Direct Sterilization

[melissaricker]

Hello.
Would like some answers on this if I could on direct sterilization…
I was admitted into a Catholic Hospital due to an ectopic pregnancy. The following day,my doctor comes into the room to tell me that it is “imperative that I need to get both tubes removed” due to the size of the right tubular one I have and to PREVENT me from having another tubular in the future on my left one", and if the hospital didn’t agree to it, they would have to transport me to another hospital to have it done.
I was pretty “out of it”, doctor apparently got me to sign the consent form…
After recovery, and the cloud of the drugs were finally out of my system, I requested my medical records from the hospital to see what “Happened to Me”…
The doctor lies on my medical records and stated: "The patients extreme desire to be sterilized’~!!! WHAT??? He tells my fiance & my mother that I needed or was going to have me transported to another hospital.
I am completely heartsick over this.

What are the policies of the Catholic Church on this??? If I had “known” what was really going on, I would have NEVER agreed to such a procedure. NOT to mention the amount of drugs I was on. Being UNABLE to conceive again was never explained to me. Not that I would have remembered, but where are my rights?

I went into that hospital thinking I had an infection… I came out never able to children again…
Who do I talk to about this?

 

[mcmitton]

Oh, my! I am SO sorry.

I’m neither a medical nor legal person. However, I think an attorney could make inquiries and also the hospital should/could have a medical review board hearing on the matter.

No one on pain meds or clearly not alert and cognizant should be able to make such a decision.

My best wishes and prayers for you, your fiance, and your family.

 

[melissaricker]

Thank you.

I am just at a loss over this…
This pregnancy was planned from the beginning. I was at the hospital a couple of weeks before and they initially told me I miscarried.
But, then when I went back for pain, this is when they tell me I am still pregnant and had to have it surgically removed.
No real answers, just that I was pregnant. I was about 12 weeks (approx). I have no idea if the fetus was alive (never said to me), or how many fetus’s (I already have twins)…
I really thought I had just an infection from losing the baby when I went back the second time. Nothing was explained about the ectopic and I am sad about this.
Then, I wake up completely sterile…

No real explanation.

 

[1ke]

Hello.
Would like some answers on this if I could on direct sterilization…
I was admitted into a Catholic Hospital due to an ectopic pregnancy. The following day,my doctor comes into the room to tell me that it is “imperative that I need to get both tubes removed” due to the size of the right tubular one I have and to PREVENT me from having another tubular in the future on my left one", and if the hospital didn’t agree to it, they would have to transport me to another hospital to have it done.
I was pretty “out of it”, doctor apparently got me to sign the consent form…
After recovery, and the cloud of the drugs were finally out of my system, I requested my medical records from the hospital to see what “Happened to Me”…
The doctor lies on my medical records and stated: "The patients extreme desire to be sterilized’~!!! WHAT??? He tells my fiance & my mother that I needed or was going to have me transported to another hospital.
I am completely heartsick over this.

What are the policies of the Catholic Church on this??? If I had “known” what was really going on, I would have NEVER agreed to such a procedure. NOT to mention the amount of drugs I was on. Being UNABLE to conceive again was never explained to me. Not that I would have remembered, but where are my rights?

I went into that hospital thinking I had an infection… I came out never able to children again…
Who do I talk to about this?

I am sorry this happened to you.

The Church teaches direct sterilization is a grave sin.

Regarding your rights: I think you need to get a lawyer regarding what your rights are and what to do.

You don’t have culpability for sin here, if you are asking that-- you didn’t sin, you were drugged and that impaired your ability to freely make a choice. But, you mention a *fiance *and not a husband, so perhaps reflect on the Church’s teaching regarding premarital sex as well as the Church’s teaching on sterilization.

 

[Totterman]

Jesus,our Lords peace be with You.
Sorry for my bad english, (Finnish citizen) dear friend,I am so sorry. I can’t give any medical or legal advices,but I can be a human for You,carrying a bit of Your burden. As a man I don’t know how a woman looks on it,but I am a father and I guess I would have lost all sence in that situation. What they did to You was wrong,and You don’t have a need to think You would have commited a sin. All the rest is in my heart,and once again,I am so sorry.
Pater noster;qui est in caelis,
sanctificetur nomen tuum.
Fiat voluntas tua sicut in caelo et in terra.
Panem nostrum quotidianum da nobis hodie.
Et dimitte nobis debita nostra,
sicut et nos dimittimus debitorimus nostris.
Et ne nos inducas in tentationem.
Sed libera nos a malo.
Amen.

