Did your spouse decide when you'd have kids?

[Liberanosamalo]

If you aren’t ready for children now, please postpone engagement and marriage. Deal with your own issues before you take on someone else’s. The purpose of marriage is the raising and educating of children and helping your spouse get to heaven. It is a mutual and exclusive relationship. And it is forever. If you can’t deal with any part of that, please do not marry. Love your bf/gf enough to let them find someone who can. And deal with your issues.

I wish every priest would hand a card out saying this to every couple. Might stop some disasters in the making.

 

[ack]

Can’t you just pounce? Fiddle your charts. I don’t know, I’ve not had that experience but hopefully he’ll mature. Pray for him. Pray the rosary.

I can’t see how deceiving one’s spouse like this would EVER be a good idea. Would you deceive your own spouse? The mind boggles…

 

[GraceDK]

I can’t see how deceiving one’s spouse like this would EVER be a good idea. Would you deceive your own spouse? The mind boggles…

Agree.
I can’t believe people actually sit down and write this stuff … would they like their own husbands to lie to them? if yes, about what… where is the line?

 

[SaltySirena]

Can’t you just pounce? Fiddle your charts. I don’t know, I’ve not had that experience but hopefully he’ll mature. Pray for him. Pray the rosary.

Oh, that’s brilliant. Seriously? You want this woman to lie to her husband, betray trust by trying to force him to become a father, and then pray her way out of the wreckage she will inflict by doing so? Great plan.

Do people who suggest this kind of thing ever stop to think about the consequences the child could face? Being resented by a father who never wanted you must just be a tonic for one’s mental health. Being abused or abandoned by said father would really assist in that child feeling valued and loved and important…

You are suggesting that she do evil, to her husband and her child, and then use the Rosary to try and fix it. Disgusting. I’m kinda thinkin’ the Blessed Mother would refuse to carry that petition to her Son!

Kristie, I’m sorry but I don’t think this is the first time or the only issue where this man is controlling. And I think you knew he was controlling before you married him. Did you do that silly girl thing where we think that it will all be fine because someday he’ll change, grow up, whatever? Did you think that you were special enough/he loved you enough that he would stop being controlling for you? If so, it seems that gamble has not paid off. If you really had no idea he was like this… well, that’s hard to believe. Either he would have to be a consummate con artist (and some men are), or you would have to have married him so quickly that you really had no idea who he was (hard to do with 6 months of prep required by the Church). But, if you married him and suddenly he became a different person, you have been defrauded and might even have grounds for annulment. Either way, he is controlling and cares nothing for what you want, or he is a liar and a fraud who lured you into marriage under false pretenses… and you want to obligate children to having him for a father because… why, again?

Whatever you do, you cannot have children with this man until a mutual agreement is reached. And one that is genuine, not him giving in just to get you to stop nagging. How will you know the difference? I don’t know… that’s the risk of being in a relationship with this kind of guy. It’s a real rock and a hard place, huh?

I agree with Liberanosamalo… you may discover you do not want to have this man’s children, anyway.

 

[Annie_Marie]

Kristie,
I feel like you just wrote a post about my experience. I’ve been married over 3 years and my husband has been insisting we postpone (using NFP) this entire time. Before we were married, we had agreed on waiting 5 years. Then I learned more about the teachings of the Church as well as my maternal instincts kicking in. I had not been able to convince him we shouldn’t wait any longer. We did get pregnant about a year ago (took a risk), but lost the baby. I think this solidified his “I’m not ready” attitude. I didn’t know what to do and my desire for a child and to let God be in control was overwhelming. I tried communicating this to my husband, but he was so fixated on having our finances just so and travel more. I was so tempted to do as others suggested and fudge my charting, but I knew that would only make things worse. I want my husband to be at a point where he will be excited when we find out we are pregnant.

