Different bishops per region?

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I’ve heard that if a region has both Latin Rite churches and Eastern Rite churches, there will be 2 bishops there, one for the Latin, and one for the Eastern. But how is it possible? Shouldn’t each region should have only one bishop? If so then does the Latin bishop has any influences over the Eastern bishop and vice versa?
 
Actually, since there are multiple Eastern & Oriental Churches, there can be more than simply 2 bishops in a particular area. And no, the Latin bishop has no jurisdiction in the affairs of any Eastern or Oriental eparchy/diocese that happens to coincide (in whole or in part) with the territory of the Latin diocese.

For the rest, there have been a variety of threads touching on this issue in the Eastern Catholicism forum. It might be worth a look there to get an idea.
 
They each would have their own flock. I belong in such a region. At least the Roman Archdiocese and the Ukrainian Eparchy are on different cities in the same region 😃

In one way it is absolutely necessary. One of the Bishop’s roles is to regulate public Liturgy in his diocese/eparchy. I wouldn’t want a Roman Catholic bishop regulating the Divine Liturgy the same way I wouldn’t want the Ukrainian Bishop regulating the Roman Mass. Part of it is the familiarity of laws, rules and traditions. Also, note that the hierarchy is different. The Bishop is under the Metropolitan who’s under the Patriarch or Synod of Bishops. So a Roman Catholic Bishop would be reporting to Rome, while the Ukrainian Bishop reports to Kyiv.

It would be nice if there’s one Bishop for all, as there will be better cooperation between parishes and their other entities such as schools. There are also diocesan activities that may only include parishes of the diocese, so the parishes of the Eastern Rite may not a part of it.
 
There are indeed many cases of this happening, and not only with Latin and Eastern bishops. Eastern bishops also control parishes within the same territory. My own diocese is such a case. We have Cardinal Seán as the local Latin bishop, a Melkite eparch, and then some various parishes of different Eastern Churches such as the Maronites and Ukrainians, all of whom report to different bishops. So within the Archdiocese of Boston there are probably at least five bishops in control of something there. One could imagine it being messy, yet it works somehow.
 
There are indeed many cases of this happening, and not only with Latin and Eastern bishops. Eastern bishops also control parishes within the same territory. My own diocese is such a case. We have Cardinal Seán as the local Latin bishop, a Melkite eparch, and then some various parishes of different Eastern Churches such as the Maronites and Ukrainians, all of whom report to different bishops. So within the Archdiocese of Boston there are probably at least five bishops in control of something there. One could imagine it being messy, yet it works somehow.
Yes, the Bishops aren’t really controlling the same parishes and the same priests, thats why it works. I just hope there’s more cooperation between the Bishops and the parishes in terms of activities for the same area so that all Catholics can truly be united.
 
“I just hope there’s more cooperation between the Bishops and the parishes in terms of activities for the same area so that all Catholics can truly be united.”

Here in the West, where Latins are the majority, there are plenty of opportunities for Easterns to join in the activities of the Latin (arch)diocese—youth rallies, etc. Also, pro-life activities also provide an opportunity to witness to one Faith (and for that matter, to unite with other servants of our Lord and Master our God and King).

Also, while Eucharist adoration may not be the norm for Byzantines, they are always welcome to join us Latins on the Feast of Corpus Christi for processions as a common witness to our faith in the Body and Blood of our great God and King (that being said, my own Latin church procession is not done in the public streets but rather to our outdoor shrine in our courtyard).

Likewise, Latins can be invited to major events in an Eastern parish (our Latin auxiliary bishop attended and assisted at the Maronite parish 85th anniversary Qurbono—unfortunately, he had to leave after Qurbono (Divine Liturgy)), but the Latin deacon who assists from time to time at the parish sat at the head table at the banquet, together with the Maronite bishop and some of the former pastors).
 
“I just hope there’s more cooperation between the Bishops and the parishes in terms of activities for the same area so that all Catholics can truly be united.”

Here in the West, where Latins are the majority, there are plenty of opportunities for Easterns to join in the activities of the Latin (arch)diocese—youth rallies, etc. Also, pro-life activities also provide an opportunity to witness to one Faith (and for that matter, to unite with other servants of our Lord and Master our God and King).

