Did Mary experience labor pains?

  • Thread starter Thread starter IsaiahStar
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Michael777, I am waiting for your response on the other thread where you claim that we perpetuate a false translation of Luke 1;28. I am also waiting a definition of Idolotry on the Mary statue thread.
 
What precisely Did God say to mary?

On the occasions he spoke to her?

HE said SHE WAS FAVOURED
AND THAT SHE WAS GOING TO GIVE BIRTH TO A SON.

thats all

In other words that exactly what happened.

simple

Mary was not going to be sin incarnate
she was a human being who was chosen by God to be indwelt by the Holy spirit
but the Holy spirit was going to be like a mans sperm and create a baby!!

She had no man invloved in this process
that is why Jesus was sinless.

because you only get a human in need of redemption
when you have a man and a woman mate.
a woman s seed on it own is not UNCLEAN !!!
ARE YOU SO TRAPPED AS TO NOT UNDERSTAND THE OBVIOUS

SIN IS NOT A HUMAN SIN IS A POSTION WHICH LEADS TO AN ACTION.
 
40.png
jimmy:
Michael777, I am waiting for your response on the other thread where you claim that we perpetuate a false translation of Luke 1;28. I am also waiting a definition of Idolotry on the Mary statue thread.
Click to expand...
I CAN ONLY POST ONE THING AT A TIME

believe what you want
 
40.png
michael777:
What precisely Did God say to mary?

On the occasions he spoke to her?

HE said SHE WAS FAVOURED
AND THAT SHE WAS GOING TO GIVE BIRTH TO A SON.

thats all

In other words that exactly what happened.

simple

Mary was not going to be sin incarnate
she was a human being who was chosen by God to be indwelt by the Holy spirit
but the Holy spirit was going to be like a mans sperm and create a baby!!

She had no man invloved in this process
that is why Jesus was sinless.

because you only get a human in need of redemption
when you have a man and a woman mate.
a woman s seed on it own is not UNCLEAN !!!
ARE YOU SO TRAPPED AS TO NOT UNDERSTAND THE OBVIOUS

SIN IS NOT A HUMAN SIN IS A POSTION WHICH LEADS TO AN ACTION.
Click to expand...
Michael,

I am guessing that English may not be your native language. Am I correct?
 
“The report concerning the child was noised abroad in Bethlehem. Some said, ‘The Virgin Mary has given birth before she was married two months.’ And many said, ‘She has not given birth; the midwife has not gone up to her, and we heard no cries of pain.’” (Ascension of Isaiah 11; c. 70 AD)

“So the Virgin became a mother with great mercies. And she labored and bore the Son, but without pain, because it did not occur without purpose. And she did not seek a midwife, because he caused her to give life. She bore as a strong man, with will” (Odes of Solomon 19; c. 80 AD).
 
40.png
michael777:
I CAN ONLY POST ONE THING AT A TIME

believe what you want
Click to expand...
Believe what I want? That is not a response to what I said. I am waiting for your answer, and have been for a while.

I offered the greek on the other thread for you to analyze for us and show us our error. I would like to see my error.
 
Not so, Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit also

How then did the Holy spirit mange to stand entering her?
in the first place seeing before the holy spirit came into her she was sin?

the arguments are ilogical and unspiritual.

God didnt consider men to be sin itself
and the argument of mary being to sifnful as to infect jesus in her wob and therefore this idea that God made her sinless so he could stand to go near her is blasphemous never mind being ireligious.
 
40.png
michael777:
ARE YOU SO TRAPPED AS TO NOT UNDERSTAND THE OBVIOUS

SIN IS NOT A HUMAN SIN IS A POSTION WHICH LEADS TO AN ACTION.
Click to expand...
Alrighty then! As long as your not angry!😉
 
Mickey said:
“The report concerning the child was noised abroad in Bethlehem. Some said, ‘The Virgin Mary has given birth before she was married two months.’ And many said, ‘She has not given birth; the midwife has not gone up to her, and we heard no cries of pain.’” (Ascension of Isaiah 11; c. 70 AD)

“So the Virgin became a mother with great mercies. And she labored and bore the Son, but without pain, because it did not occur without purpose. And she did not seek a midwife, because he caused her to give life. She bore as a strong man, with will” (Odes of Solomon 19; c. 80 AD).
Click to expand...

You read rubbish you believe rubbish
 
40.png
michael777:
What precisely Did God say to mary?

On the occasions he spoke to her?

