Different religion

[PJM]

=ThePerson;10440267]She told me yesterday that she doesn’t believe that one should have to go to church once a week to go to heaven. She wants a religion that she can practice wherever she is, especially if that place does not have a church. She also doesn’t agree with some of the teachings. For example, she doesn’t agree with the teachings on some of the modern issues.

God permits us to choose hell just as he permits one conditionally to choose heaven.

Your friend seems to be blaming “theee Church” for What God Himself commands.

Actions ALWAYS have consequences. Sooner or later one must, and certainly WILL pay for their personal choices.

She could “just start her own church”. If she chooses to deny the CC it would result in the same judgment.

Let het know this and PRAY for her.

God Bless,
PJM/pat

 

[guanophore]

thought i’d add to this-- i know quite a few non-praticing catholics-- the bible says “raise them up in the Lord, and when they are “old” they will not depart”

the reality of “end of life” is an eye opener–

as for rules in the catholic church i believe there are 1276 , where in the OLD testament there are only 613

I am sure there have been many more rules than this over the millenia. There is a major difference between Catholic canon law, though. and the OT Law. The Mosaic Law, and all the Levitical laws emanating from it were for the purpose of defining the people of God within their culture. The Catholic canon law is to govern the members of the Church in matters pertaining to daily life. While the Levitical and Mosaic laws could not be changed, Church canon laws do change.

 

[PJM]

=guanophore;10466597]I am sure there have been many more rules than this over the millenia. There is a major difference between Catholic canon law, though. and the OT Law. The Mosaic Law, and all the Levitical laws emanating from it were for the purpose of defining the people of God within their culture. The Catholic canon law is to govern the members of the Church in matters pertaining to daily life. While the Levitical and Mosaic laws could not be changed, Church canon laws do change.

Originally Posted by 1answer
thought i’d add to this-- i know quite a few non-praticing catholics-- the bible says “raise them up in the Lord, and when they are “old” they will not depart”

the reality of “end of life” is an eye opener–

as for rules in the catholic church i believe there are 1276 , where in the OLD testament there are only 613

Interestering

What is the Source for this number? My copy of Canon Law shows “2,414”.

God Bless,
pat/PJM

 

[1answer]

Originally Posted by 1answer
thought i’d add to this-- i know quite a few non-praticing catholics-- the bible says “raise them up in the Lord, and when they are “old” they will not depart”

Darn i guess my copy of the baltimore catechism must be wrong-- so thanks for the update on the number or ordanaces:tiphat:

[/QUOTE]

 

[1toolbox]

Originally Posted by ThePerson
I am not sure exactly where to put this, so I put it here. My friend is considering converting to another religion outside of Catholicism, which she has been part of since she was born. I have tried to talk her out of it, but she has made up her mind, and as her friend I have decided to respect her decision. She was baptized as a baby. Is there anything official she has to do to leave the Church? She is going to continue going to a Catholic school since she loves the small classes and teachers. The problem is, we go to mass once a month as a school. What should she do about that. I am asking because she is too afraid to ask for herself. Also, I am curious, if she leaves the church, but comes back, will she have to be baptized again? Any answers would be appreciated, thank you.

hello i interested in what religion is this person considering to be come identified with?

as i have known many former catholics that attend other denominations, and they have found peace and contentment with other assemblies… but the counsel of trent did anamithia everyone out side of the catholic religion, but as you can see that this has not stopped people from seeking spiritual answers and results - else where…

each protestant domination offers a part that appeals to one’s individual intelligence and spiritual maturity.

 

[PJM]

=1toolbox;10548833]Originally Posted by ThePerson
I am not sure exactly where to put this, so I put it here. My friend is considering converting to another religion outside of Catholicism, which she has been part of since she was born. I have tried to talk her out of it, but she has made up her mind, and as her friend I have decided to respect her decision. She was baptized as a baby. Is there anything official she has to do to leave the Church? She is going to continue going to a Catholic school since she loves the small classes and teachers. The problem is, we go to mass once a month as a school. What should she do about that. I am asking because she is too afraid to ask for herself. Also, I am curious, if she leaves the church, but comes back, will she have to be baptized again? Any answers would be appreciated, thank you.

hello i interested in what religion is this person considering to be come identified with?

as i have known many former catholics that attend other denominations, and they have found peace and contentment with other assemblies… but the counsel of trent did anamithia everyone out side of the catholic religion, but as you can see that this has not stopped people from seeking spiritual answers and results - else where…

each protestant domination offers a part that appeals to one’s individual intelligence and spiritual maturity.

