Difference between God and God the Father

  • Thread starter Thread starter Praus
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
P

Praus

Guest
Hello,

So this question bothers me for a couple of days now.

In Trinity we have a Father, a Son and a Holy Spirit. All three persons are God. I can pin down differences between the three Persons but i can’t figure out the following:
  • when praying to God do we pray to the Father person? If so then there is no difference between the two, right?
  • if there is difference who or what is God and to who do we pray when utter God. What is God beside consisted of Trinity?
Thank you.
 
Last edited:
The Trinity is Three Persons (the Father, Son and Holy Spirit) in One God.

The One God does not consist of anything else other than the Three Persons.

When you pray to “God” you are praying to all three persons at once.

When you pray to one of the persons, such as “God the Father” or “God the Holy Spirit”, you are also praying to all three persons because God the Father is part of the Holy Trinity, Three Persons in One God. The three persons are in constant communication with each other, so a prayer to one Person is communicated to all three.

A prayer to “God”, “God the Father”, “God the Son” or “God the Holy Spirit” will always reach all three persons.

I hope this helps.
 
Last edited:
Hey Tis_Bearself,

Thank you for your thought.

Correct me if i am wrong but from your (name removed by moderator)ut i get the following conclusions:
  • God is a sum of three Persons
  • when praying to one Person you are praying to all Persons
The most problematic is the first point where God is defined as a sum, so i understand your point. In this sense, if we take a metaphor to a human, he is not just a sum of identities (a father, a worker, a thinker …) but much more where he transcends all these particulars/persons/identities. If a man, according to Catholic belief, transcends its identities why God is not something more than its identities.
 
God isn’t really a “sum”. Each person is God, not 1/3 of God.
This is the diagram generally used:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

The three persons are not “identities” that God takes on, rather they are persons and each of them is God but all three are one God.

Your problem is that you’re trying to understand The Trinity, which is a holy mystery, by analogizing it to human terms. That’s not going to work.
 
Last edited:
Thank you for information, i have seen the diagram before but it doesn’t make a sense as to the points i already made.

Please bear with me but this answer is not sufficient for me since it doesn’t explain basic, principal dillemas.

When i was refering to Persons as identities i was making a metaphor in order to make a case more clear, it shouldn’t be take literal.

Some things are mysteries, even grand mysteries, but we should have to take every possible effort to explain things, that is our gift, so to speak. In this particular case there is a void in understanding what God is beside Trinity definition.
 
Praus said:
Thank you for information, i have seen the diagram before but it doesn’t make a sense as to the points i already made.

Please bear with me but this answer is not sufficient for me since it doesn’t explain basic, principal dillemas.

When i was refering to Persons as identities i was making a metaphor in order to make a case more clear, it shouldn’t be take literal.

Some things are mysteries, even grand mysteries, but we should have to take every possible effort to explain things, that is our gift, so to speak. In this particular case there is a void in understanding what God is beside Trinity definition.
Click to expand...
God is not caused. God does not change. God is not made up of parts or composed. God is not made up of material and does not have extension in space. God is not some type of conditioned reality. God is Subsistent Being. God is the foundation of, origin of, and conserving cause of all reality and no thing could possibly exist apart from him.

All we can know of God is what he’s revealed of himself and what we can learn from his effects (created reality). Aside from what he’s directly revealed about himself, our best way to understand God is by understanding what he is not.
 
What you have written are somewhat Tomistic thoughts. In this particular case i am more interested in Theology than Scolasticism.

What you have written is true. But i am interested in solving what God in ‘relation’ to Trinity. Can we talk about God as a one person? Does it have conscience or only its Persons have it?
 
No-one has been able to explain the trinity ever. It is a mystery. Not the type we can solve but the type we cherish in our hearts. God loves us. God made us. God became man and opened the gates of heaven for us and then sent the spirit of love to be with us. All God all equal all with us as long as we cling to the three who are one.
 
