Difference Between Discalced Secular Carmelites and Calced/Old Carmelites?

[Newleaf123]

Hi,

I’m discerning a call to the third order/lay Carmelites. I understand the reforms that occurred when St. Theresa began the discalced order.

My question is whether anyone can shed some light on the differences, today, between the discalced and the calced/old lay/secular orders, in terms of their practices, spirituality, prevalence in the US, etc.

Thanks!

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Hi,

I’m discerning a call to the third order/lay Carmelites. I understand the reforms that occurred when St. Theresa began the discalced order.

My question is whether anyone can shed some light on the differences, today, between the discalced and the calced/old lay/secular orders, in terms of their practices, spirituality, prevalence in the US, etc.

Thanks!

First, the orders are the Order of Carmelites Discalced (O.C.D.) and the Order of Carmelites (O.Carm.).

We O.Carm. are not called Calced, that would be defining us by a reform that left the Order which is incorrect. We are also not called Old Carmelites.

We are also known as the Order of Carmelites of Ancient Observance or (our official name found in our documents) the Order of the Brothers of Our Lady of Mount Carmel.

I am sorry if I this seems a bit mean but this is a big pet peeve of mine.

As for the differences to day, there is not much that I can see. The Discalced will have more of a focus on the writing of St Teresa of Avila and St John of the Cross but both orders study them because after all is said and done St Teresa and St John were Carmelties.

I would suggest that if you have access to both groups that you visit them and see what they are all about. Each local group will have its own “flavor” and feel because of the individuals that make it up.

 

[Newleaf123]

Thanks for the clarifications and information, that is very helpful.

 

[ThomasEugene]

I was once an OCDS aspirant, but I felt no calling there… I am now in a separate community.

With the TOCarm *the Ancient Observance, I can give you a link. tocphilippines.blogspot.com/

The TOCarms wear mantles, large scapulars during their meetings. When I was with the OCDS, they don’t wear such (I think their scapular is hidden, while most of the TOCarm wear a large scapular… 6"x8" i think)

By the way I am from the Philippines.

My first spiritual director, (and a dear friend) is an OCarm priest. I attended a vocation promotion with the Discalced Carmelite Friars. Actually I can’t figure out the differences between. Both of them have a deep prayer life.