Did Mary sin?

[jmcrae]

I don’t believe in purgatory.

I agree with this.

I confess to God and ask His forgiveness, and to the others I need to apologize to. God instantly forgives.

While there are always consequences to my sinful behavior, I don’t need to do anything more to earn God’s love and grace, which He grants freely.

I know that nothing I do–whether it’s a week of prayer and fasting or spending hours reading the Bible–NOTHING earns me any special rights and privileges with God. There is no formula, chant or time segment required.

As His daughter, I know with confidence that I will go straight to heaven the moment I leave this earth.

I believe this because Jesus Himself taught this.

Where in the four Gospels does Jesus ever say anything that sounds even a little bit like, “Just say my Name, and you’re irrevocably on your way to Heaven. Obedience is not required. That thing with the Judgment of the Nations in Matthew 25:31 to the end of the chapter? - I was just kidding!”

 

[adrift]

If you could do ANYTHING to “make up for your sins”, then Jesus suffered and died needlessly.
Your works-based “making up” for your sin would mean that you contribute to the purging of your sin. This completely contradicts the (Hebrews 1:3) verse that says: “…, when He (Jesus) had BY HIMSELF purged our sins,…”.

I know that you will go to the “Jesus gave us the grace to do it ourself” explanation, but you still can not get past the true meaning of “by Himself” with that. Jesus did it all, when it comes to purging. Grace has to do with our accepting and receiving that purging as a gift; not doing any of the purging of our sin by ourself.

You take away from and insult what Jesus did for us, when you claim that you are even a partial contributor to that purging. You can’t purge even the least of your sins. What we might consider to be a “small sin” is really a great and eternally condemning sin to our infinitely Holy God. Only God can remove that sin (by Himself) and He did so by the one Perfect Sacrifice at Calvary.
God’s Grace is what enables us to believe and accept that attonement for our sin. We don’t do any of the purging ourselves.

It was Jesus who said that the last pence would be paid and He wasn’t talking about His crucification. I don’t understand why that verse is always ignored.

 

[Trilor]

I have no problem accepting the Marian doctrin that she was born without the taint of Original Sin by the grace of God. But COULD she have sinned?

She didn’t commit actual sin and I have no problem with that, at least as far as I understand that greek word starting with K (kechariwhateveritwas) that was used by the Archangel Gabriel.

I am very thankful for her Yes to God. but did she have the capacity to say “no”? Could she, like Eve, have sinned?

Just asking

 

[neweyes]

Where in the four Gospels does Jesus ever say anything that sounds even a little bit like, "Just say my Name, and you’re irrevocably on your way to Heaven.

I didn’t say that.

(That)Obedience is not required. That thing with the Judgment of the Nations in Matthew 25:31 to the end of the chapter? - I was just kidding!"

Obedience IS required. Formulas are not. Big difference. God does not want us performing antics as acts of obedience. He never said to do this. The original post said that the Bride said to do this. In other words, the Church. People. Not Him.

 

[neweyes]

It was Jesus who said that the last pence would be paid

Verse?

 

[jmcrae]

Obedience IS required.

Good.

Formulas are not.

Not even if God establishes the formula? (Do you pray the Our Father, for example?)

Big difference. God does not want us performing antics as acts of obedience. He never said to do this. The original post said that the Bride said to do this. In other words, the Church. People. Not Him.

Do you not read the Bible, or pray?

We receive Indulgences for reading the Bible, praying, and visiting various holy sites for the purpose of learning their sacred history.

I have no idea what you might mean by “antics” - when I hear that word, I think of disobedient children doing humorous things in a classroom. I don’t see anything in the Handbook of Indulgences to indicate that we can receive Indulgences for anything like that.

 

[GailMac]

Doubt about that fact? You could try this prayer before a Rosary: Lord, I do believe, heal my unbelief. Then pray Roasry and in your heart ask for the Truth about Mary. Perhaps God will help you get over your doubts. I sure hope so.

Peace,

Gail

 

[jmcrae]

Verse?

Matthew 18:34.

 

[neweyes]

Do you not read the Bible, or pray?

You assume I don’t just because I am not Catholic?

We receive Indulgences for reading the Bible, praying, and visiting various holy sites for the purpose of learning their sacred history.

This is not anything I have ever heard of before. I don’t mean to offend, and I apologize for the use of the word “antics.” But this concept of receiving something to earn your way into Grace is shocking and dismaying to me. To those who aren’t familiar with your traditions, it sounds like you have a stack of tokens that you need to gain admittance. Is it a point system? How many indulgences do you get for visiting a site? How does the point value relate to the amount of time in purgatory reduced?

 

[Gamera]

…You take away from and insult what Jesus did for us, when you claim that you are even a partial contributor to that purging. You can’t purge even the least of your sins…

“Above all hold unfailing your love for one another, since love covers a multitude of sins,” 1 Pet 4:8.

 

[Gamera]

But this concept of receiving something to earn your way into Grace is shocking and dismaying to me.

No, that isn’t what Catholics believe. No amount of indulgences can “earn” anybody’s way into grace. Just the opposite — a person must already be in a state of grace before he can obtain an indulgence.

 

[jmcrae]

You assume I don’t just because I am not Catholic?

Actually, I’m assuming that you do. Which means that if you were to become a Catholic, it wouldn’t be something “extra” or “added on” to your current lifestyle, to start gaining Indulgences.

By which I mean to say, we gain Indulgences for doing things we were supposed to be doing, anyway. These things aren’t really “extras” - they’re among the many perfectly normal aspects of being followers of Jesus Christ.

This is not anything I have ever heard of before. I don’t mean to offend, and I apologize for the use of the word “antics.” But this concept of receiving something to earn your way into Grace is shocking and dismaying to me.

This is a misunderstanding. I think instead of thinking of it as “earning” something, it’s more like, the natural consequences of reading the Bible and praying are that, you become a more holy person. Just like the natural consequence of eating right and exercising is good health. You don’t “earn” good health by eating right and exercising - it’s just what comes about naturally, when you are in the habit of doing those things.

Same with Indulgences - it’s not about “earning” something, but more, about getting into holy habits. Jesus tells us that if we don’t gain holiness in this lifetime (become perfected in HIm) then we will not attain Heaven. There is no “easy believin’” in the New Testament - we are all called to greatness. The things we do that gain Indulgences just happen to be things that make us spiritually healthy, so as to be able to attain these greater things.

 

[Luke65]

You quoted. So? I also know how to quote. Where are the answers and are these even relevant…I seriously don’t know what you’re doing (perhaps also with your life), before you even talk you start insulting.

.

You’re a funny guy. You come onto a Catholic forum and the first thing you do is mock and insult all Catholics, and slander Catholics like me who love the word of God and read the Bible virtually every day - then when someone takes you to task you cry foul!

For the record, I didn’t slander you, I told you the truth. You prove that you read the Bible with a veil on when you claim that you read it but that you can’t see Purgatory - even when I put some of the relevant verses right in front of you.

But I didn’t say that you were at fault for that (unlike your smear), you may not have “received the Holy Spirit” in the sacrament of confirmation (Acts 8:14-17), or had your “eyes opened” by receiving the Holy Eucharist (Luke 24:30-31). But it is your free will.

 

[adrift]

Verse?

Matthew 5:26