Did Jesus give His life on the Cross so that we could be "free" in the "Bill of Rights" and "Declaration of Independence" sense of "freedom"?

[livingwordunity]

I did NOT ignore what you said-I did not make the same connection that you did between the people calling for Jesus over Barabbas and our current system of voting.

I don’t know how you can’t see that voting has to do with politics. The Scribes and Pharisees forced their political agenda on Jesus a lot like how Obama has forced his political agenda on the bishops and all the faithful of the Church such as with the HHS mandate and so called “same-sex marriage”. I wish that every politician would follow natural law and be a friend to the Catholic Church. If that were the case I wouldn’t have to get involved with politics. But since the 2012 election is winner takes all faithful orthodox Catholics can’t afford to sit this one out.

 

[Brendan]

Freedom, as understoon in Western society ( not just the US) differes from a Catholic (Thomistic) understanding of Freedom.

In Western society, freedom means the abilty to choose, for good or for ill. You are free to vote for a good man, or to vote for an evil man.

In the Catholic sense, Freedom is the ability to choose good. It does not imply any assoiciated ability to choose evil.

God, for example, is entirely Free. Yet He cannot choose to do evil.

The ability to do evil is called a License, not a Freedom.

it contains “rights”. rights are the opposite of freedom, since a "right’ is something which is bestowed upon you by a higher authority in exchange for your subjugation, therefore having rights makes you a slave

Actually, that is not a Catholic understanding of Freedom or Rights either. The Church, via Canon Law, bestows Rights as well, but one could hardly call having a right to duly recieve the Sacraments a sign of subjugation or slavery.

 

[kevinerose]

Personally, it doesn’t matter to me who is president and who is not. At most to me it would mean more taxes, lower wages, and having less options. I can live with that just fine. I doubt that I would be enslaved or severely oppressed in my lifetime, but I vote in the hopes that future generations may live in a kind of free world as we have been blessed with.
Out of all people born to this world, less than 1% have had the opportunity to live this free life as we do now. Most who have been born into this world have lived in fear and oppression by which we as Americans do not understand. Man has been very cruel to each other over the history of this planet. And these past 100 years have been the bloodiest in history even more so than all years previous. The spread of Darwinian philosophy has brought massive death, oppression, and pain to this world.
I vote to stop the spread of evil and to subvert oppression of God’s people.

 

[Seeker1961]

The OP is a straw man argument. It’s a false dichotomy to ask, “do you want Jesus or do you want freedom?”

It’s not a straw man at all. It’s a valid question based on some of the political speech out there these days. When someone says “Jesus wants you to be rich and to pay lower taxes” that should make any educated Catholic cringe. Jesus didn’t die so we could have material wealth-I think we can all agree on that.

There is a reason the run up to an election is called “the silly season”. People desperate to win will do and say just about anything, it is up to us to know what the truth is and to use our discernment skills.

 

[livingwordunity]

It’s not a straw man at all. It’s a valid question based on some of the political speech out there these days. When someone says “Jesus wants you to be rich and to pay lower taxes” that should make any educated Catholic cringe. Jesus didn’t die so we could have material wealth-I think we can all agree on that.

There is a reason the run up to an election is called “the silly season”. People desperate to win will do and say just about anything, it is up to us to know what the truth is and to use our discernment skills.

Who has argued that the US Constitution is above Christ?

 

[Bartolome_Casas]

It’s not a straw man at all. It’s a valid question based on some of the political speech out there these days. When someone says “Jesus wants you to be rich and to pay lower taxes” that should make any educated Catholic cringe. Jesus didn’t die so we could have material wealth-I think we can all agree on that.

There is a reason the run up to an election is called “the silly season”. People desperate to win will do and say just about anything, it is up to us to know what the truth is and to use our discernment skills.

Amen!

 

[Seeker1961]

I don’t know how you can’t see that voting has to do with politics. The Scribes and Pharisees forced their political agenda on Jesus a lot like how Obama has forced his political agenda on the bishops and all the faithful of the Church such as with the HHS mandate and so called “same-sex marriage”. I wish that every politician would follow natural law and be a friend to the Catholic Church. If that were the case I wouldn’t have to get involved with politics. But since the 2012 election is winner takes all faithful orthodox Catholics can’t afford to sit this one out.