So I started praying. I began going to Adoration and praying for his heart to be opened to children. He came to me on his own and said he was ready. I was so happy to hear his change of heart! We have now thrown aside the charting and are letting God decide.

I’ll be praying for you and your husband.

 

[Musician]

Kristie,
I feel like you just wrote a post about my experience. I’ve been married over 3 years and my husband has been insisting we postpone (using NFP) this entire time. Before we were married, we had agreed on waiting 5 years. Then I learned more about the teachings of the Church as well as my maternal instincts kicking in. I had not been able to convince him we shouldn’t wait any longer. We did get pregnant about a year ago (took a risk), but lost the baby. I think this solidified his “I’m not ready” attitude. I didn’t know what to do and my desire for a child and to let God be in control was overwhelming. I tried communicating this to my husband, but he was so fixated on having our finances just so and travel more. I was so tempted to do as others suggested and fudge my charting, but I knew that would only make things worse. I want my husband to be at a point where he will be excited when we find out we are pregnant.

So I started praying. I began going to Adoration and praying for his heart to be opened to children. He came to me on his own and said he was ready. I was so happy to hear his change of heart! We have now thrown aside the charting and are letting God decide.

I’ll be praying for you and your husband.

This is a wonderful post, full of wisdom. The best thing to be done is to pray!

 

[TigerKitty]

I really do feel for all of the women who have posted here. It’s the hardest thing in the world to want a child and have your husband - who you married in the Catholic church - decide that you are not going to have a child.

I’m struggling with this TERRIBLY right now. I’m almost 38. He is 38. We’ve been married almost a year. He said tonight he needs about 3 more months before he will be “potentially ready”. I’m really terrified that we won’t have a child - a healthy child - at this age. And how hard the pregnancy would be for me at that age. (and no, we were never married before.)

If he really loved me, wouldn’t he want to start trying now? More importantly, if he really meant his marriage vows to me, shouldn’t he have started trying right after the wedding?

Of course, when we talk about this, and he says he “needs time”, “needs more time”, I get very upset and cry. I don’t yell at him or anything - I just can’t stop crying. As I see the chance of having a healthy child slipping away.

He says that I have to stop crying and stop pushing him away - that when I cry becuase I’m scared we won’t have a healthy child, that I’m pushing him away. Essentially, he said I have to be on my best behavior for the next 3 months, and then “POTENTIALLY” we’ll start trying “In the Fall” - or, at worst, in December.

I know this is wrong, but I can’t open his heart. He make a salary that is twice the average for people in our county. And I make more than the average. We have an obscene amount of money in the bank.

Also, if we have a child, he has to delay having a real house (we are renting now) for at least 2 years.

I’m so hurt. I know in my heart that he is not “real husband” material. I’m so confused and hurt. Please pray for me and him. It’s hard for me to be 100% “there” and “not cry” when he is denying children in our marriage. How can I get through to him?

And, what happens if we don’t start trying until December? And then we have a horribly sick baby who will suffer because my husband delayed, delayed, delayed? How will that be? I will feel so horrible for that child. And I will resent him forever for making us wait because of the terrible suffering of our child.

And, what happens if we don’t start trying until December? And we never get pregnant? He will only try for 6 mos to a year. And then I will resent him forever because he decided for me that I will never have kids.

How can I let him know that it is best for our marriage if he would just “man up” and start trying now? Again, if I were 10 years younger, this would be a non-issue. Even 5 years younger. There’s just so much pain. I don’t know what to do. I need help, and have no family to talk to (probably why I am in this mess).

 

[LongingForLight]

Out of curiosity, what would your DH say if you told him tonight that you no longer want to chart your fertility signs? Would he start using condoms? Refuse you sex? Decide to risk it? I’m just thinking out loud here…

I actually did this. I continued to let him know when I thought I was fertile and infertile and how many days past peak I thought I was, but told him that if he wanted solid data he needed to do the charting himself, hand me the thermometer, set the alarm - everything but actually take the temperature and check my mucus signs. He admitted that was fair since I wanted to get pregnant and he was the one who didn’t want me to, so he should be in charge of BC - and then proceeded to do no charting or anything.

