Difficult marriage situation

[St_Francis]

If we were to get a civil marriage, abstain from intimate relations and get married in the church later, would it be a grave sin to still live together? It’s just not possible for financial and practical reasons for us to have separate living places.

Obviously we’d sleep in separate rooms. I know the church looks down on Co habitation but, isn’t that because they assume there is fornication going on?

Why would you do that to her? She will be alone in a country where she doesn’t know anyone or have anywhere to go.

It is true that sometimes people have an amazing long-distance (skype/phone/etc) and then when they meet, things are different. Suppose they are different for the two of you? Suppose they are different just for her?

She should come, prepared with a place to live—it doesn’t have to be an entire apartment just for her, she could live with roommates or a family, for instance—and a ticket back to the Philippines, so that if it’s not working out for her, she in not entirely reliant only on you. Only if you let her have the freedom to go can you know that she is marrying you freely.

 

[z_0101]

she should come, prepared with a place to live—it doesn’t have to be an entire apartment just for her, she could live with roommates or a family, for instance—and a ticket back to the philippines, so that if it’s not working out for her, she in not entirely reliant only on you. Only if you let her have the freedom to go can you know that she is marrying you freely.

^^^^ yes, this ^^^^

 

[Reuben_J]

Hi, I was wondering if I could get some advice about my difficult marriage situation? I’m feeling guilty about my marriage plan.

I’ll try to keep our story short. I met an amazingly faithful, sweet and loving Catholic woman. She helps bring me closer to God every day. We pray together and share our faith daily. I’m super blessed having her in my life. The only thing is that she lives in the Philippines! Never in my life did I expect to fall in love with someone so far away. But, I can’t help but believe that is was part of God’s Plan. BTW, I’m 31 and she’s 27.

After talking for hours every day for many, many months, I flew to the Philippines to see her. We went to church to pray together often and at the end of my trip there after evening mass, I proposed to her at the Cathedral.

We are now waiting for the Government to approve her Fiance Visa. It could be anywhere from 2-5 months at this point.We always assumed that we would get married in the Catholic church where I live. But, we discovered some bad news.

First the US government requires that we get married within 90 days. While, the Catholic church requires that we take classes for 6 months before getting married. A deacon at my church said there were no exceptions.

Next, I never got confirmed when I was a teenager. Even though I went to all my classes. I’m in RCIA right now to become confirmed but, that’s 6 months away…

So, as you can see this puts us in a tough spot! We want to do things the right way and get married in the church but, it’s not looking good. The deacon recommended that she comes here, get a civil marriage but, live separately, and stay celibate for what could be up to a year after she’s here…

Unfortunately, this just seems super unrealistic to both of us for obvious reasons. Also, even if I wanted to, I can’t afford a house payment and a apartment (1300 a month for the cheapest here). I would also feel terrible to have her be alone after coming from a totally different culture and place.

So, what we are planning is to be married by a protestant pastor friend of mine after she gets here. Then after my confirmation, take the 6 months of classes and have our marriage convalidated by the church. It’s the only way we can figure out to do this…

It really sucks because we’d love to be married in the church and do things the right way… Also, is it true that even if we were married we’d be committing the sin of premarital sex because we both are Catholic and fall under Canon law?

Does anyone have any suggestions! I feel like a bad Catholic. Thanks!

First of all, congratulation to both of you in finding each other despite the differences in cultures and the countries where you live respectively. It shows that true love transcend all barriers.

It is not uncommon for Catholics in some countries to obtain civil marriage before being married in the church. The former is to be legally married from the state point of view. Thus the deacon’s suggestion is a good one except it is not being practical for you in term of financial expenditure. If you can afford it, that would be good.

I can see that it would take at least two trips for her. She has to come for the civil marriage and get all church requirements done, like seeing the deacon together, attend the pre-marriage course (2 - 3 days) and set the date for the wedding in the church. So get your pre-marriage course date fixed first before she comes to minimized time.

She then will return to the Philippines until the wedding.

The other alternative is to get married in the Philippine if it can be done with least hustle.

Do not go the Protestant pastor to get married. Start on the right footing as a Catholic couple.

Waiting time for your marriage is reasonable. Six months to a year, again is not uncommon for a couple intending to get married. Don’t let that to discourage you.

May God bless both of you.

 

[Jasonrt85]

Thank you, It makes sense what you are all saying. I appreciate that you all are standing up for doing it the right way.

We don’t feel like we are rushing things. If anything we both feel like we are having to be really patient! But, we realize that our sacrifices will be worth it. Because we will be together forever. That’s why I posted this thread because, I was feeling concerned about doing the right thing for God and my future wife.

I totally understand the outside perspective and the general stereotype about this type of relationship. We are both completely in love and are marrying out of our free will. We are both ready with God’s help for any trials we may face.

Besides my great love for this woman I know in my heart that I am following God’s will in marrying her. When I was praying in the Cathedral in Cebu with her, God cleary spoke to me, “look at her” and as I looked over she was praying deeply. Then, he said “Jason, this is Lovely, your wife”. It was after this evening mass when I got down on one knee and proposed to her.