Ok, now I see where you are coming from. I would add that all politicians have a political agenda-that’s what makes them polticians. I’ve been voting for a long time and every single election I’ve been told that it is the most important election of our time and lives will be drastically changed if “we” don’t vote for the right person. I will vote in this election just like I have voted in all the others . And in the end, whoever gets elected will do things I support and things I do not, and my life day to day will stay pretty much the same.

If you would like your polticians to follow Catholic teaching, my friend, you need a theocracy. I’ve seen theocracies and they don’t appeal to me.

 

[Seeker1961]

Who has argued that the US Constitution is above Christ?

Not above Him, from Him and equal to the Bible. Mormons believe that Jesus foresaw it. If you google Constitution and Jesus you can find the picture I referred to and other information.

 

[Nimzovik]

Yes, they are just trying twsit the meaning of christianity to support their agenda. american conservativism is quite anti-thetical to true christianity. the republican party just tries to subvert christians into supporting them.

another thing,
the bill of rights incorrectly uses the word “freedom”. the bill of rights doesnt contain “freedoms” it contains “rights”. rights are the opposite of freedom, since a "right’ is something which is bestowed upon you by a higher authority in exchange for your subjugation, therefore having rights makes you a slave. so the conservatives not only twist the true meaning of christianity, but they also misuse terms like “freedom”.
plus, the bill of rights is based on capitalist and democratic principles which are very anti-thetical to christianity.

Bold Lettering mine

And Pelosi and Sebellius and Biden are doing what, pray tell?

 

[TheDoors]

This is an excellent question, a Constitutional question, and an American question. So, let us break it down.

Did Jesus die for our Constitutional Freedoms?

In brief, no. But let’s break it down.

What are our Constitutional Freedoms:
As was pointed out, we don’t have Constitutional Freedoms, we have Rights, as given by our creator. Among these are the right to Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness. We have Rights as outlined by the Bill of Rights, and the Amendments to the Constitution. These are:
Right to Practice Religion
Right to Free Speech
Right of the Press
Right to Peaceful Assembly
Right to Petition
Right to Bear Arms
Right to Refuse to Quarter Soldiers
Right to be free from Unwarranted Searches and Seizures
Right to Due Process
Right to trial by Jury
Right to Retain Council
Right to Refuse to Self-Incriminate
Right to Reasonable Punishment
Right to a Limited Federal Government
Right to Sovereign Immunity (The basis of State’s Rights)
Right to proper Presidential Election
Right of Freedom for all Men
Right of Citizenship for all Men
Right to pay an Income Tax
Right to elect Senators
Right to be Free from Alcohol
Right to Citizenship for All of age.
Right to a government with Fixed Terms
Right to Alcohol
Right to Limited Presidential Terms
Right for the Capital to be Represented
Right to be free from Poll Taxes
Right to Codified Presidential Succession
Right to Vote at the age of 18
Right to prevent the change of Congressional Salary from taking place till the next session of congress.

Quite a page full, isn’t it? Now, let’s have a look at why Jesus died:

According to our Catechism (Part 1, Section 2, Chapter 2, Article 4)

598 All Sinners are the Authors of our Lord’s Passion
601 He died four our sins in accordance with the Scriptures
602-603 For our sake was He made to be sin
608 The Lamb who takes away the Sins of the World

Also worthy of mention is the fact that the Sacrifice was needed to restore us to the pure likeness of God’s image, as we were created.

So. In brief (TOO LATE!):
Jesus died for our sins, that we could live life more abundantly and join Him in the New Jerusalem. Jesus died to wash us white as snow, and as the Sacrifice needed for the New Covenant. Jesus died for All, so that sins would be forgiven.

The American Soldier died that you could be protected from tyranny. The American Soldier died so you could be free.

I hope this helps. May God protect us, grant us mercy, and keep His hand on our soldiers, elected officials and all who serve.