HE said SHE WAS FAVOURED
AND THAT SHE WAS GOING TO GIVE BIRTH TO A SON.

thats all
Click to expand...
What the angel said was, “Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee, blessed art thou among women.”
40.png
michael777:
She had no man invloved in this process
that is why Jesus was sinless.
Click to expand...
It does not matter if she had a man involved, that does not keep Jesus from sin. What it means is that Jesus is the Son of the Father. He is still the descendant of men, and consequently recieves the consequences of sin. The only thing that keeps him from sin is his nature as God. He still suffered death, which is a consequence of the first sins of men. The consequences of the first sin did not only pass through the males, it is not a mark on a person, it is a lack of grace or favor.
 
40.png
michael777:
Not so, Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit also

How then did the Holy spirit mange to stand entering her?
in the first place seeing before the holy spirit came into her she was sin?

the arguments are ilogical and unspiritual.

God didnt consider men to be sin itself
and the argument of mary being to sifnful as to infect jesus in her wob and therefore this idea that God made her sinless so he could stand to go near her is blasphemous never mind being ireligious.
Click to expand...
Sin is a cooperation between the flesh and the spirit. Elizabeth did not bear God in the flesh, she only had the spirit of God in her.
 
What are we meant to have faith in alone?
i mean what is the mesage of God?

Its to believe that Jesus is the messiah the Son of God

and anyway if you say mary was born wiothout sin
why on earth would she have to a virgin? and why was she found doubting jesus sanity?

And why did she ask God how can this be?
because if she was born wothut sin she would have no doubt as to the possibilty of her giving birth to jesus even though she hadnt had sex with a man.

In other words she would be in perfect comunion with God all her life and wouldnt have found it strange firghtening and OUT OF THE ORDINARY when God CAME TO HE TO ANOUNCE WHAT HE WAS GOING TO DO.

She would have spoke to him before then.

THINK THINK USE YOUR BRAINS !!!

we have to believe in Jesus as she did in order to be saved from sin!!

its a blaspemy to say she was not in need of redemtption and yet say she was

it utterly mad and God made no mention of what it is your saying
the miracle was the virgin birth isnt that enough
and God ordained salvation via faith in christ alone there is no other way to be considered holy blameless and spotless.

IT negates christ and the need for faith in him alone and it makes a mockery of his sacrifice and having to call on his name to be saved
because mary didnt know christ before he came!!!

she recieved forgiveness through him like everyone else.

but if you say she was born sinless it means she was so without the saving faith in christ.
 
Michael I am conveniced that you like to hear yourself talk. You are really not making any sense.
 
40.png
michael777:
What are we meant to have faith in alone?
i mean what is the mesage of God?

Its to believe that Jesus is the messiah the Son of God

and anyway if you say mary was born wiothout sin
why on earth would she have to a virgin? and why was she found doubting jesus sanity?

And why did she ask God how can this be?
because if she was born wothut sin she would have no doubt as to the possibilty of her giving birth to jesus even though she hadnt had sex with a man.

In other words she would be in perfect comunion with God all her life and wouldnt have found it strange firghtening and OUT OF THE ORDINARY when God CAME TO HE TO ANOUNCE WHAT HE WAS GOING TO DO.

She would have spoke to him before then.

THINK THINK USE YOUR BRAINS !!!

we have to believe in Jesus as she did in order to be saved from sin!!

its a blaspemy to say she was not in need of redemtption and yet say she was

it utterly mad and God made no mention of what it is your saying
the miracle was the virgin birth isnt that enough
and God ordained salvation via faith in christ alone there is no other way to be considered holy blameless and spotless.

IT negates christ and the need for faith in him alone and it makes a mockery of his sacrifice and having to call on his name to be saved
because mary didnt know christ before he came!!!

she recieved forgiveness through him like everyone else.

but if you say she was born sinless it means she was so without the saving faith in christ.
Click to expand...
Well, you obviously know nothing of these matters except what your Protestant pastors/teachers have told you. It is easy to take verses of the Bible and read into them what we want to see in them. This is why Jesus never commanded a NT be written. He knew how men would take such a work and use it to push their own ideas. And that is exactly what has happened.

The NT was never meant to contain the full teachings of Christ and his Church. It is more a snapshot of the very early Church and how it operated and its problems. Most of the NT was written to address such things not spell out Christ’s teachings on all things. It was the job of the Apostles to do that, mostly through their preaching. For Jesus commanded them to do 3 things: to preach, to baptize, and to make disciples. He said nothing about writing anything.