OR One MUST ADD in doing so VERY likely chosing eternal damnatio in theprocess:

And NO, it’s not my opinion [although I agree with tis truth]

Heb. 6: 2-8
[caps for emphasis not shouting]
TAKE NOTE THAT WHEN THESE WORDS WERE WRITTEN THE ONLY GOD; FAITH AND “CHURCH” WAS TODAYS CC.

"Of the doctrine of baptisms, and imposition of hands, and of the resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. And this will we do, if God permit. For it is impossible** for those who were once illuminated,GRANTED GRACE 4 TRUE FAITH singular]] have tasted also the heavenly gift,[CATHOLIC EUCHARIST] and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,[SAC. OF CONFIRMATION]] Have moreover tasted the good word of God,CORRECT BIBLE TEACHINGS] And are fallen away: to be renewed again to penance, [SAC. OF CONFESSION] crucifying again to themselves the Son of God, and making him a mockery. For the earth that drinketh in the rain which cometh often upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is tilled, receiveth blessing from God.*** But that which bringeth forth thorns and briers, is reprobate, and very near unto a curse, whose end is to be burnt***

“IMPOSSIBLE” here does NOT mean that repentace can’t take place; only that Gods necessary grace to do so will be difficult to attain.

One God
Founded only His One Church
& w/ it Only One set of faith beliefs.

There is absolutely NO doubt that choosing to leave the CC is choosing to Abandon God!
Amen:bigyikes:

We MUST serve God HIS WAY; period!

Let us pray for those fooling and selfish enough to have made such a choice

 

[ffg]

thought i’d add to this-- i know quite a few non-praticing catholics-- the bible says “raise them up in the Lord, and when they are “old” they will not depart”

the reality of “end of life” is an eye opener–

as for rules in the catholic church i believe there are 1276 , where in the OLD testament there are only 613

Only 1276?

I would figure you would have to credit at least 1 a year, has to be 2000+.

edit, ah I see some other answers caught me, didn’t scroll down.

Should not knowing all the laws one’s country has on the books be a cause to depart (or deport)?

 

[aspirant]

My friend is considering converting to another religion outside of Catholicism… she has made up her mind… Is there anything official she has to do to leave the Church?

It is no longer possible to formally defect from the Catholic Church. If she starts practicing another religion, she simply starts practicing another religion.

we go to mass once a month as a school. What should she do about that.

If attendance is obligatory for students, including non-Catholic students, she should probably continue to attend. While there, she does not have to do anything that would violate her religion or conscience. If she is practicing another religion, she should no longer receive the Eucharist.

If attendance is not obligatory for non-Catholic students, she might opt out.

if she leaves the church, but comes back, will she have to be baptized again?

No. She would go to the sacrament of reconciliation.

 

[valerie10]

OR One MUST ADD in doing so VERY likely chosing eternal damnatio in theprocess:

And NO, it’s not my opinion [although I agree with tis truth]

Heb. 6: 2-8
[caps for emphasis not shouting]
TAKE NOTE THAT WHEN THESE WORDS WERE WRITTEN THE ONLY GOD; FAITH AND “CHURCH” WAS TODAYS CC.

"Of the doctrine of baptisms, and imposition of hands, and of the resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. And this will we do, if God permit. For it is impossible** for those who were once illuminated,GRANTED GRACE 4 TRUE FAITH singular]] have tasted also the heavenly gift,[CATHOLIC EUCHARIST] and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,[SAC. OF CONFIRMATION]] Have moreover tasted the good word of God,CORRECT BIBLE TEACHINGS] And are fallen away: to be renewed again to penance, [SAC. OF CONFESSION] crucifying again to themselves the Son of God, and making him a mockery. For the earth that drinketh in the rain which cometh often upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is tilled, receiveth blessing from God.*** But that which bringeth forth thorns and briers, is reprobate, and very near unto a curse, whose end is to be burnt***

“IMPOSSIBLE” here does NOT mean that repentace can’t take place; only that Gods necessary grace to do so will be difficult to attain.

