. If I were a parishioner anywhere in the Archdiocese of Detroit I would assume that His Eminence’s dealings were so successful that my envelopes were no longer necessary until he made a public accounting.

As for the hotel itself, maybe it’s a good thing, but who knows? If it is generating income to support the Archdiocese’s works, it’s a good thing. But secret deals with unknown investors have a bad smell.
 
as the article itself says, the headline is wrong because the archdiocese did not build the hotel, a private group did, and the archdiocese did not fund the hotel, a private group did. Many dioceses have retreat and conference centers, we have one but it is hardly in the luxury class, is booked years in advance. In my former diocese an order of nuns turned a former motherhouse and college into a luxury resort, and a former monastery is now a country club.

If the journalist wished to discuss the financial practices of the diocese, the archbishop and the church, which obviously is his real topic, that is what he should do. the hotel lead is a hook.

the journalist also errs in not pointing out that canon law does specify what financial accounting is to be done by dioceses and parishes and other Catholic institutions, and the bishops do have guidelines on financial reporting. The actual corporate structure of the diocese and ownership of diocesan property depends on federal and state laws as well, and the history of how various entities and ownerships developed as a response to those laws is an exhaustive historical study and the topic of another thread.
 
puzzleannie said:
If the journalist wished to discuss the financial practices of the diocese, the archbishop and the church, which obviously is his real topic, that is what he should do. the hotel lead is a hook.
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Thank goodness, I thought I might have been the only one seeing this.
 
I’ve been at the St. John’s Retreat Center, that is where we spent our engaged encounter weekend.

This Center has the most spectacularly beautiful church, and they make a good deal of money doing some extremely extravagant weddings at this location. People spend tens of thousands of dollars, and more, to have their weddings there. To have a hotel of this caliber is not out of line with the type of events that are held there. If I were spending $100,000 on a wedding, then I would not want to send my guests down the road to the Red Roof Inn.

Personally, I think this reporter is making something out of nothing. I don’t see anything wrong with the AOD having a hand in this hotel. It brings people to the facility for religious retreats, weddings, and other celebrations of the Sacraments. It’s HARDLY a casino with half naked show girls and champagne shaped Jacuzzis. :rolleyes:

Here is the site for the Center: aodonline.org/StJohn/stjohn.htm

This is a non-story if you ask me.

EDITED TO ADD - There are a great many extremely wealthy Catholics in Michigan who support the Church financially in many different ways and choose to remain anonymous. There is nothing wrong with this. No one says that if you invest a large sum of money in the Church you love that you need to advertise it in the papers just because everyone wants to know about it.

~Liza
 
I wonder what kind of Pay Per View movies will be available there?😃
 
And all the people (and priests) who have had (name removed by moderator)ut and research and paperwork and … are being paid by the people in the pews?
And all the priests who are working on this at the expense of fewer Masses, fewer hours for confession, fewer hours for evangelization, fewer sick calls, fewer priests available for Anointing of the Sick?

This is sick!!!
 
Angels_Watchin said:
And all the people (and priests) who have had (name removed by moderator)ut and research and paperwork and … are being paid by the people in the pews?
And all the priests who are working on this at the expense of fewer Masses, fewer hours for confession, fewer hours for evangelization, fewer sick calls, fewer priests available for Anointing of the Sick?

This is sick!!!
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Please back up your allegations.
 
The retreat center and the church are probably pretty self-sufficient. Especially considering the fees for the weddings performed there. I was pleased to see the guidelines stated for the preparation of the wedding and the conduct of those who are visiting and using the facilities.

I seriously doubt that any church personnel are utilized in the running or management of the hotel or the golf course, so the statement that they are being kept from parish work is not well thought through.
 
geezerbob said:
Please back up your allegations.
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So, who did the marketing research so that the bishop could make this decision, or the group of people who had meetings to discuss the possibility of this luxury hotel for the diocese? (it was either the Chancery office or someone paid by the Chancery office.)
 
