Dilemma over friendship

  • Thread starter Thread starter Rose71
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
R

Rose71

Guest
I hope this is the right place to post my question:confused:

I am in my late 30s and I have never been married. Like many other women brought up in a Catholic household within a close family unit, I have always had the confidence, faith and self-respect to not get into a serious sexual relationship for the sake of it i.e. to conform to society’s expectations and avoid feeling like the ‘odd one out’.

I am well-educated and I like to think no fool. I have worked hard and have a good job. I am not driven by material gain (otherwise I could have quite easily married before but that’s another story!)

Anyway, a year ago, by complete chance, I met a man who blew my mind. We go talking and his outlook on life seemed very similar to mine. We just clicked straight away and he invited me to join his interest group.

I joined and have got to know him better. The more I got to know him, the more I like this man. At a party recently, he made it quite clear that he finds me attractive and I must admit I am very, very attracted to him. Not just in a lustful way either: I so find him physically attractive, but I also genuinely feel a deeper connection.

😦 sadly, he is divorced. We have met up together, separately from the group once, in public, so obviously nothing happened. I really do like this man and I know I want to keep seeing him. I would be happy with a platonic friendship if that is all we can have, but I am gutted - totally gutted.

I feel I have to stick to my beliefs (otherwise what is the point of having them) but I see couples at Mass who everyone knows co-habited before they married; couples being allowed to marry with their children as bridesmaids; couples where the husband has had a vasectomy etc., I also see women who have married for a comfortable lifestyle. It seems that at the moment, the world is full of people who have managed to ‘bend’ the rules but are still ‘respectable’ if that makes sense?

All I wanted was this man, who leads a very simple life and has been kind and good to me for a year now. He is not a serial philanderer and as far as I know, his wife left him (I know - there are 2 sides etc)

So: question 1…when do I bring up the issue that I am a practicing Catholic and so there is no chance of me sleeping with him - but I would like to continue the friendship?

Question 2…I am only human and I pray that I will not be tempted to start a physical relationship with him (I’ve managed up until now - but I feel this is different) If we do end up just kissing or similar, what then?! I can’t help thinking he is possibly the one - but early on in a relationship, how do you bring up the whole concept of annulment?:confused:

Question 3: I know some people will say forget him - find other friends and move on. The only way I have managed to stay true to my principles this far is by valuing the gift of friendship and if I can do nothing else, I want to offer him that gift. It is possible (inevitable actually - as anyone who lives in a rural community will know) that tongues will wag and the ‘no smoke without fire’ brigade will be out in full force speculating about what we are up to.

To me, reality is more importnat than appearance and I would rather cultivate a serious but platonic if necessary relationship with a man I genuinely love than marry a Catholic man who I feel nothing special for - or marry a previously unmarried, baptised Catholic is a Catholic church - having actually been sleeping together for a few years and using contraception (as seems to be the norm, I’m afraid)

This is a very difficult time for me, as I do not want to throw away the chance to develop a really great friendship for the sake of ‘keeping up appearances’ Having said that, I know that by doing so, as a mere mortal, I am putting myself voluntarily in the way of temptation.

😉 okay - that’s it - my little problem. If anyone, anywhere can offer any advice - please do! Thanks
 
My heart goes out to you as I read this and I admire you so much! I can’t wait to see how the more “learned” posters reply to this one. I want to know what the Catholic church would advise you to do, because I just keep coming back to the whole “forgiveness” thing. Forgive his divorce - right? I really do not know the answer to your questions, but I am praying right now that you will receive the help you need. This forum has helped me in many areas of my life and I know you will find the wisdom you are looking for. God Bless you and your friend.
 
I know you are hurting and venting, but you have set up a false dichotomy-- either this divorced, non-Catholic man or a sorry excuse for a Catholic with cohabitation and contraception. So, much of your dilemma is not a dilemma at all as neither of these are wise choices. Choose only God’s best, which may be a devout and practicing Catholic who shares your vision of marriage and family. They are out there. I did not get married until I was 38, because I was unwilling to marry any man who did not share my vision, values, and practice of the Faith. And, God blessed me super-abundantly with the most wonderful husband in the world. He was 43 because he too refused compromise and waited until he found me.

However, if this man seems to be marriage material in your estimation, then you should pursue a serious discussion with him that includes your expectations regarding the practice of religion in the household (ie, raising children Catholic, following Catholic moral teaching, his ideas about religions and faith, etc) and also discuss what he is willing to do regarding his prior marriage. If he is willing to pursue a decree of nullity, then he can do so. If/when he becomes available to date (after nullity is declared) then you have a future with him.