As someone said , you can’t understand the Holy Trinity w analogies to human identities.

As Aquinas said we can have
(1) perfect knowledge of imperfect things, OR
(2) imperfect knowledge of perfect things

But we can never have perfect knowledge of perfect things which you’re seeking

It seems (1) is more focus of society in our modern world whereas (2) was focus of society in pre-modern world
 
Bishop Barron just talked about prayer and the Trinity on his latest video. I really liked his explanation.


(at time 10:30, if my link doesn’t work right)
 
Last edited:
Praus said:
But i am interested in solving what God in ‘relation’ to Trinity. Can we talk about God as a one person? Does it have conscience or only its Persons have it?
Click to expand...
You can of course use a singular pronoun when talking about God, but it would be a mistake to think of “God” as a separate person than the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. The persons are indivisible from the Godhead and each other, and there is only one Divine Intellect and Will.
 
Praus said:
  • when praying to God do we pray to the Father person? If so then there is no difference between the two, right?
  • if there is difference who or what is God and to who do we pray when utter God. What is God beside consisted of Trinity?
Click to expand...
There is no difference between God and the Father. There is no difference between God and the Son, or between God and the Holy Spirit. Each is the One God. They are consubstantial, ie they are the same substance, the same being. Different persons but the same being.

The Athanasian Creed is a classic expression of this, and the basis for the shield of the Trinity that the Bearself posted.

When we pray to God, we pray to the One. We may address God as Father, or as Son, or as Spirit, but each is the One God. God is Father, is Son, is Holy Spirit. There is no difference between God and the Father, or God and the Son, or God and the Spirit. God exists as Father, Son, and Spirit. “Consisted” is exists together, which is almost inappropriate since the three are each the One, the same substance.

It is hard to express clearly. 😃
 
That’s really good imagery by Bishop Barron. It also makes the prayer “Through Christ Our Lord, who lives and reigns with you in unity with the Holy Spirit” that occurs at the end of the Collect at Mass and at the end of many other prayers, really take shape.

We have to keep in mind the role that each person of the Trinity plays:
God the Father is the Father
God the Son (Jesus) is our sole mediator with the Father
God the Spirit is the love between Jesus and His Father that Jesus sent to be with us when he left the earth, so we could be one in that love.
 
Last edited:
Praus said:
Hello,

So this question bothers me for a couple of days now.

In Trinity we have a Father, a Son and a Holy Spirit. All three persons are God. I can pin down differences between the three Persons but i can’t figure out the following:
  • when praying to God do we pray to the Father person? If so then there is no difference between the two, right?
  • if there is difference who or what is God and to who do we pray when utter God. What is God beside consisted of Trinity?
Thank you.
Click to expand...
A prayer to The Most Holy Trinity, to the Father, to the Son, or to the Holy Spirit, is a prayer to our one God.

Do you know the Trisagion? The Latin Church uses this on Good Friday Adoration of the Cross. God means Father, Holy and Mighty means Son, and Holy and Immortal means Holy Spirit. It is also called the Thrice Holy Hymn.

Modern Catholic Dictionary, Trisagion
The invocation “Holy God, Holy and Mighty, Holy and Immortal, have mercy on us,” which occurs in all the liturgies of the East at some point between the readings. In the Latin Rite it is sung on Good Friday as one of the reproaches during the veneration of the Cross. It also occurs in the Divine Office during penitential seasons.
Click to expand...
 
Vico said:
Do you know the Trisagion? The Latin Church uses this on Good Friday Adoration of the Cross. God means Father, Holy and Mighty means Son, and Holy and Immortal means Holy Spirit. It is also called the Thrice Holy Hymn.
Click to expand...
It’s good that you explained this, because it is now routinely said by many Western Catholics at the end of the Divine Mercy Chaplet and I’m willing to bet the vast majority of them don’t know it refers to the Trinity.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top