One God
Founded only His One Church
& w/ it Only One set of faith beliefs.

There is absolutely NO doubt that choosing to leave the CC is choosing to Abandon God!
Amen:bigyikes:

We MUST serve God HIS WAY; period!

Let us pray for those fooling and selfish enough to have made such a choice

hello i would like to know the commentary you are referring to on Hebrews 6, as i have not seen that use of these verses used to justify the sacraments

thanks i would guess this commentary is common knowledge some where on this catholic answers forum

 

[Utwo2]

OR One MUST ADD in doing so VERY likely chosing eternal damnatio in theprocess:

And NO, it’s not my opinion [although I agree with tis truth]

Heb. 6: 2-8
[caps for emphasis not shouting]

TAKE NOTE THAT WHEN THESE WORDS WERE WRITTEN THE ONLY GOD; FAITH AND “CHURCH” WAS TODAYS CC.

"Of the doctrine of baptisms, and imposition of hands, and of the resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. And this will we do, if God permit. For it is impossible** for those who were once illuminated,GRANTED GRACE 4 TRUE FAITH singular]] have tasted also the heavenly gift,[CATHOLIC EUCHARIST] and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,[SAC. OF CONFIRMATION]] Have moreover tasted the good word of God,CORRECT BIBLE TEACHINGS] And are fallen away: to be renewed again to penance, [SAC. OF CONFESSION] crucifying again to themselves the Son of God, and making him a mockery. For the earth that drinketh in the rain which cometh often upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is tilled, receiveth blessing from God.*** But that which bringeth forth thorns and briers, is reprobate, and very near unto a curse, whose end is to be burnt***

“IMPOSSIBLE” here does NOT mean that repentace can’t take place; only that Gods necessary grace to do so will be difficult to attain.

One God
Founded only His One Church
& w/ it Only One set of faith beliefs.

There is absolutely NO doubt that choosing to leave the CC is choosing to Abandon God!
Amen:bigyikes:

We MUST serve God HIS WAY; period!

Let us pray for those fooling and selfish enough to have made such a choice

Heb. 6: 2-8
[caps for emphasis not shouting]

TAKE NOTE THAT WHEN THESE WORDS WERE WRITTEN THE ONLY GOD; FAITH AND “CHURCH” WAS TODAYS CC.

are u sure??

saint paul as some people say wrote hebrews around 65 ad, and temple worship was in place at that time–

and saint paul was said to be warning the people that they could not go back to animal sacrifice, as pointed out in hebrews chapter 5- because Jesus was the completed and perfect sacrifice- and no longer bull and goats could do the job.

i don’t believe the sacramental system of today CC was in place at this time–

all though Baptism is mentioned in this section of verses- so obviously that was part of saint paul commentary

. and further more the heavenly gift was said to be the baptism of the Holy Spirit and all of it’s manifestations…as in Acts 19 – in that paul said have you received the Holy Spirit

so i also m interested in this unusual sacramental commentary you have posted, and where you copied it from.

thanks

i m guessing that the counsel of trent had something to do with it

 

[Offdoodykcrn]

… and saint paul was said to be warning the people that they could not go back to animal sacrifice, as pointed out in hebrews chapter 5- because Jesus was the completed and perfect sacrifice- and no longer bull and goats could do the job.

There is quite a bit of debate about the Letter to the Hebrews - but one thing most scholars agree on: Paul didn’t write it. The syntax and style are very different from the other writings that are attributed to Paul - among other issues. It’s not quite as controversial as the Book of Revelations, but it’s something to keep in mind when referencing it.