Morning_Glory said:
I seriously doubt that any church personnel are utilized in the running or management of the hotel or the golf course, so the statement that they are being kept from parish work is not well thought through.
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That’s correct.

The Archdiocese had two Seminaries, St. John’s and Sacred Heart.

It closed St. John’s as a seminary and opened it up as a retreat center.

The former seminary grounds had a golf course on it. The golf course has been leased to a local golf shop who runs and manages the course ( including it’s expansion). The Archdiocese recieved lease revenue from that operation, but does not manage it, or use diocese staff on that.

It has also leased property to Hotel Investment Services, who built and operate the hotel. The Archdiocese recieves lease revenue from it, but also gains in that it may now attract larger groups to the Retreat Center, as well as accomodate overnight guests for weddings.

The hotel and golf operations do not use Archdiocesan staff, and make the Retreat Center a revenue source for the Archdiocese (not just a ‘break even’ or revenue drain like other retreat centers’

Cardinal Szoka was just going to sell the property (which would be a large, one time gain). Cardinal Maida determined that he would prefer a smaller, but annual revenue stream instead. I am certainly not in a position to determinie which would have been better for the Archdiocese.

Were their Archdiocesan staff involved in this business case?, certainly. But their would have been staff involved in evaluating the business case of a property sale as well.
 
Leasing out property for development and income isn’t at all unusual with dioceses. Indeed, it’s regular practice. Sometimes the diocese (or a religious order) even maintains some sort of control in hand. Typically, dioceses (especially older dioceses) are land rich, owning lots of donated land, speculative land from times past, cemetary land, and land of closed parishes or places of ministry. They can just sit on the land or sell/lease it off for a profit. So, really, this is just standard operating practice. Whether the choices made are always wise, prudent, and beneficial is often a matter for debate, however.
 
This is the sort of thing that happens when a multimillion dollar corporation has no controls on its activities, investments, and financial standing. No one knows if the diocese is making or loosing money on the project. Any sale in the future is subject to market pressures and the price will reflect it.
There is no reason for this situation to continue as is has for so many years. The Church belongs to the people in the pews, not to the clergy who in fact work for us. We have long be remiss our obligation to manage the physical assets of the Church. There is nothing in the ordinary formation curricula for priests to prepare them for the task of managing a corporation, preparing and enforcing a budget, handling human resource management issues, etc. If it isn’t in the formation programs, it is not there because the Church does not believe that these jobs are properly the task of the clergy. That leave us, brothers and sisters, the folks in the pews. We are the ones the Church believes should be managing the Church’s finances and physical assets. If the article upset you, as it surely should, since such secrecy is highly suspect, then we should be demanding that changes in the management practices of the organization be changed. When the changes come, we must be prepared to take our place in the organization and do the work which is properly ours.
Each diocese needs a business manager, a comptroller, an accountant, a human resource department (which will handle the assignment of priests just as it handles the hiring of other staff), a financial report mechanism that reports honestly to the people whose generosity funds the corporation, and so on. The people taking on the responsibility for these jobs must have the proper academic backgrounds and credentials so that the laity may be assured that a professional job is being done in the management of their funds.
Amateurs have no business running multimillion dollar corporations and we are fools to allow it.

Matthew
 
Angels_Watchin said:
And all the people (and priests) who have had (name removed by moderator)ut and research and paperwork and … are being paid by the people in the pews?
And all the priests who are working on this at the expense of fewer Masses, fewer hours for confession, fewer hours for evangelization, fewer sick calls, fewer priests available for Anointing of the Sick?

This is sick!!!
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Did you just wake up and realize that there are priests who work in the Chancery?

And what makes you think they are not available to hear confessions (usually not done 8-5 Mon.-Fri. in most parishes) or say Mass (do you know that they are not saying Mass before going to work in the Chancer? Or that they are working there on Sunday?) or that they are unavailable for Sick Calls or anything else a priest might do?

Does it really make a difference to you whether during the workday they are working on this project, or something to do with parishes, or perhaps working on both projects?

Or, if these priest were working in a parish, would you then be complaining that the work was being done by laymen when it should be done by priests?
 
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