Did Buddha claim to be a god & request to be worshiped? If not, will we see him in heaven?

[PRmerger]

Let’s cut the chase.

Where are you going with this?

I don’t think you’ve thought out your position to its logical conclusion.

If Jesus was actually an enlightened leader and not God, then who lied about his death and resurrection?

How is it that you understand this to have happened?

A misunderstanding by the Apostles?

 

[weller2]

If Jesus was actually an enlightened leader and not God, then who lied about his death and resurrection?

Nobody. You are presupposing that one needs to be god/God to be resurrected. But Scripture lists other people who were raised from the dead: stronginfaith.org/article.php?page=114

 

[PRmerger]

Nobody. You are presupposing that one needs to be god/God to be resurrected. But Scripture lists other people who were raised from the dead: stronginfaith.org/article.php?page=114

So then Jesus lied. He, an enlightened spiritual leader according to you, lied about it while he was alive. And let the apostles and disciples spread a lie while he was alive for 40 days.

And then what happened to him? Did he ascend into heaven or were the apostles confuses about this as well?

Let’s play this scenario out and see where it leads.

 

[Servant19]

So then Jesus lied. He, an enlightened spiritual leader according to you, lied about it while he was alive. And let the apostles and disciples spread a lie while he was alive for 40 days.

And then what happened to him? Did he ascend into heaven or were the apostles confuses about this as well?

Let’s play this scenario out and see where it leads.

According to Pope Benedict XVI, Jesus never ascended into the clouds literally.

Maybe, you, the reader are lying to yourself by positing meaning to passages which are not the intended meaning…

.

 

[PRmerger]

According to Pope Benedict XVI, Jesus never ascended into the clouds literally.

Source, please.

 

[Servant19]

Source, please.

…so you thought Jesus would return in the same manner as His Ascension? From the clouds? Your previous Pope doesn’t share your belief…

“…Ascension’ does not mean departure into a remote region of the cosmos but, rather, the continuing closeness that the disciples experience so strongly that it becomes a source of lasting joy…This reference to the cloud is unambiguously theological language. It presents Jesus’ departure, not as a journey to the stars, but as his entry into the mystery of God. It evokes an entirely different order of magnitude, a different dimension of being…The New Testament, from the Acts of the Apostles to the Letter to the Hebrews, describes the ‘place’ to which the cloud took Jesus, using the language of Psalm 110:1, as sitting (or standing) at God’s right hand. What does this mean? It does not refer to some distant cosmic space where God has, as it were, set up his throne and given Jesus a place beside the throne. God is not in one space alongside other spaces. God is God - he is the premise and the ground of all the space there is, but he himself is not part of it. God stands in relation to all spaces as Lord and Creator. His presence is not special, but divine. ‘Sitting at God’s right hand’ means participating in this divine dominion over space…

The departing Jesus does not make his way to some distant star. He enters into communion of power and life with the living God, into God’s dominion over space. Hence he has not ‘gone away,’ but now and forever by God’s own power he is present with us and for us…

When Jesus was taken from their [the apostles’] sight by the cloud, this does not mean that he was transported to another cosmic location, but that he was taken up into God’s very being, participating in God’s powerful presence in the world…"

• Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI, Jesus of Nazareth, 2011 (pp. 282-283)

 

[PRmerger]

…so you thought Jesus would return in the same manner as His Ascension? From the clouds? Your previous Pope doesn’t share your belief…

“…Ascension’ does not mean departure into a remote region of the cosmos but, rather, the continuing closeness that the disciples experience so strongly that it becomes a source of lasting joy…This reference to the cloud is unambiguously theological language. It presents Jesus’ departure, not as a journey to the stars, but as his entry into the mystery of God. It evokes an entirely different order of magnitude, a different dimension of being…The New Testament, from the Acts of the Apostles to the Letter to the Hebrews, describes the ‘place’ to which the cloud took Jesus, using the language of Psalm 110:1, as sitting (or standing) at God’s right hand. What does this mean? It does not refer to some distant cosmic space where God has, as it were, set up his throne and given Jesus a place beside the throne. God is not in one space alongside other spaces. God is God - he is the premise and the ground of all the space there is, but he himself is not part of it. God stands in relation to all spaces as Lord and Creator. His presence is not special, but divine. ‘Sitting at God’s right hand’ means participating in this divine dominion over space…

The departing Jesus does not make his way to some distant star. He enters into communion of power and life with the living God, into God’s dominion over space. Hence he has not ‘gone away,’ but now and forever by God’s own power he is present with us and for us…

When Jesus was taken from their [the apostles’] sight by the cloud, this does not mean that he was transported to another cosmic location, but that he was taken up into God’s very being, participating in God’s powerful presence in the world…"

• Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI, Jesus of Nazareth, 2011 (pp. 282-283)

Firstly, his book *Jesus of Nazareth *is his personal theological opinion only. Not church teaching.