The difficulties you are having are a combination of a lack of understanding about the nature of Christ and what the Incarnation truly means, as well as obstinacy, for you don’t really want to know what the Church teaches about Mary or anything else, for that matter. You just want to accept whatever you want to, which takes no faith at all but a good deal of hubris.
 
There was no pain or suffering experienced by Adam or Eve before their sin. Ghosty–God bless his heart–doesn’t believe this, I believe, because of his committment to secular evolution ideology.

I believe Mary’s giving birth to her Son was virginal. She was as another poster said a virgin before, DURING, and after the birth of her Son. I don’t believe she experienced any physical pain normally associated with giving birth. I think those who doubt this and other miracles like the multiplication of loaves do not realize that to God all things are possible.
 
A SECRET FOR YOU NOW THAT WAS MADE KNOWN NOT IN SECRET BUT PROCLAIMED TO ALL CREATION

the whole point of God redeeming man through christ who was fully human and fully divine is just that.HE was Fully Human and Fully Divine.
What im about to write next is the very truth on this matter of Mary.

If mary was not in the same state as eve after her fall.
the christ you believe in isnt the christ of God.

“For you have to believe that christ came in the flesh.”

The only way your faith can be valid is to believe that Christ came in the flesh, the flesh that was to come from EVES seed. In the state it was when it was EVES SEED to THE STATE TO come IN THE FUTURE HAD TO BE THE SAME. EVE’S seed was in the state of all humankind AFTER HER.

The flesh is humankind
the way of ALL FLESH IS EQUAL.
IN OTHER WORDS ALL FLESH IS THE SAME.

JESUS HAD TO BE LIKE HIS BROTHERS IN EVERYWAY
HIS FLESH WAS REAL HUMAN FLESH IT WASNT DIFFERENT IT HAD TO BE THE SAME.

The seed of EVE was human seed and was the EGG by which God and Man became ONE.
THE WORD BECAME FLESH.

If you believe the egg wasnt in the state that it was in as derived from the state of EVE.
Legally you arent believing in the Jesus Christ whom st paul and st peter and Mary herself believed in.

For the redemption was going to come via that seed, through Gods mercy and his intervention he was going to bring forth a messiah but by that seed.

the human race had to be brought back to God
a sinnless race was already there!!!

you say mary sinnless
God sinless so this equals?

Where is the flesh where is fallen mankind who needs a saviour!!!

They are completely left out of the eqaution
it had to be from eves fallen seed or lese christ wouldnt have come IN THE FLESH

GOD MADE THE PERFECT CHRIST IT WAS GODS HOLY SPIRIT THAT COMPENSATED FOR EVERYTHINGBUT HE DID IT IN THE ORDER HE HAD PREORDAINED ,EVERYTHING WAS EXACTLY AS HE ORDERED AND SINFUL MANKIND WAS AND HAD TO BE PART OF THE EQUATION EVES SEED WAS TO BE THE HUMAN SIDE GODS SPIRIT THE OTHER SIDE…

I know the truth in Christ.

the seed of eve WAS THE LEGAL ORDER OF GOD.
so SATAN HAD NO LEGAL RIGHTS ANYMORE IN THE COURTS OF HEAVEN

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE LISTEN TO ME
 
Well, you obviously know nothing of these matters except what your Protestant pastors/teachers have told you.

I leant all this from God the bible and The holy spirit.
I had no one teaching me it except christ.

michael
 
40.png
Della:
Well, you obviously know nothing of these matters except what your Protestant pastors/teachers have told you. It is easy to take verses of the Bible and read into them what we want to see in them. This is why Jesus never commanded a NT be written. He knew how men would take such a work and use it to push their own ideas. And that is exactly what has happened.

The NT was never meant to contain the full teachings of Christ and his Church. It is more a snapshot of the very early Church and how it operated and its problems. Most of the NT was written to address such things not spell out Christ’s teachings on all things. It was the job of the Apostles to do that, mostly through their preaching. For Jesus commanded them to do 3 things: to preach, to baptize, and to make disciples. He said nothing about writing anything.

The difficulties you are having are a combination of a lack of understanding about the nature of Christ and what the Incarnation truly means, as well as obstinacy, for you don’t really want to know what the Church teaches about Mary or anything else, for that matter. You just want to accept whatever you want to, which takes no faith at all but a good deal of hubris.
Click to expand...
You are sinning against the Word Of God and The Gospel.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top