It took about a year and a half for me to get pregnant anyways. Sadly, I have little trouble reading the signs of fertility, even during irregular cycles.

DH and I knew when we married that when to have children / family size would be an issue for us. He’s not Catholic, so “trust in God” is not an acceptable family planning strategy He wasn’t entirely ready when I got pregnant with the twins, either, but agreed because I came at him with a year-long budget and financial plan and way too much enthusiasm for anyone to resist - I’m just so charming, y’know?

But I hear you - I doubt that I will ever be the one to decide when we have children. It will always be DH’s openess to life or God’s grace causing an NFP “mistake”. But then, I’d probably be happy to just let nature take its course, with few exceptions, and trust God to make things work out. So I can’t really blame DH for being uncomfortable with my level of openess to life.

 

[Abenadar]

Liberanosamalo said

If you aren’t ready for children now, please postpone engagement and marriage.

I heartily agree with this sentiment. At the same time, nobody is “ready” for a child until that pregnancy happens, and especially when that child is actually born and therefore it’s nonsensical to use that as a reason (excuse) not to conceive. You (and your husband) will be ready when that child is born.

I’m the least likely person to be “ready” for that type of responsibility but my wife and I just trusted in God and now we have two boys. I was 23 when we were married and I’m 27 now. Another thing I know is that I’m “not ready” for a third, but I also understand that that is probably right around the corner, and by the grace of God I will be ready when that baby comes…God will take good care of us…He has these last four years.

Look at the holy family; do you think Joseph was ready to accept God as his child? Do you think he was ready to flee to Egypt in the middle of the night? God’s grace is sufficient.

Perhaps the first thing for every person to do would be to become more fervent and less lukewarm.

 

[LongingForLight]

Liberanosamalo said
I heartily agree with this sentiment. At the same time, nobody is “ready” for a child until that pregnancy happens, and especially when that child is actually born and therefore it’s nonsensical to use that as a reason (excuse) not to conceive. You (and your husband) will be ready when that child is born.

With exceptions for severe mental health issues, severe financial reasons, etc. - I agree. My DH didn’t feel entirely ready for even one baby when we conceived twins, much less two, but by the end of the pregnancy he was the most loving, caring father and husband I could imagine. I couldn’t believe he was the man I’d married! It lasted about a year and a half after the girls were born. Now that I’m pregnant again, he’s developing that same loving “glow” - who wudda guessed expectant fathers can glow as well? Of course, he could just be reflecting my own joy . . . but either way, he’s radiant with his love for me and the new baby.

At the same time, I did try not to pressure him. But since I was honestly upset by having to wait, I couldn’t help but cry and point out that not being allowed to talk about it just made the pain even worse. What is it about wanting a baby when your spouse doesn’t that hurts so much?

 

[katillac1]

I really do feel for all of the women who have posted here. It’s the hardest thing in the world to want a child and have your husband - who you married in the Catholic church - decide that you are not going to have a child.

I’m struggling with this TERRIBLY right now. I’m almost 38. He is 38. We’ve been married almost a year. He said tonight he needs about 3 more months before he will be “potentially ready”. I’m really terrified that we won’t have a child - a healthy child - at this age. And how hard the pregnancy would be for me at that age. (and no, we were never married before.)

If he really loved me, wouldn’t he want to start trying now? More importantly, if he really meant his marriage vows to me, shouldn’t he have started trying right after the wedding?

Of course, when we talk about this, and he says he “needs time”, “needs more time”, I get very upset and cry. I don’t yell at him or anything - I just can’t stop crying. As I see the chance of having a healthy child slipping away.