 

[guanophore]

hello i would like to know the commentary you are referring to on Hebrews 6, as i have not seen that use of these verses used to justify the sacraments

thanks i would guess this commentary is common knowledge some where on this catholic answers forum

Actually our understanding of these verses does not come from a commentary, but from the Sacred Tradition, which is explained in the catechism.

The imposition of hands is a reference to ordination.

Being illuminated and tasting of the heavenly gift is a reference to the Eucharist.

Partaking of the Holy Ghost is something one can only do if one has expereinced the sacraments of initiation (baptism, confirmation and eucharist).

What have you seen this passage used for?

 

[guanophore]

 Heb. 6: 2-8

[caps for emphasis not shouting]

TAKE NOTE THAT WHEN THESE WORDS WERE WRITTEN THE ONLY GOD; FAITH AND “CHURCH” TODAYS CC.

are u sure??

Yes. Jesus only founded one Church. It was Catholic. The entire New Testament was written by, for, and about Catholics.

saint paul as some people say wrote hebrews around 65 ad, and temple worship was in place at that time–

We don’t know who wrote Hebrews, but it does reflect a lot of fundamentals about Jewish Temple practices and beliefs. The writer is trying to help the Hebrew Christians understand how Christ fulfills all the prophesies and sacrifices that prefigured him.

and saint paul  was said to be warning the people that they could not go back to animal sacrifice, as pointed out in hebrews chapter 5- because Jesus was the completed and perfect sacrifice-  and no longer bull and goats could do the job.

No doubt. But the reason they could not go back is that they had become baptized Catholics.

i don't believe the sacramental system  of today CC was in place at this time--

What is a “sacramental system”?

I don’t think Paul wrote Hebrews, but that is a moot point. Certainly he wrote I and II Corinthians, and it is clear that in 50 AD, quite before the letter to the Hebrews, Paul had received the Sacraments, and was teaching about them, as well as ordaining bishops to offer them to the flock of God.

all though Baptism is mentioned in this section of verses- so obviously that was part of saint paul commentary

It is curious that all Christians believed that these verses were about the sacramental life, up until very recently when Christians insisted on reading them apart from the faith that produced them.

. and further more the heavenly gift was said to be the baptism of the Holy Spirit and all of it’s manifestations…as in Acts 19 – in that paul said have you received the Holy Spirit

No one who was not baptized was admittted to the Eucharist. The writer of Hebrews refers to “tasting” of the heavenly gift, which is what we do when we receive the Body and Blood of the Lord.

But I do agree with you, baptism of the HS does make us partakers of His grace, and the manifestations of the Spirit, given for the common good.

so i also m interested in this unusual sacramental commentary you have posted, and where you copied it from.

It may seem unusual to you because you seem to come from a faith tradition that has been separated from the Apostolic faith for as much as 500 years. During that time, each generation has drifted further and futher from the One Faith taught by the Apostles.

i m guessing that the counsel of trent had something to do with it

Certainly the council of Trent reinforced and reiterated the Apostolic Teaching on the nature of the sacraments.

 

[PRmerger]

each protestant domination offers a part that appeals to one’s individual intelligence and spiritual maturity.

Yes. This is the essence of creating a god in one’s own image and likeness: let me look for the church that conforms to my own views on matters.

Rather, it would seem that the appropriate paradigm is this: let me look for the Church that Christ founded, and then conform my views to Christ’s.

 

[SteveVH]

There is quite a bit of debate about the Letter to the Hebrews - but one thing most scholars agree on: Paul didn’t write it. The syntax and style are very different from the other writings that are attributed to Paul - among other issues. It’s not quite as controversial as the Book of Revelations, but it’s something to keep in mind when referencing it.

We don’t know everyone involved in the writing of Genesis either. It really makes no difference. Hebrews was proclaimed by the Church as an inspired text, just as was the Book of Revelation. That is the only way any of us know that the texts of the Bible are inspired; because the Church made that judgment. The inspired nature of the texts is not dependent upon the opinions of various Bible scholars. It really doesn’t matter who wrote Hebrews. It is an inspired text, regardless.