 

[melissaricker]

Thank you for all of your responses.

He is my fiance. We were and are still planning on getting married, but this put a hold on things due to my “recovery”. It took a few months to recover, when they removed the fetus, they had to perform a C-section. Recovery was rough and sad at the same time.
Now we are just trying to understand it all… It did take a few weeks for that “drug fog to lift” off of me.

I did seek legal representation for this. But my thoughts are with the hospital. Who decided my fate? Who decided that removing a perfectly healthy tube was considered to be “my best interest”? What reason did he have to suggest direct and complete sterilization for me? If it was not medically necessary, then why bother? This doctor put pure fear into myself and fiance about this removal.

So many unanswered questions.

 

[Mark77]

Thank you for all of your responses.

He is my fiance. We were and are still planning on getting married, but this put a hold on things due to my “recovery”. It took a few months to recover, when they removed the fetus, they had to perform a C-section. Recovery was rough and sad at the same time.
Now we are just trying to understand it all… It did take a few weeks for that “drug fog to lift” off of me.

I did seek legal representation for this. But my thoughts are with the hospital. Who decided my fate? Who decided that removing a perfectly healthy tube was considered to be “my best interest”? What reason did he have to suggest direct and complete sterilization for me? If it was not medically necessary, then why bother? This doctor put pure fear into myself and fiance about this removal.

So many unanswered questions.

**So sorry to hear of your dilemma. You are in my prayers!

Unfortunately, in today’s world of massive lawsuits, most Doctors no longer put the patients best interests first. They must resort to the safest measure to protect their career & their practice, even if it means like in your case, that permanent measures like sterilization & abortion are often performed to minimize future risk to the Doctor from malpractice lawsuits!

That is why it is so critical that every Catholic know what the Church teaches & have a representatives designated as health care agents, along with a “will to live” in case you cannot speak for yourself.

Here is the USCCB Respect Life Program resource page;usccb.org/prolife/programs/rlp/2010/resources.shtml

Priests for Life ha a “Will to Live” document specific to each state here;
priestsforlife.org/store/p-250-will-to-live.aspx

NRTL “Will to Live” here; nrlc.org/euthanasia/willtolive/StatesList.html
**
Sancta Maria, Mater Dei, Ora Pro Nobis Peccatoribus!

mark

 

[LemonAndLime]

I said a Hail Mary for you. I am so sorry that this happened

Everyone else has given good advice already - so I just want to say that yes you should seek legal representation and no, it was not a sin.

Thinking about you in this very difficult time. Make sure to contact your local Priest to make him aware of this.

 

[melissaricker]

Thank you again for the prayers and advice. I really need it.

I plan on talking about this to my priest and his thoughts on this. I am unsure if the church is involved with the practices of our local Catholic Hospital. I do hope to get some answers from him. Maybe he may be able to put some light onto what happened.

As for medical malpractice, this is where it gets tricky for me. It wasn’t medically necessary for him to remove a perfectly healthy tube, or nor was it right to even suggest that it was. And then backtrack to say it was my idea…

I do realize that the ectopic was large, in my case, he had said it was the “largest” he had ever seen… I don’t know if he just wanted to open me up just out of curiosity as to “how” large it really was…

 

[1ke]

Thank you for all of your responses.

He is my fiance. We were and are still planning on getting married,

You said in a prior post that this was a planned pregnancy. Yet you are not married. You know the Church teaches that premarital sex is a grave sin against the sixth commandment. You seem very unconcerned about your own sin in this situation.

I’m finding it difficult to grasp your indignation that a doctor at a Catholic hospital would suggest sterilization or actually do a sterilization while you yourself seem to be ignoring Catholic teaching on morality.

I am **not **referring to his unethical behavior in doing the procedure without informed consent and the scenario as it played out. I am referring to your pot-calling-the-kettle-black attitude towards the doctor ignoring Church teaching on one aspect of the sixth commandment while you are busy ignoring another aspect of the sixth commandment.

I did seek legal representation for this. But my thoughts are with the hospital. Who decided my fate? Who decided that removing a perfectly healthy tube was considered to be “my best interest”? What reason did he have to suggest direct and complete sterilization for me? If it was not medically necessary, then why bother? This doctor put pure fear into myself and fiance about this removal.

So many unanswered questions.

Well, that’s what the lawyer is for, to get answers and to hold them accountable for any wrong-doing.

