Dinosaurs and the Flood

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The Church’s views on evolution are clear
What is infallibly clear is that the idea that human beings emerged from blind, unintelligent, evolutionary (Darwinian) causes is false - condemned. God is the creator of human beings - we must accept that. The Church permits various evolutionary views, but there is nothing given to reconcile how God supposedly created the evolutionary process, to what extent it is “random” and to what extent God intervened. There is no infallible teaching that requires Catholics to reject pure Creationism either. From that, we have a long history of saints and doctors of the Church to consult.
 
What is infallibly clear is that the idea that human beings emerged from blind, unintelligent, evolutionary (Darwinian) causes is false - condemned.
Yes, atheism is condemned. No kidding. Evolution does not require atheism. There are plenty of Christians who believe in evolution. A billion or so, seems to me.
 
I have suspected that the reason why the idea of original sin was created was actually that christianity was inventing the reason for its own existence. We need it for salvation.
Without Jesus (and, by extension, the church), we are all lost. We are all guilty.
It’s really quite remarkably clever if you think about it.
From a historical perspective, the doctrine of original sin does arise from a debate that made the claim that Jesus is not necessary for salvation. (Augustine was attempting to refute the claims of Pelagius, who asserted that people can, essentially, ‘save themselves’ by merely deciding to live sin-free lives.)

However, although the doctrine of original sin might have the appearance of being rather convenient, clever, and self-serving, I think that we can argue on Biblical grounds that this is what is implied in the inspired Scriptural texts.

After all, Adam and Eve did possess something prior to their sin “in the garden”, and they did lose it when they were ejected from the garden, never to return. Then, their children, too, inherited the effects of their fall. (After all, Cain and Abel didn’t get to live in the garden and take their chances with the tree, did they?)

So, I think it’s fair to say that the dynamic of the narratives in the first few chapters of Genesis paint a picture of the human race having inherited the consequences of the first sin. (Note that you’ll find figurative narrative among these chapters, so I’m not making the case that we must believe these narratives as if they were literal historical fact. Nevertheless, even in their figurative constructs, a picture is being painted.)
 
I would like to see the document that reversed long held teaching.
I think we’ve been here before. I post the speech, you say it’s not magisterial, I ask if you’re claiming he taught error, you never answer.
 
I would like to see the document that reversed long held teaching.
It is your claim that the Church has been teaching error for all these many years, and that there is some binding ancient teaching that countermands the current teaching. Can you support that extraordinary claim?
 
Yes, atheism is condemned. No kidding. Evolution does not require atheism. There are plenty of Christians who believe in evolution. A billion or so, seems to me.
I think you’re misunderstanding. Standard evolutionary theory claims that human beings are the product of blind, material elements alone. Atheism or not, that’s what it says. There is no mainstream evolutionary theory that says that God did something in the process. There’s no study - “evidence of supernatural influence”, as there has been with the Shroud of Turin for example, where scientists explained the Shroud as an artifact of supernatural power.
There really isn’t even any very qualified theological theories on theistic evolution. I am open to any that you might propose. I’d think that billions of theistic evolutionists would have some clear scientific theories on it. When did God create the first human beings? Evolution says humans evolved from animals, and most evolutionists say that the difference between human and animal is a matter of mutation and selection - that is, material difference. Even aspects of the soul, rationality, religion, conscience - are claimed as materialist evolutionary by-products all for the advantage of survival and reproductive success.
So, the challenge is with the theistic evolutionist.
Teilhard Chardin attempted to create a scientific, theistic-evolutionary theory.
I think that’s about the best that is out there so far.
 
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There is no mainstream evolutionary theory that says that God did something in the process.
There is also no gravitational theory that says God did something in the process. There is no germ theory that says God did something in the process. There is no quantum mechanical theory that says God did something in the process. I could go on, but I assume you get the point.
 
Pope Benedict XVI stated that intelligent design and what he referred to as creative reason undergirds evolution. That is the teleology long held by the Church. Evolution, blind unguided chance, denies this.

Easter Homily -“The creation account tells us, then,that the world is a product of creative Reason.” - perhaps the pope would like IDvolution.

Pope Benedict: Easter brings us to the side of reason, freedom and love “It is not the case that in the expanding universe, at a late stage, in some tiny corner of the cosmos, there evolved randomly some species of living being capable of reasoning and of trying to find rationality within creation, or to bring rationality into it. If man were merely a random product of evolution in some place on the margins of the universe, then his life would make no sense or might even be a chance of nature. But no, Reason is there at the beginning: creative, divine Reason.”
 
Pope Benedict XVI - "No one will be able to cast serious doubt upon the scientific evidence for micro-evolutionary processes. R. Junker and S. Scherer, in their ‘critical reader’ on evolution, have this to say: ‘Many examples of such developmental steps [micro-evolutionary processes] are known to us from natural processes of variation and development. The research done on them by evolutionary biologists produced significant knowledge of the adaptive capacity of living systems, which seems marvelous.’ They tell us, accordingly, that one would therefore be quite justified in describing the research of early development as the reigning monarch among biological disciplines. … Within the teaching about evolution itself, the problem emerges at the point of transition from micro- to macro-evolution, on which point Szathmáry and Maynard Smith, both convinced supporters of an all-embracing theory of evolution, nonetheless declare that: ‘There is no theoretical basis for believing that evolutionary lines become more complex with time; and there is also no empirical evidence that this happens.’"
 
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I could go on, but I assume you get the point.
Yes, those theories do not talk about the creation of human beings, which is something directly caused by God. So, they do not need to reference God.
 
Yes, those theories do not talk about the creation of human beings, which is something directly caused by God. So, they do not need to reference God.
Considering God created the universe out of nothing…
 
St John Paul II? Pius XII? Benedict XVI?
They offered scientific theories of theistic evolution? I don’t think so. They just claimed that if such theories existed, they would be ok for us (within many limits). I’m saying none exist.
 
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