Also, while Eucharist adoration may not be the norm for Byzantines, they are always welcome to join us Latins on the Feast of Corpus Christi for processions as a common witness to our faith in the Body and Blood of our great God and King (that being said, my own Latin church procession is not done in the public streets but rather to our outdoor shrine in our courtyard).

Likewise, Latins can be invited to major events in an Eastern parish (our Latin auxiliary bishop attended and assisted at the Maronite parish 85th anniversary Qurbono—unfortunately, he had to leave after Qurbono (Divine Liturgy)), but the Latin deacon who assists from time to time at the parish sat at the head table at the banquet, together with the Maronite bishop and some of the former pastors).
I’m actually trying to get this started in our Archdiocese/Eparchy. I have started talks with the Archdiocese’s Religious Education Office about bringing catechism students over for Divine Liturgy as part of their education in the Catholic faith. Also, thanks to Alexander Roman who has written a wonderful Akathist for Pope John Paul II, we will pray that Akathist on May 1st and I plan on inviting the Archdiocese to the Ukrainian Cathedral for it.

But I was hoping for better cohesion in activites. My experience in the past is that while the Roman Catholics and Ukrainian Catholics do have some sort of cooperation, most events are not cross promoted. I always say, our Church is filled with many great philosophers and theologians, but we also need some businessmen and marketeers. Thats where lay people should come in and help.
 
Also, pro-life activities also provide an opportunity to witness to one Faith (and for that matter, to unite with other servants of our Lord and Master our God and King).
I actually saw a beautiful example of this at this year’s March for Life in Washington D.C. At the vigil Mass there was a Ruthenian bishop who participated in the liturgy, along with several Eastern priests and deacons. They made themselves quite present with their Eastern vestments. Later that night the same Ruthenian bishop lead about 200 people in compline, most of them Latin Catholics who were quite impressed with what they saw. It was a great sharing of traditions, and a good sign of unity between East and West.
 
I actually saw a beautiful example of this at this year’s March for Life in Washington D.C. At the vigil Mass there was a Ruthenian bishop who participated in the liturgy, along with several Eastern priests and deacons. They made themselves quite present with their Eastern vestments. Later that night the same Ruthenian bishop lead about 200 people in compline, most of them Latin Catholics who were quite impressed with what they saw. It was a great sharing of traditions, and a good sign of unity between East and West.
Is this photo and this one from that Mass? Are there other photos of that Mass of Compline?

Orthodox clergy were very visible on the speakers stand when Met. Jonah again spoke. The closing prayer before the March began was an Orthodox priest. (Those sections were almost all I saw of the EWTN coverage.)
 
Is this photo and this one from that Mass? Are there other photos of that Mass of Compline?

Orthodox clergy were very visible on the speakers stand when Met. Jonah again spoke. The closing prayer before the March began was an Orthodox priest. (Those sections were almost all I saw of the EWTN coverage.)
Compline is Evening Prayer. Its one of the Hours, not a mass.
 
I’ve heard that if a region has both Latin Rite churches and Eastern Rite churches, there will be 2 bishops there, one for the Latin, and one for the Eastern. But how is it possible? Shouldn’t each region should have only one bishop? If so then does the Latin bishop has any influences over the Eastern bishop and vice versa?
Yes, according to the most ancient canons, a geographical territory can only have one proper bishop.

The jurisdictional regulations of the Catholic Church is a somewhat unique (“somewhat” because we are not the only communion that possesses it). It exists due to exigent realities within the Catholic communion. In the ancient Church, when a Christian of one ritual Tradition moves into a region of another ritual Tradition, that Christian simply adopts the ritual Tradition of his/her new home. If enough Christians of a certain ritual Tradition exist in the new region, then the proper bishop of that region will (should) provide for the liturgical needs of the group, yet that group will remain under the omophor of the local hierarch.