Until such time, yes, he can only be a friend and friendship doesn’t include kissing and romance. If it become too painful to be “just friends” then you may indeed have to discontinue the friendship. That is if he does not, cannot, or will not get a determination on his prior marriage through the Tribunal.

So, it’s best to lay it all out there now. If either of you starts to get attached and none of this has been discussed-- or worse, his first marriage is found to be valid-- then your romantic feelings will likely cause you to short circuit your rational decision making areas of the brain and lead you to make very unwise choices.
 
Don’t trade on your beliefs at all.

This man may be sent into your life to cement what you really believe you want. He may or may not be that man.

You will know by HIS behavior. If he presses for you to compromise your beliefs, he is not your man. If when he finds out you are a staunch Catholic who believes sex is meant for marriage, he respects that, then you take it to the next step. If he does not respect that and walks, or ridicules Church teaching, or pushes for intimacy anyway, then he is not your man. And you have been given an indication of a side of him that maybe his ex wife knows and why she walked.

Truly happy women do not walk away from good men. There is a side to that story you don’t know. If he is the man for you, and he wants to deepen your relationship, he won’t balk at the idea that his Christian marriage would have to undergo the annulment process in order for him to be free to marry a Catholic.

Before everyone screams at how unfair that is, let me tell you a story about someone who was in an invalid marriage. She got her annulment. She was “in love” with a man who had been married. She didn’t want to make him go through the annulment process. Well, folks, the unexamined life truly isn’t worth living. She changed churches to accomodate her love for this man. They married outside the Catholic church. She moved in with him. Within a year she was whining about his faults and failings. The same problems that caused his previous marriage to fail now were her problems. He hadn’t gone through that examination process… maybe he was still married in God’s eyes to someone else. Who knew.

No one can tell you what to do. But trading personal self respect for a public image is a surefire ticket to unhappiness. It’s like moving into a house with termites. Might look good on the outside for a while, but you don’t know what is eating at the foundation of all those other peoples’ lives.

To thine own self be true.
 
Thank you for the replies - all very helpful and it is wonderful to know there are people out there who have taken the time to help me:)

I am going to continue meeting him as a friend and I hope he continues to be a good friend. I will be careful not to give him false hopes.

However, there is no way (unles things change radically) that we will stop seeing one another because above all I value him as a person and enjoy his company. I can’t help the fact that I find him attractive, but I have complete free will over what I do about it.

Sadly, although I have always wanted to marry a good Catholic man and help create a warm, loving and holy home, I have yet to meet a man who is genuineley a practicing Catholic who can genuinely and wholeheartedly accept my career and way of life.

I do nothing immoral, illegal, or against the teaching of the Church (bet you were wondering;) )However, I do a physically demanding job and I work mostly with men in the great outdoors. This means I perhaps hear opinions and language that would make my mother blush! Living in a fairly rural area, I have had a choice of either being very lonely, or befriending people whose beliefs are different to mine. All my friends know and accept I am a Catholic and many have said they admire me for it (because I don’t tend to steal husbands / jump head-long into relationships etc!!!) and that I am a very caring person. In short, I am well used to taking cold showers, sticking to my guns and developing a thick skin and I genuinely believe it has made me appreciate my faith even more.

The downside is, when I meet intelligent, single Catholic men , they seem tame and priggish to me (I don’t mean that having moral standards is priggish - but their attitude to those who have not had the benefit of a stable and holy family life and Christian education often saddens me) and I perhaps appear too strong, worldly and independent for them when what I really want is a husband I can look up to as head of the household; to support and inspire him and be loved and respected in return. If I feel I am physically and emotionally stronger than a potential life partner, I’m sorry to sound old-fashioned and sexist, but I believe the relationship has no chance of working.

It’s like I really want the supporting role, but I keep getting pushed into the driver’s seat. My friend that I find probably much too attractive actually looks after me and is not afraid of me. Without any sort of physical contact, or overtly sexual behaviour - he makes me feel like a proper lady, not a sort of scary, untouchable super-woman that everyone admires, but nobody would actually want to keep in the house. (I’ve got Malinois Syndrome:rolleyes: )

I guess for now I’ll just keep on praying and taking cold showers!!!

Thanks again for your kind words and thoughts:thumbsup:
 
start sharing your faith with him.
who knows, maybe he’s a catholic in the making 👍
 
I am confused. If you are friends, then how come he does not already know you are a practicing Catholic?
I guess I am not certain how that topic does not come up? All my friends and even my co-workers know that I am a practicing Catholic.

Get that topic out on the table and see what his reaction to it. Get the conversation going about a decree of nulity - if he is Catholic.
 
