Did the Pope mandate first communion and confirmation

[Cathtech]

Why does this bother you? Originally all Christians were baptized, confirmed and recieved the Eucharist at the same time. It is still done like this in the Eastern Catholic Churches.

**Amen!

One of the most beautiful sights is seeing how Fr. Peter’s face lights up as he gives the little ones the Body and Blood of Christ.**

It doesn’t bother me. I’m just trying to get my facts straight. My in-laws tend to believe anything negative they hear about the Church, so it’s important that I present credible facts. It’s a great opportunity to teach them about the Catholic faith, but only if what is presented is accurate.

 

[Phemie]

Again I agree. My family does it’s best to try and set a good Catholic example, especially around them.
I’m sure the shallowness is part of it. I think its also gets into the protestant view of Catholics and the Papacy. This is just another in a long line of issues about the Church I’ve dealt with them on.

Yeah, I remember a family I babysat for. The father was Hindu, the mother had been raised Methodist, her dad a Methodist minister.

I asked her once if her family had been upset that she fell in love with and married a non-Christian. “No,” she replied, “my dad’s response was ‘At least he’s not Catholic. That could have presented any number of problems.’”

 

[John_Lilburne]

The pope’s authorisation probably refers to Pope Paul VI’s approval of the liturgical book: Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults. The Congregation for Divine Worship decreed this could be used on 6 January 1972.

This new book gave a ceremonies for unbaptised adults becoming Catholic. Generally they were to receive Baptism, Confirmation and Communion in the one ceremony.

But this book also had a chapter “Christian Initiation of Children Who Have Reached Catechetical Age”. For them also the three sacraments are received in the one ceremony: “281. At this third step of their Christian initiation, the children will receive the sacrament of baptism, the bishop or priest who baptises them will also confer confirmation, and the children will for the first time participate in the liturgy of the eucharist.” (In the USA edition this is number 305, in the Australian edition n. 281.)

So there are two ways children receive these sacraments. Those baptised before Catechetical Age receive Communion and Confirmation in separate ceremonies years later. Those baptised after Catechetical Age receive them straight away.

So for people used to children having separate ceremonies, this single ceremony seems strange.

More can be read about this at liturgyoffice.org.uk/Resources/Rites/RiteRitual.html , click on the Rite of Christian Initiation – Introductions. A useful book on the topic: "Issues in the Christian Initiation of Children: Catechesis & Liturgy”, K. Brown & F.C. Sokol, Liturgy Training Publications, 1989.

 

[Corki]

So there are two ways children receive these sacraments. Those baptised before Catechetical Age receive Communion and Confirmation in separate ceremonies years later. Those baptised after Catechetical Age receive them straight away.

There are actually three ways. As mentioned above, in some diocese children baptised before Catechetical age receive Confirmation and First Communion at the same time. An example is the diocese of Tyler, TX where I attended a Confirmation/First Communion earlier this year.

 

[John_Lilburne]

There are actually three ways. As mentioned above, in some diocese children baptised before Catechetical age receive Confirmation and First Communion at the same time. An example is the diocese of Tyler, TX where I attended a Confirmation/First Communion earlier this year.

I do not see how there can be ongoing reception of Communion before catechetical age for Roman Catholics. Code of Canon Law, canon 777: “In a special way the parish priest is to ensure, in accordance with the norms laid down by the diocesan Bishop that:
… 2 children are properly prepared for first confession and first holy communion, and for the sacrament of confirmation, by means of catechetical formation over an appropriate period of time.”
Canon 913 “For holy communion to be administered to children, it is required that they have sufficient knowledge and be carefully prepared, so that according to their capacity they understand what the mystery of Christ means, and are able to receive the Body of the Lord with faith and devotion.” It then has:
“2 The blessed Eucharist may, however, be administered to children in danger of death if they can distinguish the Body of Christ from ordinary food and receive communion with reverence.”
(Code of Canon Law: New revised English Translation, HarperCollins Liturgical, London, 1997).