But the (bad) experience of the Eastern Catholic Church in the U.S. changed all this. In the late 19th/early 20th century, Eastern Catholics came to the U.S., but the local Latin hierarchs were not good pastors to these Eastern Catholics. This resulted in a Pope providing the Eastern Catholics with their own bishop. So what we have in the Catholic Church are “ritual jurisdictions” (more properly called “personal jurisdictions”) within territorial jurisdictions. In Western countries, the Traditional territorial jurisdiction is held by Latin bishops, while the personal jurisdictions are held by Eastern or Oriental bishops. In Traditionally Eastern (normally some Mediterranean or Eastern European country) or Oriental (normally Middle East, India, or Africa) territories, it is the Eastern or Oriental bishop which holds the territorial jurisdiction, while the Latin bishop holds a personal jurisdiction (NOTE: the existence of this principle in Traditionally Eastern or Oriental lands came about through a different set of circumstances than what was experienced by Eastern Catholics in the U.S.).

The system works because we understand that “jurisdiction” applies properly to people and not to land.

The Catholic communion is not the first to exercise this ecclesiastical exigency. The Oriental Orthodox Church first realized the value of the principle of “ritual (personal) jurisdiction within territorial jurisdiction” back in the early second millenium, a forced reality due to conflicts between the Coptic and Syriac Orthodox Churches over jurisdiction. So today, for example, the Syriac Orthodox in Egypt are under the direct omophor of a Syriac hierarch, not the local Coptic hierarch.

The principle of “ritual (personal) jurisduction within territorial jurisdiction” is prominent in the Catholic and Oriental Orthodox communions because there is more than one Tradition in these communions (the OOC have at least 3, while the CC have many more). The principle does not really exist in the Eastern Orthodox Church because there is only one Tradition in the EOC: the Byzantine-Constantinopolitan Tradition. (Interestingly, the fact that there is only one Tradition within EO’xy causes it to have more problems with jurisdictionalism than the OOC or CC, which EO admit is a problem).

There is currently one particular Catholic Church that still exercises the ancient patristic standard - the Ethiopian Catholic Church. There, the Latin Catholics are under the omophor of the local Oriental Catholic hierarch.

Blessings,
Marduk
 
Is this photo and this one from that Mass? Are there other photos of that Mass of Compline?

Orthodox clergy were very visible on the speakers stand when Met. Jonah again spoke. The closing prayer before the March began was an Orthodox priest. (Those sections were almost all I saw of the EWTN coverage.)
As Aramis pointed out, this was not Mass, but part of the hours. This was however not the Compline done in the Latin Church, but what I assume was the Byzantine equivalent. Both pictures are from Compline. The Ruthenian bishop was present also at Mass, but he was one of about 30 (if I counted correctly) other bishops, all of whom were Latin.
 
Do the Eastern Bishops then invited to important events like Bishop confereces and/or councils?
 
Do the Eastern Bishops then invited to important events like Bishop confereces and/or councils?
Yes. The USCCB has a separate “Region” subcouncil for the ECCs.
Yes, according to the most ancient canons, a geographical territory can only have one proper bishop.

The jurisdictional regulations of the Catholic Church is a somewhat unique (“somewhat” because we are not the only communion that possesses it). It exists due to exigent realities within the Catholic communion. In the ancient Church, when a Christian of one ritual Tradition moves into a region of another ritual Tradition, that Christian simply adopts the ritual Tradition of his/her new home. If enough Christians of a certain ritual Tradition exist in the new region, then the proper bishop of that region will (should) provide for the liturgical needs of the group, yet that group will remain under the omophor of the local hierarch.
…]
The principle of “ritual (personal) jurisduction within territorial jurisdiction” is prominent in the Catholic and Oriental Orthodox communions because there is more than one Tradition in these communions (the OOC have at least 3, while the CC have many more). The principle does not really exist in the Eastern Orthodox Church because there is only one Tradition in the EOC: the Byzantine-Constantinopolitan Tradition. (Interestingly, the fact that there is only one Tradition within EO’xy causes it to have more problems with jurisdictionalism than the OOC or CC, which EO admit is a problem).

There is currently one particular Catholic Church that still exercises the ancient patristic standard - the Ethiopian Catholic Church. There, the Latin Catholics are under the omophor of the local Oriental Catholic hierarch.