 

[PRmerger]

We don’t know everyone involved in the writing of Genesis either. It really makes no difference. Hebrews was proclaimed by the Church as an inspired text, just as was the Book of Revelation. That is the only way any of us know that the texts of the Bible are inspired; because the Church made that judgment. The inspired nature of the texts is not dependent upon the opinions of various Bible scholars. ** It really doesn’t matter who wrote Hebrews.** It is an inspired text, regardless.

Exactly right, Steve.

And here’s the thing: to any non-Catholic Christian who is recusant to the authority of the Catholic Church, the authorship of Hebrews ought to be very, very important. It ought to be of supreme import.

Why?

Because if you don’t know who wrote Hebrews how can you know it’s inspired? How can you know that the author was a witness to the Resurrection or spent time with the apostles who did witness the Resurrection?

Now, of course, the Catholic answer is: it doesn’t matter who wrote Hebrews because we submit to the authority of the CC to tell us this.

But the non-Catholic Christian ought to be very, very troubled by the idea that authorship is obscure. Very troubled indeed! :sad_yes:

 

[SteveVH]

Exactly right, Steve.

And here’s the thing: to any non-Catholic Christian who is recusant to the authority of the Catholic Church, the authorship of Hebrews ought to be very, very important. It ought to be of supreme import.

Why?

Because if you don’t know who wrote Hebrews how can you know it’s inspired? How can you know that the author was a witness to the Resurrection or spent time with the apostles who did witness the Resurrection?

Now, of course, the Catholic answer is: it doesn’t matter who wrote Hebrews because we submit to the authority of the CC to tell us this.

But the non-Catholic Christian ought to be very, very troubled by the idea that authorship is obscure. Very troubled indeed! :sad_yes:

Absolutely. Great point!

 

[robertreborn]

There is quite a bit of debate about the Letter to the Hebrews - but one thing most scholars agree on: Paul didn’t write it. The syntax and style are very different from the other writings that are attributed to Paul - among other issues. It’s not quite as controversial as the Book of Revelations, but it’s something to keep in mind when referencing it.

yes thanks … BUT PJM has referenced that as if it was a pauline writing (some where)-- and yes i m aware of the disputes–

The Berean: Hebrews 5:12-14
www.theberean.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/…/Hebrews-5-12-14.htm
(14) But solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained … (1) Brothers, I could not address you as spiritual but as worldly—mere infants in Christ.

1 Corinthians 3:1 Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as …
bible.cc/1_corinthians/3-1.htm
But I, brothers, could not address you as spiritual people, but as people of the flesh, as … the distinctions which you do make, so far from being a proof of mature judgment, … Hebrews 5:13 Anyone who lives on milk, being still an infant, is not …

as with most of saint paul’s writings the “theme” follows the scripture

 

[robertreborn]

Exactly right, Steve.

And here’s the thing: to any non-Catholic Christian who is recusant to the authority of the Catholic Church, the authorship of Hebrews ought to be very, very important. It ought to be of supreme import.

Why?

Because if you don’t know who wrote Hebrews how can you know it’s inspired? How can you know that the author was a witness to the Resurrection or spent time with the apostles who did witness the Resurrection?

Now, of course, the Catholic answer is: it doesn’t matter who wrote Hebrews because we submit to the authority of the CC to tell us this.

But the non-Catholic Christian ought to be very, very troubled by the idea that authorship is obscure. Very troubled indeed! :sad_yes:

interesting dialog-- but iam interested in your understanding of the biblical you hve on getting direction and hearing from the Holy Spirit-- ? because a lot of mental rational issues of scripture interpretation is altered when you become a “temple” or receptacle of the holy spirit-- and function as in 1 cor ch 12, and ch 14-- which allows you to understand romans 8 much better

 

[PRmerger]

interesting dialog-- but iam interested in your understanding of the biblical you hve on getting direction and hearing from the Holy Spirit-- ? because a lot of mental rational issues of scripture interpretation is altered when you become a “temple” or receptacle of the holy spirit-- and function as in 1 cor ch 12, and ch 14-- which allows you to understand romans 8 much better

I look to the faith which gave us the Scriptures for guidance in the “mental rational issue of Scripture interpretation.”