So generally children need to be able to go to confession to continue going to communion. And they need to be of Catechetical Age to be taught about these things.

 

[Hesychios]

I do not see how there can be ongoing reception of Communion before catechetical age for Roman Catholics. Code of Canon Law, canon 777: “In a special way the parish priest is to ensure, in accordance with the norms laid down by the diocesan Bishop that:
… 2 children are properly prepared for first confession and first holy communion, and for the sacrament of confirmation, by means of catechetical formation over an appropriate period of time.”
Canon 913 “For holy communion to be administered to children, it is required that they have sufficient knowledge and be carefully prepared, so that according to their capacity they understand what the mystery of Christ means, and are able to receive the Body of the Lord with faith and devotion.” It then has:
“2 The blessed Eucharist may, however, be administered to children in danger of death if they can distinguish the Body of Christ from ordinary food and receive communion with reverence.”
(Code of Canon Law: New revised English Translation, HarperCollins Liturgical, London, 1997).

So generally children need to be able to go to confession to continue going to communion. And they need to be of Catechetical Age to be taught about these things.

As far as I know, it was not always like this, even in the west.

The three sacraments of Initiation are: Baptism, Confirmation and Holy Eucharist, given in that order and (originally) all on the same day! There was no requirement that children be able to distinguish the Holy Eucharist from ordinary food. That intellectual qualification was a later introduction. If I am not mistaken, these Canons can be rewritten under the Pope’s direction, he is not bound to them.

As has been stated in the east in many traditions the children are communed from the day of Baptism.
http://ocaphoto.oca.org/filetmp/2004/August/102/Detail/DSC_0048.jpg

By requiring children to be catechized, and delaying communion until after a first confession, the sacrament of Penance in effect becomes an initiatory sacrament, which it was never intended to be.

If the Pope really did mandate this change (I have no idea whether or not the story is accurate), it could mean that he is making an attempt to reorder the sacraments to restore early church practice. He might even be open to the idea of pulling the age of reception back down to infancy. He is a very intelligent theologian and he knows the evolution of the modern western practice, nothing would surprise me.

 

[Phemie]

I do not see how there can be ongoing reception of Communion before catechetical age for Roman Catholics.

John, Corki meant that, in some dioceses, children who were baptized as infants and who are now of catechetical age prepare for and are confirmed and receive Communion at the same celebration – not that the three sacraments are received at the same time.

Of course Confirmation is always supposed to be administered to infants if they are in danger of death.

 

[CB_Catholic]

As far as I know, it was not always like this, even in the west.

The three sacraments of Initiation are: Baptism, Confirmation and Holy Eucharist, given in that order and (originally) all on the same day! There was no requirement that children be able to distinguish the Holy Eucharist from ordinary food. That intellectual qualification was a later introduction. If I am not mistaken, these Canons can be rewritten under the Pope’s direction, he is not bound to them.

As has been stated in the east in many traditions the children are communed from the day of Baptism.
http://ocaphoto.oca.org/filetmp/2004/August/102/Detail/DSC_0048.jpg

By requiring children to be catechized, and delaying communion until after a first confession, the sacrament of Penance in effect becomes an initiatory sacrament, which it was never intended to be.

If the Pope really did mandate this change (I have no idea whether or not the story is accurate), it could mean that he is making an attempt to reorder the sacraments to restore early church practice. He might even be open to the idea of pulling the age of reception back down to infancy. He is a very intelligent theologian and he knows the evolution of the modern western practice, nothing would surprise me.

Personally, I am one Latin Rite Catholic who would like to see this early Church practice restored.

Of course, that would mean only one party.

 

[Corki]

John, Corki meant that, in some dioceses, children who were baptized as infants and who are now of catechetical age prepare for and are confirmed and receive Communion at the same celebration – not that the three sacraments are received at the same time.

Of course Confirmation is always supposed to be administered to infants if they are in danger of death.

Thanks, that’s exactly what I meant.