Blessings,
Marduk
The EO have done likewise in western lands in the 20th Century. Especially the US, where 8 distinct EO churches have overlapping jurisdictions.
 
Yes. The USCCB has a separate “Region” subcouncil for the ECCs.

The EO have done likewise in western lands in the 20th Century. Especially the US, where 8 distinct EO churches have overlapping jurisdictions.
It has grown, now there are 10.
  1. Ukrainian Greek CC:
    Metropolitan Archeparchy of Philadelphia, PA
    Eparchy of Stamford, CT
    Eparchy of Saint Nicholas of Chicago, IL
    Eparchy of Saint Josaphat in Parma, Ohio
  2. Byzantine (Ruthenian) CC:
    Metropolitan Archeparchy of Pittsburgh, PA
    Eparchy of Passaic, New Jersey
    Eparchy of Parma, Ohio
    Eparchy of Holy Protection of Mary of Phoenix, AZ
  3. Maronite CC:
    Eparchy of Saint Maron of Brooklyn, NY
    Eparchy of Our Lady of Lebanon of Los Angeles, CA
  4. Melkite Greek CC:
    Eparchy of Newton, MA
  5. Armenian CC:
    Eparchy of Our Lady of Nareg, New York (USA and Canada)
  6. Chaldean CC:
    Eparchy of Saint Thomas the Apostle of Detroit, MI
    Eparchy of Saint Peter the Apostle of San Diego, CA
  7. Romanian Greek CC:
    Eparchy of Saint George’s in Canton, Ohio
  8. Syrian CC:
    Our Lady of Deliverance of Newark, New Jersey
  9. Syro-Malabar CC:
    Eparchy of St Thomas of Chicago, IL
  10. Syro-Malankara CC:
    Exarchy of United States of America (Hempstead, NY)
 
It has grown, now there are 10.
You’re listing the Catholics. I was talking SCOBA. But there are 10, not 8, there, as well.

In the order listed on SCOBA.US

  1. *]Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America
    *]Serbian Orthodox Church in North and South America
    *]Romanian Orthodox Archdiocese in the Americas
    *]Orthodox Church in America
    *]Moscow Patriarchate in the USA (ROCOR, post reunion, IIUC)
    *]Antiochian Orthodox Christian Archdiocese of North America
    *]American Carpatho Russian Orthodox Diocese in the USA
    *]Bulgarian Eastern Orthodox Church
    *]Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the USA
    *]Albanian Orthodox Diocese of America
 
*]Moscow Patriarchate in the USA (ROCOR, post reunion, IIUC)
Actually, this was one is the for the parishes that remained under the MP when the OCA was spun off in 1970, overseen by a titular bishop headquartered at St. Nicholas Cathedral in New York. It may be that he also represents the ROCOR bishops post-reunion as well, but i don;t know for sure.
 
You’re listing the Catholics. I was talking SCOBA. But there are 10, not 8, there, as well.

In the order listed on SCOBA.US


  1. *]Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America
    *]Serbian Orthodox Church in North and South America
    *]Romanian Orthodox Archdiocese in the Americas
    *]Orthodox Church in America
    *]Moscow Patriarchate in the USA (ROCOR, post reunion, IIUC)
    *]Antiochian Orthodox Christian Archdiocese of North America
    *]American Carpatho Russian Orthodox Diocese in the USA
    *]Bulgarian Eastern Orthodox Church
    *]Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the USA
    *]Albanian Orthodox Diocese of America

  1. Sorry I misunderstood.
 
Are there any Eastern or Oriental bishops who reside in the same city as a Latin bishop (anywhere in the world)?

Are there any Eastern bishops who reside in the same city as an Oriental bishop (anywhere in the world)?

Blessings,
Marduk
 
Are there any Eastern or Oriental bishops who reside in the same city as a Latin bishop (anywhere in the world)?

Are there any Eastern bishops who reside in the same city as an Oriental bishop (anywhere in the world)?

Blessings,
Marduk
Detroit, Pittsburgh, Phoenix, just off the top of my head. All have latin and at least one eastern bishop.
 
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