Did Jesus really multiply the loaves?

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2nd Feast

Gospel of Mark

Jesus and disciples walked to Galilee.
Jesus refused to send his away unfed.
Everyone sat, apparently men and women.
Jesus took bread and fish
and distributed them.
Everyone ate and was filled.
Mark used the meals to illustrate Jesus’
hospitality and to educate his disciples
concerning his generosity and power

The Odyssey written prior to the Gospel of Mark

Telemachus and Peisistratus rode to Sparta.
Menelaus refused to send them away unfed.
Everyone sat, men and women.
They took bread, wine, and meat
and distributed them.
Everyone ate and was filled.
Homer uses the meal to educate
Telemachus in hospitality.

Now this happens all the time, where someone takes a story, makes changes without changing the story line but at the same time just focus on the symbolic form, and in this case with Mark teaches a theology that they could understand.
 
From reading the Gospel of John,

I believe that this happened in some form, but was more like a pot luck if it did actually happen.

I say this because Jesus asked how he could feed all of these people, and the 1st disciple gives him a very reasonable answer, tell him how many men and boats they need to catch enough fish, the 2nd disciple points out to Jesus that there is a young boy who has two pieces of fish and a loaf of bread. Jesus invites the boy to join them, now of all the people perhaps all were able to bring forward of what they had and this forms a pot luck, now have you ever been to a pot luck and ran out of food?

I say this because the next day people came looking for Jesus and found him on the other side asking to see proof that he is the son of God. If he actually turned that fish and bread into many wouldnt that be proff enough?

He then goes into to the literal teaching of the living bread, He is the bread, and it is flesh, whoever eats the flesh of the son and drinks his blood will have eternal life.

This was a story teaching faith, the story teller took the Oddyessy story and enhanced the story to show the importance of faith.

Again I believe in some way or form this could have happened, but even the Church will admit that the story is symbolic until the line Jesus starts talking about the bread and wine turning into his flesh and his blood, at this point many lose faith and go back to their old ways.
 
When the people find Jesus on the other side of the lake, he tells them, “you are looking for me not because you have seen signs, but because you have eaten your fill of the loaves.”

I took that to indicate that, having once provided food for them, they figured he could do it again. I don’t think that hosting a successful pot-luck dinner would have had the same effect.

I’m not at all convinced that it’s “obvious” that Mark took this story from the Odyssey.
 
Jesus performed the miracle twice.

1st time

14 And he coming forth saw a great multitude, and had compassion on them, and healed their sick. 15 And when it was evening, his disciples came to him, saying: This is a desert place, and the hour is now past: send away the multitudes, that going into the towns, they may buy themselves victuals. 16 But Jesus said to them, They have no need to go: give you them to eat. 17 They answered him: We have not here, but five loaves, and two fishes. 18 He said to them: Bring them hither to me. 19 And when he had commanded the multitudes to sit down upon the grass, he took the five loaves and the two fishes, and looking up to heaven, he blessed, and brake, and gave the loaves to his disciples, and the disciples to the multitudes. 20 And they did all eat, and were filled. And they took up what remained, twelve full baskets of fragments.

21 And the number of them that did eat, was five thousand men, besides women and children. 22 And forthwith Jesus obliged his disciples to go up into the boat, and to go before him over the water, till he dismissed the people. 23 And having dismissed the multitude, he went into a mountain alone to pray. And when it was evening, he was there alone. 24 But the boat in the midst of the sea was tossed with the waves: for the wind was contrary. 25 And in the fourth watch of the night, he came to them walking upon the sea.

2nd time

31 So that the multitudes marvelled seeing the dumb speak, the lame walk, and the blind see: and they glorified the God of Israel. 32 And Jesus called together his disciples, and said: I have compassion on the multitudes, because they continue with me now three days, and have not what to eat, and I will not send them away fasting, lest they faint in the way. 33 And the disciples say unto him: Whence then should we have so many loaves in the desert, as to fill so great a multitude? 34 And Jesus said to them: How many loaves have you? But they said: Seven, and a few little fishes. 35 And he commanded the multitude to sit down upon the ground.

36 And taking the seven loaves and the fishes, and giving thanks, he brake, and gave to his disciples, and the disciples to the people. 37 And they did all eat, and had their fill. And they took up seven baskets full, of what remained of the fragments. 38 And they that did eat, were four thousand men, beside children and women. 39 And having dismissed the multitude, he went up into a boat, and came into the coasts of Magedan.
 