He says that I have to stop crying and stop pushing him away - that when I cry becuase I’m scared we won’t have a healthy child, that I’m pushing him away. Essentially, he said I have to be on my best behavior for the next 3 months, and then “POTENTIALLY” we’ll start trying “In the Fall” - or, at worst, in December.

I know this is wrong, but I can’t open his heart. He make a salary that is twice the average for people in our county. And I make more than the average. We have an obscene amount of money in the bank.

Also, if we have a child, he has to delay having a real house (we are renting now) for at least 2 years.

I’m so hurt. I know in my heart that he is not “real husband” material. I’m so confused and hurt. Please pray for me and him. It’s hard for me to be 100% “there” and “not cry” when he is denying children in our marriage. How can I get through to him?

And, what happens if we don’t start trying until December? And then we have a horribly sick baby who will suffer because my husband delayed, delayed, delayed? How will that be? I will feel so horrible for that child. And I will resent him forever for making us wait because of the terrible suffering of our child.

And, what happens if we don’t start trying until December? And we never get pregnant? He will only try for 6 mos to a year. And then I will resent him forever because he decided for me that I will never have kids.

How can I let him know that it is best for our marriage if he would just “man up” and start trying now? Again, if I were 10 years younger, this would be a non-issue. Even 5 years younger. There’s just so much pain. I don’t know what to do. I need help, and have no family to talk to (probably why I am in this mess).

I’m sorry you are going through so much pain. If it makes you feel any better, my mom had me when she was 43, and I have a couple of perfectly healthy friends with older parents too. I know you’re heartbroken, but I wanted to let you know that it is very possible to still have a healthy baby so don’t give up hope!

 

[TigerKitty]

Katillac -
Thanks for your words of encouragement. I do try to remind myself of all the people who have had healthy children later in life. Sometimes it does help to keep the hope alive.

Longing for Light -
A few ideas on why it hurts so much when our spouses are not open to children. And, this is in the context of a Catholic marriage.

A spouse who denies being open to children is not being true to their marriage vow “welcome children lovingly as gifts from God”. And so, the marriage is not sacramentally valid. Without being a valid sacrament, the grace of God is not conferred to the couple. Marriage is hard! How can we get through this without some divine assistance?

So we lose two ways: Our spouse lied to us in front of God and our families and friends, and is not true to the marriage vow. We do not receive God’s grace in our marriage.

To go a step further: If our spouse is supposed to be the face of Christ to us on earth, and husbands are to love their wives as Christ so loved the church - we feel utterly betrayed. Not just by another human being, but also in a way betrayed/desserted by God.

And this puts a strain on our relationship with the church. How sinful is it to continue having relations with a spouse who is actively contracepting? I am ashamed to say that I continue to do this even though I know it is against the teachings of the church. I do this so that my husband does not go even further away from me, but I feel I am doing something terrible spiritually. This is making me feel just terrible, and I think is further straining my relationship with God - and closing me off from receiving his grace personally.

And this is doubly hard to deal with when all your life you have looked forward to the day of marrying a “good” Catholic man and raising a loving Catholic family.

So those are my thoughts on the matter. I’m trying to find a spiritual advisor here to help me with these issues. It takes some time. The churches in my area don’t seem to care about you if you aren’t married with kids. Which makes things hurt worse, unfortunately.

 

[Em_in_FL]

I think the OP should investigate marriage counseling immediately.

This discussion should have taken place WELL BEFORE they were married and now that the cart’s before the horse things need to be FIXED before they can move forward.

OP mentioned that she “wanted kids from the beginning” and he “wasn’t ready”… didn’t that raise any red flags during marriage prep???
Both spouses may have legitimate opinions, but they’re MARRIED and at this point they need to get on the same page - or at least have a plan on how to get there.

Counseling (preferably someone who is sympathetic to Catholic teachings) is CRITICAL at this point.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

So we lose two ways: Our spouse lied to us in front of God and our families and friends, and is not true to the marriage vow. We do not receive God’s grace in our marriage.