However, what is presented above is not at all what you have proposed. It doesn’t say that Jesus didn’t literally ascend into heaven. It says that he was not transported to another cosmic location (i.e. planet or physical place) but rather was taken into…heaven. Literally.

 

[PRmerger]

According to Pope Benedict XVI, Jesus never ascended into the clouds literally.

Maybe, you, the reader are lying to yourself by positing meaning to passages which are not the intended meaning…

.

Incidentally, what you have done is akin to my saying, “According to Bahaullah, it’s fine to be a sociopath”.

And when you prompt me for a source I say, “Your spiritual leader believes that it’s fine to not have compassion.”

Here’s what your leader says: “Indeed, there exists in man a faculty which deters him from, and guards him against, whatever is unworthy and unseemly, and which is known as his sense of shame.”–Baha’u’llah: “The First Leaf of Paradise”; Tablets of Baha’u’llah, p.63; Epistle to the Son of the Wolf, p. 27

How would you respond?

 

[Servant19]

Incidentally, what you have done is akin to my saying, “According to Bahaullah, it’s fine to be a sociopath”.

And when you prompt me for a source I say, “Your spiritual leader believes that it’s fine to not have compassion.”

Here’s what your leader says: “Indeed, there exists in man a faculty which deters him from, and guards him against, whatever is unworthy and unseemly, and which is known as his sense of shame.”–Baha’u’llah: “The First Leaf of Paradise”; Tablets of Baha’u’llah, p.63; Epistle to the Son of the Wolf, p. 27

How would you respond?

What a very desperate and bizarre comparison(???)

How is that quote, in any way, related to Baha’u’llah verifying the being a sociopath?

.

 

[Servant19]

Firstly, his book *Jesus of Nazareth *is his personal theological opinion only. Not church teaching.

However, what is presented above is not at all what you have proposed. It doesn’t say that Jesus didn’t literally ascend into heaven. It says that he was not transported to another cosmic location (i.e. planet or physical place) but rather was taken into…heaven. Literally.

The book was written when he was the Pope. It is magesterial teaching. If his personal thoughts go against Church teaching then he would be the first Pope I know of to believe something other than Church teaching…

I think you would do well to explore the meaning of clouds in Exodus.

I will pray you will be guided to the Truth in your search.

 

[meltzerboy]

Correct. Whatever it is you meet on the road, it is not the Buddha:

Some people come to Zen expecting that Enlightenment will be the Ultimate Peak Experience. The Mother of All Peak Experiences. But real enlightenment is the most ordinary of the ordinary. Once I had an amazing vision. I saw myself transported through time and space. Millions, no, billions, trillions, Godzillions of years passed. Not figuratively, but literally. Whizzed by. I found myself at the very rim of time and space, a vast giant being composed of the living minds and bodies of every thing that ever was. It was an incredibly moving experience. Exhilarating. I was high for weeks. Finally I told Nishijima Sensei about it. He said it was nonsense. Just my imagination. I can’t tell you how that made me feel. Imagination? This was as real an experience as any I’ve ever had. I just about cried. Later on that day I was eating a tangerine. I noticed how incredibly lovely a thing it was. So delicate. So amazingly orange. So very tasty. So I told Nishijima about that. That experience, he said, was enlightenment.

Source: Zen is Boring.

rossum

Does this story mean that true enlightenment involves simplicity? I forget whether it is Buddhism or Hinduism that states if you want to be enlightened, chop wood and carry buckets of water.

 

[tonyfish58]

The current outlook is pretty bleak is it not? It is a tremendous task to bring peace to this world. Is it even possible theoretically? I have been toying with the idea to Outlaw War. But how to enforce such a law? Probably force would have to be used.

Is there any road to peace that is not paved in blood? /Victor

Grym - I have missed this post to date, I like you replies, but Hey I like Buddhism as well

In reply to the original Question, the writings of the Baha’i Faith tells us that Buddha was a Manifestation of God and that time has clouded some of the meanings/intent of the Buddha Scriptures, here are some comments from this link - bahai-library.com/momen_encyclopedia_buddhism (researched & written by Moojan Momen)

"There are, however, a number of statements in the Bahá’í scriptures and authoritative Bahá’í texts about Buddhism and the Buddha. `Abdu’l-Bahá describes the Buddha as “the cause of the illumination of the world of humanity” (CoC1 43:15) and as the establisher of “a new religion” (CoC1 46:16). Shoghi Effendi clearly places the Buddha in the same rank and station as the founders of the other world religions (CoC1 54-56:19-20, 60:21, 63:22). A warning is sounded however that the Buddhist texts that have come down to us do not necessarily represent the exact words or teachings of the Buddha (CoC1 46:16, 48:17, 60:21, 64:22). This perception is also to be found in the Buddhist scriptures themselves, as there are several statements to the effect that the true dharma (dhamma) preached by the Buddha would gradually disappear from the world (Anagatavamsa, tr. in Warren 482ff and Conze 47-50).