And how do we explain away Matthew 16:
When they went across the lake, the disciples forgot to take bread. “Be careful,” Jesus said to them. “Be on your guard against the yeast of the Pharisees and Sadducees.” They discussed this among themselves and said, “It is because we didn’t bring any bread.” Aware of their discussion, Jesus asked, "You of little faith, why are you talking among yourselves about having no bread? Do you still not understand? Don’t you remember the five loaves for the five thousand, and how many basketfuls you gathered? Or the seven loaves for the four thousand, and how many basketfuls you gathered? How is it you don’t understand that I was not talking to you about bread? But be on your guard against the yeast of the Pharisees and Sadducees." Then they understood that he was not telling them to guard against the yeast used in bread, but against the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees.
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It seems to me that the disciples were concerned that they didn’t have any bread and thought that Jesus was warning them not to take bread from the Pharisees to eat. Jesus seems to rebuke them saying in effect that if they needed bread he could just make it for them, miraculously.
 
Think about this - after everyone ate, the Bible says that the crowd wanted to crown Jesus King, as a direct result of this miracle. Do you think they would have wanted to do that if his only accomplishment was to get them to share?

Do you thnk people travelled far distances from their homes (otherwise they could have just disbanded and gone home), the problem is they were too far away) with raw fish? They didn’t have ice back then, or coolers, how would they have done that?

If the “Bible scholars” also believe the Bible is the inspired word of God, what’s the point of the story if you take away the miracle?
 
Of course I believe Christ multiplied the loaves and fish!!! He is the Son of God,He has the power to do that and more!!:bounce:
 
Why is we’re okay with God giving our first people manna from heaven for 40 years in the desert; can accept Him walking on water; can believe in the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist; but some how multiplying loaves is a miracle that needs some kind of rational explanation? It’s as if the Devil gained a foothold in spreading doubt about this one particular story. Well, you know where you can tell the Devil to go.
 
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PaulKorb:
I have heard some ‘biblical scholars’ claim that Jesus did not literally multiply the loaves of bread, but that he merely convinced people to share what they already had.

Two questions:
  1. Is this interpretation consistent with Church teaching and tradition?
  2. Is it ok for Catholics to take either side of the issue ?
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1.) No…It is a Maricle

2.) I should think not. As this is forshadowing the Eucharist.
 
Of course it was a miracle!!!

If they had enough to feed everyone through sharing, they wouldn’t have been hungry! They all would have eaten their own food that they brought with, and that would have been that.

Saying that it was by sharing is implying that there was already enough food with the crowd to feed them all…which clearly is stated to have not been the case.
 
Jesus actually multiplied the loaves, and any attempt to deny that is succumbing to the Heresey of Modernism.

If Jesus simply convinced everyone to share, how, pray tell, did everyone eat until they were filled, and when all the scraps were collected they filled up 12 baskets??? (Matt. 14:20)
 
Damned hermeneutics of doubt!

The people of the Middle East did not need to be taught generosity or sharing hospitality. These were cultural imperatives. Jesus performed a miracle. period.
 
I know this thread is a little old, but since it is still open for reply I have something very important to say. This false blasphemous teaching that Jesus merely got “stingy jews” to share “hidden food” is an outright insult to the Jewish people, an insult to the apostles who wrote the Gospels, an insult to Jesus, And an insult to God the father (from which all miracles come), but it does so much more harm than some people will ever realize. It can crush your faith entirely. If Jesus didn’t multiply the loaves and fish maybe he never walked on water, or raised Lazarus from the dead, or cured the blind, the crippled, or all the other miracles the Gospel writers claimed he did. And since he never did the miracles he did maybe he never said what he said. Maybe he never started any church at all. Maybe the Muslims got it right. Maybe someone else died in Jesus’ place and Jesus just waited three days and gave the best academy award winning performance of all time. “Look everybody, I have risen!”. Do you now see the dangers of this “sharing hidden food” teaching. It has to be stopped and it has to be stopped NOW! And anyone who insists on continuing to teach that heretical garbage should be publicly excomminicated from the Church.
 
Is Scripture says it is so, it is so.

Part of this denying it was a real miracle is to further the “liberation” theology.

It reduces Christ to some grand wizard for social justice. Jesus did not come to make us get along. He came to die. As a Lamb on Passover.

The next time He comes, He won’t be no Lamb. Pity the souls who , this time, don’t want to get along. Scripture says He shall rule with a Rod of Iron.
 
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