To go a step further: If our spouse is supposed to be the face of Christ to us on earth, and husbands are to love their wives as Christ so loved the church - we feel utterly betrayed. Not just by another human being, but also in a way betrayed/desserted by God.

And this puts a strain on our relationship with the church. How sinful is it to continue having relations with a spouse who is actively contracepting? I am ashamed to say that I continue to do this even though I know it is against the teachings of the church. I do this so that my husband does not go even further away from me, but I feel I am doing something terrible spiritually. This is making me feel just terrible, and I think is further straining my relationship with God - and closing me off from receiving his grace personally.

Several issues at work here… if your spouse lies to you in front of God and family and friends and betrays the marriage vow, your marriage may not be valid, and no, you may not be receiving the grace of the sacrament. In which case, oftentimes the so-called “sacrament” is doomed to crash down around your heads.

But that is not to say that a devout Catholic married to one of these people who stays in the state of grace does not receive actual grace on a personal level to help them endure and move on and survive. Focus on your personal relationship with God. Your spouse refusing to represent the love and fidelity to God and His face to you on earth does not mean God is betraying you. It means your spouse is not living up to his obligation and will have to answer to that before God someday. Your spouse is NOT God. And should not assume that idolatrous role in your relationship. God is not deserting you, though you may feel that way. Don’t desert God.

Find a good spiritual director immediately. Go to confession. Get good counsel on this subject. YOU need to fix your relationship with God because any decisions you make in life where you are not in the grace of God will be skewed and faulty. What realizations you come to realizing your “catholic” spouse really doesn’t care about your immortal soul (which is what it sounds like) really need to be looked at under the cold light of day. Continuing to contracept to please someone who is not looking out for your soul is self-defeating in the end. You may hold onto that person physically, but what have you really held onto?

You both need counselling and you both need to either get on the same page, or one of you needs to make some painful decisions.

God bless.

 

[dulcissima]

Why don’t you try going on vacation and backing off on the pressure for a while? Try to connect with your husband in a sexual way that isn’t all about treating him like a means to an end…like your baby maker. My thoughts are just up the intimacy between you and up the frequency of your relations in general. Drop the resentment. This isn’t a race. Just accept the peace that is there in waiting and being patient. It might be just that bit of space that your husband is needing. Talk to him about what other things are going on his mind and in his life.

If you want to make babies, pressure, arguing, resentment, and divorce are not the road to take.

 

[Kristie]

Thank you to everyone for your prayers and support, and thank you for those who shared their own stories of similar struggles. After taking a few days to cool off mentally and emotionally, I realize my husband and I have some big problems & challenges when it comes to communication and control. To be fair, I can be super controlling and dominant about a lot of things, (I come from a line of VERY dominant women) and have made him feel like he can’t be himself or be honest with me even about really small things. I am starting to see why he has hesitations about having kids with me. Frankly, I’m pretty messed up … I’m super-controlling, get very angry really easily and often, do not have a healthy relationship with my husband (I see myself as more like a leech – sucking the life out of him in order to fill the emptiness I feel inside), and am often depressed and spend my time doing things that I’m not passionate about (I quit my job as a writer over a year ago to help my husband with his photo business. Because I want to be a stay-at-home mom…it seemed like a good intermediate step, since we work from home together. I’m also going to school for graphic design – also not a passion, just a vague interest – but only because it provides health insurance for me and for a future child were we to have one…basically I changed my whole career path so it would be more family friendly, and I’ve just gotten so depressed and frustrated because he hasn’t wanted kids yet, and I feel like I gave up so much in order to be ready for & prepare for a family.)

