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Lampo
Guest
If yes, how does this coincide with “one mediator between man and God - Jesus Christ?” This question is directed to Protestants who reject praying to Mary or the saints.
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Ahimsa
Guest
(Putting on my Protestant hat.) Moses was a mediator, not the one Mediator.
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Lampo
Guest
Oh, is that the argument? I didn’t know they allow for ANY mediators except for Jesus.
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NotWorthy
Guest
Moses was THE mediator between God and Israel. This has nothing to do with the New Covenant that Jesus ushered in. Just as David was the Covenant mediator and Abraham was the Covenant mediator in their respective covenants.
Since Moses’ Covenant was before the New Covenant…
Since Moses’ Covenant was before the New Covenant…
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Ahimsa
Guest
Well, I was speaking for the liberal Protestants.
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YADA
Guest
I am not a protestant, so perhaps my thoughts don’t matter but…
I think we sometimes lose sight of the fact that God can [and does] whatever He wills in this world. No matter what we understand or are told. God can limit man but not the other way around…
Jesus Christ is the “One mediator between man and God” Jesus Christ sacrificed Himself to redeem mankind, taking upon Himself our sins.
God [Trinity, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, the Alpha and Omega, etc] can and does act in our lifes [and in history] through whatever person [or circumstance] God chooses. It is not for man to place limits upon God. If you understand what I am trying to say.
God interceeded for His poeple [He “heard their cries” and commanded Pharoh to “let My poeple go”] God decided to act [mediate] through Moses…Moses did not “decide” to mediate of his own volition.
So, I would say that God decided to use Moses to mediate between Him [God] and the people [Jews and Egyptians and possibly the other people who they came into contact with]
I think we sometimes lose sight of the fact that God can [and does] whatever He wills in this world. No matter what we understand or are told. God can limit man but not the other way around…
Jesus Christ is the “One mediator between man and God” Jesus Christ sacrificed Himself to redeem mankind, taking upon Himself our sins.
God [Trinity, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, the Alpha and Omega, etc] can and does act in our lifes [and in history] through whatever person [or circumstance] God chooses. It is not for man to place limits upon God. If you understand what I am trying to say.
God interceeded for His poeple [He “heard their cries” and commanded Pharoh to “let My poeple go”] God decided to act [mediate] through Moses…Moses did not “decide” to mediate of his own volition.
So, I would say that God decided to use Moses to mediate between Him [God] and the people [Jews and Egyptians and possibly the other people who they came into contact with]
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Lampo
Guest
Thank you. That helps too.
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Gottle_of_Geer
Guest
Under the New Covenant, no, they don’t. Moses is described in the NT as a mediator. His mediation was a foreshadowing of the far more excellent mediation of Jesus Christ:
- Gal 3:19 Why then the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the offspring should come to whom the promise had been made; and it was ordained by angels **through an intermediary. **
- Gal 3:20 Now an intermediary implies more than one; but God is one.
See also: - 1Sa 2:25 If a man sins against a man, God will mediate for him; but if a man sins against the LORD, who can intercede for him?" But they would not listen to the voice of their father; for it was the will of the LORD to slay them.
- Job 33:23 If there be for him an angel, a mediator, one of the thousand, to declare to man what is right for him;
- Isa 43:27 Your first father sinned, and your mediators transgressed against me.
- 1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
- Hebrews 8:6 But as it is, Christ has obtained a ministry which is as much more excellent than the old as the covenant he mediates is better, since it is enacted on better promises.
- Hbr 9:15 Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred which redeems them from the transgressions under the first covenant.
- Hbr 12:24 and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks more graciously than the blood of Abel.
As for 1 Timothy 2.5: - 1Ti 2:1 First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men,
- 1Ti 2:2 for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life, godly and respectful in every way.
- 1Ti 2:3 This is good, and it is acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
- 1Ti 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
- 1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
- 1Ti 2:6 who gave himself as a ransom for all, the testimony to which was borne at the proper time.
…cont’d…]
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Gottle_of_Geer
Guest
…cont’d & ended]
- 1Ti 2:7 For this I was appointed a preacher and apostle (I am telling the truth, I am not lying), a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and truth.
- 1Ti 2:8 I desire then that in every place the men should pray, lifting holy hands without anger or quarreling;
This is a single chain of connected reasonings - & if 1 Tim 2.5 contradicts 1 Tim 2.1-3, St. Paul seems not to realise it
- Deu 5:1 And Moses summoned all Israel, and said to them, "Hear, O Israel, the statutes and the ordinances which I speak in your hearing this day, and you shall learn them and be careful to do them.
- Deu 5:2 The LORD our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.
- Deu 5:3 Not with our fathers did the LORD make this covenant, but with us, who are all of us here alive this day.
- Deu 5:4 The LORD spoke with you face to face at the mountain, out of the midst of the fire,
- Deu 5:5 while I stood between the LORD and you at that time, to declare to you the word of the LORD; for you were afraid because of the fire, and you did not go up into the mountain. He said:
- Deu 5:6 "'I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
The word “mediator” is absent - the function & reality of mediation is present; for a mediator is a “middle-man”, the person who “stand between” two parties.
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