Did Jesus Transubstantiate Himself?

[justinthemartyr]

We see many discussions regarding transubstantiation of the Eucharist. The question I have is that of Christ and the actual changes to His body other than that of the Eucharist.

1. Christ, who is God, was pure Spirit previous to His incarnation in the womb of Mary.
2. Christ then took on the nature of man and was fully man and fully God, with a real human body, flesh and bone.
3. Christ then died on the cross and shed his blood for the atonement for our sins.
4. Christ became spirit and went to visit the spirits in prison who disobeyed during the time of noah.
5. Christ then rose from the dead after three days and took on a glorified body, looking the same as the previous body, yet having a different substance.
6. Christ ascended to heaven, bodily.

Therefore we see Christ who is the very same Christ the entire time, changing physical form, yet remaining the very same Christ.
I find it interesting that this occurred, yet many say the Eucharist can’t be, when in fact Christ has been doing the same thing, in different form the entire time He was here on earth. He even made himself look like someone else so his disciples would not recognise him at first, yet was the exact same Christ. they only were able to see Him in the “breaking of the blessed bread”.

interesting.

 

[justinthemartyr]

also, Jesus is multi located in the eucharist just as he multilocated the fish and loaves and transubstantiated the water into wine at cana.

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

We see many discussions regarding transubstantiation of the Eucharist. The question I have is that of Christ and the actual changes to His body other than that of the Eucharist.

1. Christ, who is God, was pure Spirit previous to His incarnation in the womb of Mary.
2. Christ then took on the nature of man and was fully man and fully God, with a real human body, flesh and bone.
3. Christ then died on the cross and shed his blood for the atonement for our sins.
4. Christ became spirit and went to visit the spirits in prison who disobeyed during the time of noah.
5. Christ then rose from the dead after three days and took on a glorified body, looking the same as the previous body, yet having a different substance.
6. Christ ascended to heaven, bodily.

Therefore we see Christ who is the very same Christ the entire time, changing physical form, yet remaining the very same Christ.
I find it interesting that this occurred, yet many say the Eucharist can’t be, when in fact Christ has been doing the same thing, in different form the entire time He was here on earth. He even made himself look like someone else so his disciples would not recognise him at first, yet was the exact same Christ. they only were able to see Him in the “breaking of the blessed bread”.

interesting.

Just a couple of more notations of the transubstantiate post.

The Transfiguration, Word of God made flesh, The Word of God spoken from a distance, healed the sick, and brought back the dead, The Rock in the desert that gave rivers of living water, Paul states “and the Rock was Christ”, Heals a blind man with spittle and dirt, Can you imagine this healing blindness with mud spit, I stated this so as not to under estimate the power of God’s will, he works miracles through the sacraments be it mud, or water, bread, wine, his breath, his word, his touch, even his garment sacramentally healed a dieing woman.

Jesus is the same in the old testament also, God was in the whispering of a wind to Elijah, He was in the Cloud, by day, and fire by night, God revealed himself in a burning bush that did not burn, talk about transubstantiation in a burning bush on holy ground that did not burn. In the natural it is foolishness, but to the spiritual it is reality of the eternals.

Peace be with you.

 

[justinthemartyr]

Just a couple of more notations of the transubstantiate post.

The Transfiguration, Word of God made flesh, The Word of God spoken from a distance, healed the sick, and brought back the dead, The Rock in the desert that gave rivers of living water, Paul states “and the Rock was Christ”, Heals a blind man with spittle and dirt, Can you imagine this healing blindness with mud spit, I stated this so as not to under estimate the power of God’s will, he works miracles through the sacraments be it mud, or water, bread, wine, his breath, his word, his touch, even his garment sacramentally healed a dieing woman.

Jesus is the same in the old testament also, God was in the whispering of a wind to Elijah, He was in the Cloud, by day, and fire by night, God revealed himself in a burning bush that did not burn, talk about transubstantiation in a burning bush on holy ground that did not burn. In the natural it is foolishness, but to the spiritual it is reality of the eternals.

Peace be with you.

yes, but those in the world who are of the flesh and npt of the Spirit cannot understand nor hear these things, just as those disciples that walked away from jesus when he commanded them to eat his flesh and drink his blood for eternal life. human, man made thinking does not get you anywhere. but they cannot help it, they are blind to the truth, and need the scales removed from their eys(figuratively).

 

[SyCarl]

also, Jesus is multi located in the eucharist just as he multilocated the fish and loaves and transubstantiated the water into wine at cana.

I don’t think that changing the water into wine would qualify as being transubstantiation within the meaning of the Catholic Church. First, I understand that it applies uniquely to the Eucharist. Second it involves change of the subsatnce but not the accidents. However the wine was wine. Both the accidents and the substance was changed.

 

[AgnosTheist]

We see many discussions regarding transubstantiation of the Eucharist. The question I have is that of Christ and the actual changes to His body other than that of the Eucharist.

Transubstantiation is when an artificially produced substance becomes God himself. None of your biblical examples qualify, for in each instances it was God himself who produced the physical substance, NOT THE FACTORY!

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

Transubstantiation is when an artificially produced substance becomes God himself. None of your biblical examples qualify, for in each instances it was God himself who produced the physical substance, NOT THE FACTORY!

You comment, to exactly what justinmartyr was speaking of, from the flesh. True, the Transubstantiation is what happens to the species of bread and wine. What I believe justinmartyr is speaking about are the spiritual realities of God. To which you only comment from the flesh. The examples above given, do not define transubstantiation, they are good examples of How God is not limited on how he wants to reveal himself to his children.

Be it by a cloud, Word, wind, healing miracle, Rock, flesh, or a piece of bread and wine. This is a good posting to elevate ones understanding here about the true presence. I just wish I could spend more time here, to digress in these mysteries.

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

yes, but those in the world who are of the flesh and npt of the Spirit cannot understand nor hear these things, just as those disciples that walked away from jesus when he commanded them to eat his flesh and drink his blood for eternal life. human, man made thinking does not get you anywhere. but they cannot help it, they are blind to the truth, and need the scales removed from their eys(figuratively).

The scales will fall off, when reason and faith join like the spirit and the flesh, in the incarnation. The scriptures are helpful, but those of the flesh will not understand them, unless they are taught.

This mystery of God in more than one place at one time, and at different times, including outside of time. I consider creation, how God just in his Word accomplished all by his Word, in the time for man to understand 6 days, and on the seventh day, he rested. Did God create heaven and earth in six days, or is this mans way of understanding God in time?

When God commanded Moses to strike the Rock so that living water would bring life to his people in the desert, and the Rock was Christ why? Because after Moses struck the Rock, came living water, but when the water ran out, God commanded Moses to speak to the Rock, and out came rivers of living water.

Jesus, as prophesized “I will strike the shepherd” Jesus our shepherd was stricken once, (crucified), but what did Jesus tell his Apostles. “Do this in remembrance of me” Now that Jesus was stricken and we saw the water flow from his body, and from this came Baptism in the holy Spirit, that gives us life for we will never thirst again.

But Jesus spoke to the bread, broke it, his body, seperated his blood from his body at the last supper, is when he began his road to the passion. And commanded his apostles to do the same, speak to the bread and wine in the The Words of God himself, so that this bread, and wine becomes the body, blood, soul and divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ made present.

So the apostles like Moses, was commanded to speak to the Rock,and the Rock was Jesus Christ, that gives life to God’s people while on the journey in life and in death in this desert.

That is why Jesus states, he is the true bread from heaven, not like the bread in the desert, and they all died.

 

[Claire_from_DE]

I’ve enjoyed thinking through these postings. Doesn’t God do amazing things!