I’m sorry this has gotten somewhat off the original topic…Now I am just overcome with fear that maybe it’s too late for me to try to change. We are going to Europe in three days and we’ll be gone for five weeks, and I am afraid we’ll just be bringing all this **** with us. We probably wouldn’t be able to get an appointment with a counselor or priest on such short notice. I’m just so afraid. I feel like all of this is my fault… that if I’d been more patient, more kind, more gentle and all the things a loving wife is supposed to be, then we wouldn’t be in this mess. I know I am not in my right mind right now (it’s 4 a.m.), but please, please pray for us and for our marriage, that God will just flood us with his grace so we can work through these issues. Thank you and God bless you all.

 

[GraceDK]

Thank you to everyone for your prayers and support, and thank you for those who shared their own stories of similar struggles. After taking a few days to cool off mentally and emotionally, I realize my husband and I have some big problems & challenges when it comes to communication and control. To be fair, I can be super controlling and dominant about a lot of things, (I come from a line of VERY dominant women) and have made him feel like he can’t be himself or be honest with me even about really small things. I am starting to see why he has hesitations about having kids with me. Frankly, I’m pretty messed up … I’m super-controlling, get very angry really easily and often, do not have a healthy relationship with my husband (I see myself as more like a leech – sucking the life out of him in order to fill the emptiness I feel inside), and am often depressed and spend my time doing things that I’m not passionate about (I quit my job as a writer over a year ago to help my husband with his photo business. Because I want to be a stay-at-home mom…it seemed like a good intermediate step, since we work from home together. I’m also going to school for graphic design – also not a passion, just a vague interest – but only because it provides health insurance for me and for a future child were we to have one…basically I changed my whole career path so it would be more family friendly, and I’ve just gotten so depressed and frustrated because he hasn’t wanted kids yet, and I feel like I gave up so much in order to be ready for & prepare for a family.)

I’m sorry this has gotten somewhat off the original topic…Now I am just overcome with fear that maybe it’s too late for me to try to change. We are going to Europe in three days and we’ll be gone for five weeks, and I am afraid we’ll just be bringing all this **** with us. We probably wouldn’t be able to get an appointment with a counselor or priest on such short notice. I’m just so afraid. I feel like all of this is my fault… that if I’d been more patient, more kind, more gentle and all the things a loving wife is supposed to be, then we wouldn’t be in this mess. I know I am not in my right mind right now (it’s 4 a.m.), but please, please pray for us and for our marriage, that God will just flood us with his grace so we can work through these issues. Thank you and God bless you all.

Kristie.
Be at peace dear sister.
Jesus time and again changed people’s lives from one moment to the next. He too can transform the things in your character that are difficult and signs of fear and unease and turn them into kindness, gentleness and peace.
Pray for this. If you can I also encourage you to go to people who have the gift of healing that they may pray over you and for your marriage. Make friends who have the calm and peace in Christ that you need. This is contageous - that’s even scientifically proven )
If you have full peace in Jesus and is full of His Spirit, you will have the calm and stability that would be good for a child.
Don’t be discouraged. Through the grace of God you have seen your own weaknesses and you are now already on the way. I have prayed for you and your trip to Europe. Jesus is with you. He is your Strength. Turn to Him. :hug1:

 

[ac_claire]

Oh Kristie, I’m so sorry about all this! :console:

Of course you can still change. It’s a cliche but it’s also absolutely true that it’s never too late to try and start over and make things better. However, I’m wondering about what you revealed in your last post, about how you’re afraid that your husband has hesitations about having kids with you because of your controlling, angry behavior, etc., etc. Is this a realization that you had by yourself, or did your husband tell you or hint at it…?

Because the bottom line is that whether your behavior needs to be adjusted or not, that is still not an excuse for continually putting off having kids. I would hate for him to use that as yet another in the long list of excuses you’ve already told us about. (Not saying he’s doing that…just saying if.)

My advise is still to lay it all out on the table. Don’t be distracted by any excuses or side-issues that come up in the conversation…they may be valid, but you’re talking about having children now. If I were you I’d stop with the half-measures and give him an ultimatum. You don’t have to be cold or angry when you’re telling him…just firm and resolved.