I agree that we can all work together for Peace and harmony in this world. Lets face it if peace does not work we can always go back to war and conflict How it will happen only time will tell, but you and I have just found out that there are a lot more people working towards this Goal

‘Namaste’

Regards Tony

 

[tonyfish58]

Based on when Buddha was alive, he would not have been exposed to the Gospel…unless her allegorical taught he was God and requested to be worshiped he can’t justly beer held accountable because billions off people over the centuries have chosen to worship him, right? Might we be surprised to bump into him in Heaven should we get there?

1Tim215Mommy - We will indeed meet the Buddha in the Spiritual World, as we will all the Prophets of God.

In the Baha’i Faith we see them essentially as One and the Same Holy Spirit and we are told that we will be made aware of Gods intent for us while we were in this earthly existence.

Regards Tony

 

[Grym]

There you go.

There you go what ? Hmm?

/Victor

 

[Grym]

Some things are always true, no matter who is the receiver or the observer, then.

And some things are always false, no matter who is the receiver or the observer.

If it is so in the minds of most people then that is how it is perceived.

:yup:
This is very Catholic.

Yes but mostly I am right. Like for instance I totally own this conversation.

/Victor

 

[Grym]

Again, I suggest you go to your bank and tell them, “The math you use here doesn’t describe the real world. Therefore, the amount that you say I have in my savings accounts is not real.”

See how they respond to you.

And when you try to sell your car, if someone tells you, “Your math doesn’t really describe the real world. I gave you the amount you asked for your car. It’s just I did it in a different reality and even if it appears to you that you received a whole lot less than you asked for, in my reality, it’s exactly what you asked for. So we’re good!”

I’m sure you wouldn’t accept that, Grym.

As I told you nothing has any value other than in the minds of people. What do you think would happen if the world population decided Dollars was no good any more?

That would probably mean the end of the world as we know it. Belief has a great power. Being christian you should know that.

I am a computor scientist. I write the programs that handle the money for the banks. I am telling you true. Your money in the bank that you place so much trust in are only blips in cyberspace. If it were not for human imagination they would have the same value as all other blips in cyberspace.

You obviously have not sold a car? Because then you wouldknow what I say is true.

The value of the car is determined by the minds of people.

Kindly
/Victor

 

[Grym]

Does this story mean that true enlightenment involves simplicity? I forget whether it is Buddhism or Hinduism that states if you want to be enlightened, chop wood and carry buckets of water.

That very much sounds like a Zen or Chan saying. There are at least one Zen story involving chopping wood and carrying water.

Ananda one of the disciples of Buddha became enlightened while sweeping the floor!

/Victor

 

[tonyfish58]

As I told you nothing has any value other than in the minds of people. What do you think would happen if the world population decided Dollars was no good any more?

That would probably mean the end of the world as we know it. Belief has a great power. Being christian you should know that.

I am a computor scientist. I write the programs that handle the money for the banks. I am telling you true. Your money in the bank that you place so much trust in are only blips in cyberspace. If it were not for human imagination they would have the same value as all other blips in cyberspace.

You obviously have not sold a car? Because then you wouldknow what I say is true.

The value of the car is determined by the minds of people.

Kindly
/Victor

All true

Faith, Love and things of the Heart can not be taken away, all else in this world is but an illusion and all this will pass away.

Regards Tony

 

[Grym]

I agree that we can all work together for Peace and harmony in this world. Lets face it if peace does not work we can always go back to war and conflict How it will happen only time will tell, but you and I have just found out that there are a lot more people working towards this Goal

‘Namaste’

Regards Tony

Yepp it is lifting to find new “allies” .

Br
Victor

 

[rossum]

Does this story mean that true enlightenment involves simplicity?

In a way. You need to be very aware of what is inside your head and what is actually out there. Meditation includes techniques for telling the difference. The tangerine was actually out there. The vision was inside his head.

I forget whether it is Buddhism or Hinduism that states if you want to be enlightened, chop wood and carry buckets of water.

Zen Buddhism certainly says that. Hinduism may have it as well.

rossum