John offered two possible scenarios:

#1 child is baptized as an infant, receives Communion at age of discretion and Confirmation at a later age
#2 child is not baptized and is presented for the Sacraments at an age older than the age of discretion and receives all three Sacraments together

and I offered:

#3 child is baptized as an infant and receives Confirmation and Communion together (as in the diocese of Tyler) or very close (as I believe they do in Phoenix) at roughly the age of discretion. In Tyler it is 3rd grade after having received the Sacrament of Reconcilliation for the first time in 2nd grade.

Sorry I wasn’t more specific.

 

[John_Lilburne]

Thanks for the explanation.

 

[Seatuck]

I believe it is response to this -

1. In this regard, attention needs to be paid to the order of the sacraments of initiation. Different traditions exist within the Church. There is a clear variation between, on the one hand, the ecclesial customs of the East (50) and the practice of the West regarding the initiation of adults, (51) and, on the other hand, the procedure adopted for children. (52) Yet these variations are not properly of the dogmatic order, but are pastoral in character. Concretely, it needs to be seen which practice better enables the faithful to put the sacrament of the Eucharist at the centre, as the goal of the whole process of initiation. In close collaboration with the competent offices of the Roman Curia, Bishops’ Conferences should examine the effectiveness of current approaches to Christian initiation, so that the faithful can be helped both to mature through the formation received in our communities and to give their lives an authentically eucharistic direction, so that they can offer a reason for the hope within them in a way suited to our times (cf.* 1 Pet* 3:15).

From Sacramentum Caritatis.

I believe he may have elsewhere expressed a preference for the reception of the Sacraments of Initiation together but I’m not finding it at this time. There was a lot of talk after the release of SC. Several dioceses have implemented conferring all 3 in infancy in the US.

I live on Long Island. We have not been issued any mandates to change anything. I’m sure the Bishop’s Conference is looking into it. I doubt we’ll see a return to the Eastern Rites way of doing things any time soon. I wonder what percentage of American Catholics would attend any religious education classes if the 3 Sacraments were given in infancy. Thus this spreading them out is looked at as a way to enforce or ensure some religious education.

 

[Phemie]

I wonder what percentage of American Catholics would attend any religious education classes if the 3 Sacraments were given in infancy. Thus this spreading them out is looked at as a way to enforce or ensure some religious education.

Which in itself is a very poor reason to delay the children’s reception of the gifts of the Holy Spirit which they so need to help them in their teen years. This withholding Confirmation until the late teens even though Communion is received at 6 or 7 is a development of the late 20th century. When I was confirmed in '61, I was 7 and it was a given that whenever the bishop was coming to the village, all the children who had received their First Communion were prepared for Confirmation. The same with my Mom & Dad in the 20s & 30s. It was only when I was out of high school that Confirmation started to be pushed pushed back further, and further, first to grade 6 & 7 then to the high school years.

My present diocese was just reconfigured and brought together one that had returned the sacraments to their original order at the age of reason (6+ depending on the child) and one that confirmed in high school. The happy medium decided upon is confirmation is now available to children from grade 6 & up. But canon law does say that a child can be confirmed, with proper instruction, at the age of discretion and that sacraments can’t be denied if the person requesting them are properly disposed, so I guess a home schooling parent could request Confirmation for their 7 or 8 year old child.

It hardly seems reasonable to confer all three sacraments of initiation to a 7 year old convert and deny one of them to a Catholic of the same age just because he/she was baptized as an infant.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

My mother in-law who is a Methodist and has a slight anti-Catholic bias, was talking to her Catholic friends in New York who told her that the Holy Father mandated that 1st Communion and Confirmation had to be done at the same time. Everyone in New York (at least where her friends are) are extremely upset with the Pope over this.

I thought this was up to the Bishop of the diocese. It doesn’t make sense to me given Pope Benedict’s willingness to allow the Latin Mass and traditional views to go this route

Has anyone else heard about this ? Given her feelings toward the Catholic church, I would like to debunk this one If I can.

Maybe this was misunderstood. The Pope mandated First Holy Communion and Confession to be together. Actually First Confession before First Holy Communion, but around the same time.