Did God permit imperfections in creation?

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alitaptap

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Do you think they were necessary, especially if for the good of the whole? Perhaps that’s the reason why we were commanded to go by degrees from imperfection to perfection… 🤷

Any thoughts anyone?
 
Hi alitaptap –
Yes, of course, imperfections were rampant throughout creation from the beginning until now … and will continue until creation has been brought to perfecrt … “as the Heavenly Father is Perfect.”

God never creates puppets. God creates us human beings with a free will and insists we take part in the process of our creation, our becoming.

Becoming what? His sons and daughters and sharers in the Divine Happiness in Heaven.

This is obviously a very, very long process. Imperfections are necessary until all God’s creatures have been brought to perfect.

You are no puppet, you son of God (either actually or potentially). God LOVES you.
John (JohnJFarren)
 
Everything was created perfect, until one man disobeyed God and brought sin and death into the world. This Original Sin is an inborn defect we all share.

Peace,
Ed
 
alitaptap said:
Do you think they were necessary, especially if for the good of the whole? Perhaps that’s the reason why we were commanded to go by degrees from imperfection to perfection… 🤷

Any thoughts anyone?
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No, God created humanity as perfect. But Adam’s sin ruined our nature and introduced imperfection.
 
I am reading this with interest.

I know the Bible says that God looked at creation and that it was good. There is an infinite difference between good and perfect.

Would you mind providing sources for your points of views?

I am very confused as there seems to be three different points of view put forth.

Thanks.
 
alitaptap said:
Do you think they were necessary, especially if for the good of the whole? Perhaps that’s the reason why we were commanded to go by degrees from imperfection to perfection… 🤷

Any thoughts anyone?
Click to expand...
Judaism agrees with this while Christianity may not. The idea is that G-d intentionally created the universe somewhat incomplete so that mankind might work together to complete it through people’s own free will and via acts of loving-kindness, reason, and imagination.
 
God did not permit imperfection in creation to say such is to suggest that God is imperfect himself. But since God is perfect he is unable to create something imperfect because the second that happens God’s stamp of perfection gets taken away. And there are no varying degrees of good it’s either good or not good(bad). in the NT a rich man comes up to Jesus and says “good teacher” and Jesus says why do you call me good do you not know that only God is good. Good is an absolute.
 
meltzerboy said:
Judaism agrees with this while Christianity may not. The idea is that G-d intentionally created the universe somewhat incomplete so that mankind might work together to complete it through people’s own free will and via acts of loving-kindness, reason, and imagination.
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Are you referring to John 18:36?

36 Jesus said, “My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jewish leaders. But now my kingdom is from another place.
 
The bloodline became “spoiled” after the fall. This is why it is important to believe Genesis.
 
Turtle_Turtle said:
I am reading this with interest.

I know the Bible says that God looked at creation and that it was good. There is an infinite difference between good and perfect.

Would you mind providing sources for your points of views?

I am very confused as there seems to be three different points of view put forth.
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Your point about the difference between “good” and “perfect” is a good ( 🙂 ) one. It is also worth noting that prior to the creation of Eve, God’s work was incomplete, so it is difficult to see how “perfect” can apply to something that is incomplete and still in the process of construction. For example, Genesis 2:18

Then the LORD God said, “It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him.” (emphasis added)

The lack of Eve caused the then incomplete creation to contain something that was “not good”.

rossum
 
I’m more concerned with why, if there was no illness before The Fall, he designed humans with an immune system. 🤷
 
It seems to me that God did create the perfect universe - after Eve, it was “very good.”

Adam was charged as a steward (and high priest) with tending (and guarding) the garden. He did a lousy job. He also didn’t protect his spouse.

To be a perfect steward, and perfect caretaker, and perfect spouse, one must ask God for help because we cannot do anything perfectly without God’s help.

Adam failed to call on God when he needed help (i.e. his spouse was being harassed and tempted). And both Adam and Eve wanted to have perfection / be like God - but without God’s help.

They told God they didn’t need him. God said - have it your way.

God pulled back from continuously maintaining the perfect universe (which is something only he can do). Things left to themselves (barring infrequent miracles) tend toward increased entropy / chaos.

And here we are today. Except that when Jesus came, and people accepted God again, the unraveling universe started to be put back together toward it’s originally intended state.

So that’s my explanation. Obviously, I’m not a theologian. 🤷 But it makes for interesting speculation.
 
kra130 said:
God did not permit imperfection in creation to say such is to suggest that God is imperfect himself. But since God is perfect he is unable to create something imperfect because the second that happens God’s stamp of perfection gets taken away. And there are no varying degrees of good it’s either good or not good(bad). in the NT a rich man comes up to Jesus and says “good teacher” and Jesus says why do you call me good do you not know that only God is good. Good is an absolute.
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Kra,

There is a difference between “good” and “perfect”

From dictionary.com

good -
morally excellent; virtuous; righteous; pious: a good man.
2.
satisfactory in quality, quantity, or degree: a good teacher; good health.
3.
of high quality; excellent.
4.
right; proper; fit: It is good that you are here. His credentials are good.

perfect -

entirely without any flaws, defects, or shortcomings:

Good is not an absolute. For example, I might think that weenies and dill pickles is good, while you are repulsed at the idea. Good is realtive and subjective. What is subjective is not an absolute. Truth is Absolute. Just because something is good does not mean that it is absolute.

By your definition, if I am reading you correctly, you are saying that God is imperfect, because guess what there are imperfections in Creation. How do you factor in free will with your position?
 
Regular_Atheist said:
I’m more concerned with why, if there was no illness before The Fall, he designed humans with an immune system. 🤷
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There are consequences as to the fall of man. And one of them being subject to illness.

Who knows if the immune system was created at this point or not. Sacred Scripture, Sacred Tradition, and the Magisterium of the Church is not clear on this point.

What we do know is that is was designed for humans but the point of which it took place is moot.
 
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