 

[LemonAndLime]

I am **not **referring to his unethical behavior in doing the procedure without informed consent and the scenario as it played out. I am referring to your pot-calling-the-kettle-black attitude towards the doctor ignoring Church teaching on one aspect of the sixth commandment while you are busy ignoring another aspect of the sixth commandment.

The problem is not the Doctor ignoring Church teaching on sterilisation, but a medical error he made. He did not sterilise her out of will but, perhaps, because he thought it was necessary to save this woman’s life. Therefore in his own opinion he was not sinning at the time, and probably wasn’t because although misguided, uninformed and a bad doctor he was not intentionally sterilising her based on her choice.

Also, I think you’re being very insensitive by going on about her sin so much. She had a planned pregnancy out of marriage, yes. But that does not justify what happened to her nor make what the doctor did equally bad, what he did was worse. You seem to imply that she deserved it.

 

[EmergencyOps]

Thank you for all of your responses.

He is my fiance. We were and are still planning on getting married, but this put a hold on things due to my “recovery”. It took a few months to recover, when they removed the fetus, they had to perform a C-section. Recovery was rough and sad at the same time.
Now we are just trying to understand it all… It did take a few weeks for that “drug fog to lift” off of me.

I did seek legal representation for this. But my thoughts are with the hospital. Who decided my fate? Who decided that removing a perfectly healthy tube was considered to be “my best interest”? What reason did he have to suggest direct and complete sterilization for me? If it was not medically necessary, then why bother? This doctor put pure fear into myself and fiance about this removal.

So many unanswered questions.

So sorry to hear about it. Many posters have given you great resources and have given you great advice. In regards to “your best interest”, hospitals are becoming known for doing what is actually in their best interest. What could still be a normal pregnancy suddenly has “complications”, and the Doctor and his team perform what are known as “interventions”. One intervention begets another intervention, which begets another intervention.

A great documentary to watch is ‘The Business of Being Born’. You can see the shockingly high cesarean-section rate and the reasons behind it. So many mothers-to-be end up in a drug-induced fog, as you found yourself.

-Mark

 

[melissaricker]

Yes, you are correct about the sin on premarital sex, and this issue has come up with him and I and we do plan to rectify. Now because of this, it has put a strain on us. He has no children and he wanted more than anything to have one with me. Now, we cannot have one together.

My concerns were Catholic Hospital policies. My ectopic could not have been that imminent or they would have done it that night (so I thought). Instead, they waiting until the following day around 1:00 to perform the surgery (according to my mother).
After admitting me into the hospital, the nurse came into my room to “medicate me”…And it was against my wishes. I tried 3 x’s to tell her that I do not take pain meds. She went against my wishes and told me that it was “doctors orders” and that “people beg for this drug that come in here”.
I know in my heart that I would not have wanted this to happen to me if I were of sound mind and body.
There was nothing wrong with my left tube. His response was “to prevent FUTURE ectopics”…

I didn’t realize that he could predict my future…

 

[1ke]

Yes, you are correct about the sin on premarital sex, and this issue has come up with him and I and we do plan to rectify. Now because of this, it has put a strain on us. He has no children and he wanted more than anything to have one with me. Now, we cannot have one together

I am sorry this has put a strain on you and that he is mourning the loss of fatherhood. Perhaps you can consider adopting more children when sufficient time has passed.

My concerns were Catholic Hospital policies. My ectopic could not have been that imminent or they would have done it that night (so I thought). Instead, they waiting until the following day around 1:00 to perform the surgery (according to my mother).
After admitting me into the hospital, the nurse came into my room to “medicate me”…And it was against my wishes. I tried 3 x’s to tell her that I do not take pain meds. She went against my wishes and told me that it was “doctors orders” and that “people beg for this drug that come in here”.
I know in my heart that I would not have wanted this to happen to me if I were of sound mind and body.
There was nothing wrong with my left tube. His response was “to prevent FUTURE ectopics”…

I didn’t realize that he could predict my future…

I understand you are grieving the loss of your fertility. But, I’m not understanding what it is you want here on this board.

The Church’s teaching is clear, and Catholic hospitals are to follow the ethical guidelines established by the Church.

No one here can speak for this particular hospital, nurse, or doctor except them. From your account of the situation, it does not sound like they acted properly. That is a matter for civil law.

You can also write to your bishop and report the situation if you feel the staff acted in an unethical or immoral manner or that they violated standards of care and Catholic teaching.