 

[Jasonrt85]

This may seem harsh - but what the heck, I am 70, and seen more than at times I cared to.

Yes, it is legalistic. For a reason.

Let me put it this way: I had an epiphany many many years ago: I realized, much to my utter amazement, that the Church in 2,000 years had achieved much more wisdom than I had at an age close to yours.

The Church reflects on Scripture and has been doing so from the very beginning; and the Church is extremely aware of what it means to be human - including our inclination to sin, and our inclination to be less than totally self-honest. And most of that is our tendency to think “I…” in other words, we tend to think about what we want or don’t want; we are self-centered and cocksure that we know what is best.

And we don’t know what is best - at least to the extent that we can conform our acts to what is true. The Church teaches us what is true; but too often, we want our own way (“I” again).

There is a vast difference between being smart, and being wise. You are at the beginning of wisdom. It would do you - and her - well to look to the guide which Christ left us - the Church.

And I can guarantee that following the Church will not always be fun. But then, we were not promised “fun”, but rather, the means to eternal life.

Choose life.

No this doesn’t seem harsh! Great post, thank you!

 

[Jasonrt85]

First of all, congratulation to both of you in finding each other despite the differences in cultures and the countries where you live respectively. It shows that true love transcend all barriers.

It is not uncommon for Catholics in some countries to obtain civil marriage before being married in the church. The former is to be legally married from the state point of view. Thus the deacon’s suggestion is a good one except it is not being practical for you in term of financial expenditure. If you can afford it, that would be good.

I can see that it would take at least two trips for her. She has to come for the civil marriage and get all church requirements done, like seeing the deacon together, attend the pre-marriage course (2 - 3 days) and set the date for the wedding in the church. So get your pre-marriage course date fixed first before she comes to minimized time.

She then will return to the Philippines until the wedding.

The other alternative is to get married in the Philippine if it can be done with least hustle.

Do not go the Protestant pastor to get married. Start on the right footing as a Catholic couple.

Waiting time for your marriage is reasonable. Six months to a year, again is not uncommon for a couple intending to get married. Don’t let that to discourage you.

May God bless both of you.

Thank you! I think this is a great idea. But, I looked into it and they wont let her leave and come back with the Visa requirements… If she leaves it’s determined legally that we have decided not to go ahead with the marriage. The government makes it tricky for a Catholic marriage!

 

[Jasonrt85]

Why would you do that to her? She will be alone in a country where she doesn’t know anyone or have anywhere to go.

It is true that sometimes people have an amazing long-distance (skype/phone/etc) and then when they meet, things are different. Suppose they are different for the two of you? Suppose they are different just for her?

She should come, prepared with a place to live—it doesn’t have to be an entire apartment just for her, she could live with roommates or a family, for instance—and a ticket back to the Philippines, so that if it’s not working out for her, she in not entirely reliant only on you. Only if you let her have the freedom to go can you know that she is marrying you freely.

We’re getting married out of true love and following God’s will, as He has spoken to us. We would wait to do the civil marriage just before the legal requirement. So, that would give us about 2-3 months more together in person before we make that commitment.

Not saying it’s a good idea but, the most loving older couple I know, told me that they only knew each other for 5 days before they were married. But, they both knew they were meant to be and kept God at the center of their relationship. I think it’s a testament to God’s plan and the graces he provides!

 

[Reuben_J]

Not saying it’s a good idea but, the most loving older couple I know, told me that they only knew each other for 5 days before they were married. But, they both knew they were meant to be and kept God at the center of their relationship. I think it’s a testament to God’s plan and the graces he provides!

Asking to give it time to know each other is just out of concern so that you are sure what you are getting into. But it is true too in that it is not a guarantee of a good marriage, which is one that is centered on God, where you are committed to make it works and in fidelity to God and to the marriage vows. From your posts it seems that is your direction and it’s good. Trust God that He will find a way for both of you.

God bless.

 

[thistle]

We asked and it would be 6 months there too. But, good idea.

abogadomo.com/law-professor/law-professor-archives/foreigners-and-marriage-in-the-philippines

 

[freshwind]

Have you considered some meetings with the Deacon via Skype?
Technology introduced you to each other, maybe it can help the time pass more quickly?

Hoping it all works out for you two.

 

[thistle]

You do not need to be Confirmed to be married in the Catholic church. It is preferred, but not required. Also, not all churches have a 6 month waiting period. Some only 4 and this is not a “law” and can be waived. Check around…

congratulations!

It is a requirement but with a possible exception. You should talk to the priest where your RCIA classes are about this matter.

Can. 1065 §1 Catholics who have not yet received the sacrament of confirmation are to receive it before being admitted to marriage, if this can be done without grave inconvenience.

 

[poche]

I have been to a number of weddings where the sacrament of Confirmation was part of the ceremony. Why not see if that is an option where you live.