You are being very Christlike in your behavior. He didn’t avoid people. He walked among them and didn’t change His teachings. He was pure love. You seem to do that with your friends. I completely understand. You meet people where they are and love them unconditionally and don’t lower your standards. You may be the only “bible” some of these people read. Good for you! 👍

No one said you can’t be friends with this divorced man. Even divorced people need friends. :rolleyes:

I understand what it’s like to want someone who is not intimidated by your outlook and what you are used to. Somewhere out there is a man who won’t run in the other direction. Don’t settle. Wait for him.

(Have you looked at military guys? Some of them are very devout but not shy, rough around the edges and might appreciate an outdoorsy girl.)
 
I was thinking the same thing! Not every perfect man is Catholic yet… but every perfect man is a potential Catholic! My husband was a nominal (lame) Catholic, and I was a protestant -(born-again) before getting married. Now we are both faithful, zealous, orthodox Catholics. He nudged me towards Catholicism and then I dragged him deeper into it than he ever wanted to go! We are both so happy now!
 
Rose - you sound so much like me. Strong-minded, intelligent, happy in a traditionally male occupation? Is that you?

I, too, got tired of fending off the men who wanted to be mistletoe to my oak. Feh! They were a dime a dozen. Then there were the ones who wanted to “conquer” me and turn me into a good, submissive girly…

Now I’m happily married to Mr. Right; our 13th anniversary is the 22nd. He’s the head of the household because I respect him - and he respects me.

Here’s a funny for you. I was frequently accused of being a lesbian. I had a lesbian friend who told me that my whole problem in life is that I was a lesbian in a hetero body. After DH and I had dated for a while, he told me that many of the women he had asked out replied, “Sorry, I’m a lesbian.”

We were obviously made for each other!! 😃

Let things like your faithful Catholicism come up when they come up. It’s possible, if you have mutual friends, that he already knows. One way of “casually” letting him know would be to invite him to Mass.

God bless you,

Ruthie
 
Trials come and trials are hard. But it’s during them that we must be strong in our beliefs. Not just when it’s easy. Otherwise, as you say, what point having them? Some of the trials are mind-numbing. I’m still collecting myself from one that was two years ago. I thought that girl was for me. On Monday the 2nd was the second anniversary of the break-up. Religious matters were nearly the only dividing factor. But I could never be with a woman knowing she were using potentially abortifacient contraceptives, it was already hard being in a premarital relationship (which does not mean premarital sex) with someone not pro-life, albeit a very dear friend. Same thing that made her fall for me, made her drop me. Don’t go there or things may end up badly. Wouldn’t be so sure if just friendship is possible in such circumstances. Wish you the best, but you must bring it up and the sooner the better. Less pain if you don’t let feelings grow on an uncertain ground.
 
I’m really glad I posted on here - everyone has been so helpful and objective.

Ruthe’s post made me laugh: I sometimes feel I should go around with a T-shirt on saying ‘Not a Lesbian - Not a Marriage-Wrecker - Not even a Potential Marriage-Wrecker’ when I visit some farms for the first time and get the third degree from the wives before they let me go riding off on the back of the bike with their husbands.

I think in my line of work, you do have to develop a sort of robust sense of humour and keep the flirting to very tongue-in-cheek with people you know really well. You get used to not sending out any signals, no matter how you might actually be feeling and realise that if you don’t feed your infatuation, it will eventually die off!

I’m really pleased to hear that there is hope for me and that there are other people who understand what how it feels to be in this situation.

The reason he does not know I am a Catholic yet is because there has never been a reason to bring it into the conversation, because so far we have just been making eachother laugh and having a good time in eachother’s company. I’m seeing him again this weekend, so that will be as good a time as any to mention I’ve been to Mass.

Could I ask one more favour? Could you pray that I do mention it: that I manage not to make him feel judged and rejected if he presses me on my views on divorce and that we can stay friends?

🙂
 
i’ll be glad to pray Rose. and i reiterate ike’s advice:
However, if this man seems to be marriage material in your estimation, then you should pursue a serious discussion with him that includes your expectations regarding the practice of religion in the household (ie, raising children Catholic, following Catholic moral teaching, his ideas about religions and faith, etc) and also discuss what he is willing to do regarding his prior marriage. If he is willing to pursue a decree of nullity, then he can do so. If/when he becomes available to date (after nullity is declared) then you have a future with him.
Click to expand...
Until such time, yes, he can only be a friend and friendship doesn’t include kissing and romance. If it become too painful to be “just friends” then you may indeed have to discontinue the friendship. That is if he does not, cannot, or will not get a determination on his prior marriage through the Tribunal.
Click to expand...
So, it’s best to lay it all out there now. If either of you starts to get attached and none of this has been discussed-- or worse, his first marriage is found to be valid-- then your romantic feelings will likely cause you to short circuit your rational decision making areas of the brain and lead you to make very unwise choices.
Click to expand...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top