Disability rights or rights to know how our money is spent?

[Bill_7154]

That’s not the point, though. If I’m working with my (currently largely untreated) disability, my 30 or 40 hour week is the equivalent, in energy, to your 80 hour week. If I have to go in on a specific set schedule, 8 hours a day for 5 or days a week, I have nothing left after that in terms of energy. I can barely manage to cook food. If I have a bit of extra energy I might manage to do laundry. I use 80 hours a week as an analogy for what life as a disabled person can be like.

I understand this. PPL with major mental illness use up a lot of energy on activities of daily living, where working people generally use little to no energy on this. But this is not true for me. As I said I use all my vacation (6 weeks/yr) all my sick time, and extra unpaid time for sick time every year (becuase of my mental illness) so I’m closer to being in your boat than in most working ppl’s boats.

Many ppl believe that if you collect money and get free health care for being disabled you should contribute in some way to society (i.e. volunteer, etc) as a way of compensating the taxpayers who are paying for your living out of their pockets. I dont’ think that’s unreasonable for someone who is long term disabled, if it’s going to be for a yr or 2 (which it hardly ever is) I would see it differently, that they should just collect and gather their wits and get back on the horse.

Peace,
Bill

 

[Bill_7154]

In my case, the disability probably isn’t permanent, if I could get proper care. What frustrates me is that the care I need is incompatible with holding down a job right now. .

Consider yourself greatful and get a p/t job and save every penny for school. Any job, the highest pay you can get, but any job, you can earn $1050/month without them touching your check. IN a yr that’s 12K.

If you do that and get a llive in job you can live for free. With MH experience there are a lot of live in jobs available, then work hours for the rest to earn 1K/month.

Peace,
Bill

 

[Bill_7154]

I got my B.A. with the understanding that I would .

I don’t even have a BA and I earn 36K/yr. It’s poverty for a family of 3 after taxes and medical but it’s not $7 or $8/hr. I’m ashamed I make so little. But it’s my life. I would love to go back to school to be able to make 70K/yr and there are some 2yr degrees where you can do that. I"m not picky, at this point in my life making money any way is priority, beggers can’t be choosers.

Peace,
Bill

 

[maryjk]

I don’t even have a BA and I earn 36K/yr. It’s poverty for a family of 3 after taxes and medical but it’s not $7 or $8/hr. I’m ashamed I make so little. But it’s my life. I would love to go back to school to be able to make 70K/yr and there are some 2yr degrees where you can do that. I"m not picky, at this point in my life making money any way is priority, beggers can’t be choosers.

Peace,
Bill

See, this is what I would think everyone would want to do. Work toward being self sufficient. It doesn’t make sense to me to plan on 6 or more years of school with no guarantee that you will be able to use that degree.

It seems that the OP wants her cake and to eat it too. Yes, you may be disabled, but that doesn’t mean that you should have whatever health care you deem necessary, not having to work at a job and the freedom to attend school without interruption.

Able bodied people can’t do that.

Maybe you should work on getting well. THEN, if you can do that, you will be able to work and go to school without interference from your parents.

 

[Pug]

Let’s face it, if you could earn 80% of your salary from not working, and it was guarenteed for life, you probably would do it.

No, I wouldn’t. (You didn’t ask me, but the assumption seems to be that people would choose this.) I would rather work if it is feasible. But then, I have a job that I can do without it causing many additional long term physical or mental problems. If the job was destroying what remained of my health, I’d quit before it was completely destroyed, presumably.

Perhaps I am simply lucky to have a job that is not destructive. If most jobs are, then I get your point entirely.

 

[DarkLight]

See, this is what I would think everyone would want to do. Work toward being self sufficient. It doesn’t make sense to me to plan on 6 or more years of school with no guarantee that you will be able to use that degree.

It seems that the OP wants her cake and to eat it too. Yes, you may be disabled, but that doesn’t mean that you should have whatever health care you deem necessary, not having to work at a job and the freedom to attend school without interruption.

Able bodied people can’t do that.

Maybe you should work on getting well. THEN, if you can do that, you will be able to work and go to school without interference from your parents.

But that’s my point…I can’t save up and work. I can’t get medical care for a degenerating illness if I’m working. So what you’re suggesting is that I work until my illness is permanent and I am completely unable to care for myself, and then - do what exactly? Oh yeah, and I’m not exactly “getting well” if I have to depend on a mother who takes pride in setting off my illness.

 

[mafh]

I think very first few posters have answered your question – If you’re getting disability payments from the government or insurance, then you have complete control over your money. If you are getting it from your parents or some other private person, then they can attach whatever strings they want to the money so long as they aren’t doing anything illegal. When you are an adult and you are dealing with your parents’ money, the issue of ‘rights’ is irrelevant. None of us have a ‘right’ to other people’s money.

I seriously think you haven’t investigated all your options to pay for your medical bills. Have you throughly investigated options like:

• Care Credit or similar to finance health care costs
• Government-subsidized community mental health centers
• Medical clinics for people who don’t have insurance
• High deductable individual health insurance
• Social Security disability benefits
• Supplemental insurance to cover what your student health insurance doesn’t cover
• Charities that help people pay medical bills
• Student Health Care and Counseling services at your university

 

[Bill_7154]

No, I wouldn’t. (You didn’t ask me, but the assumption seems to be that people would choose this.) I would rather work if it is feasible. But then, I have a job that I can do without it causing many additional long term physical or mental problems. If the job was destroying what remained of my health, I’d quit before it was completely destroyed, presumably.

Perhaps I am simply lucky to have a job that is not destructive. If most jobs are, then I get your point entirely.

To be clear, and you may understand this, I did not mean gooing on disability. I mean that if your company offered you 80% of your income for life with no strings…you COULD show up and work but you could choose what parts of the job you do and what you don’t do, as you would be working as a volunteer…I think most people would choose that over their job as is, especiallly if it were guarenteed for life. I certainly would. My job is very stressful but some aspects I love so would take the money and show up to do the parts I like.

Peace,
Bill

 

[Bill_7154]

But that’s my point…I can’t save up and work. I can’t get medical care for a degenerating illness if I’m working. So what you’re suggesting is that I work until my illness is permanent and I am completely unable to care for myself, and then - do what exactly? Oh yeah, and I’m not exactly “getting well” if I have to depend on a mother who takes pride in setting off my illness.

Do you collect disability? If so you can earn something like $1050/month without them touching your check. If you get housing subsidy you will have to kick back 30% of it, but you’d still have 700 more a month, since your getting by on what you get now, the 700/month could be saved (under your mattress) to be used for school.

AS I said, if I have the chance I will get an AA in one of the few fields you can start at like 70K, 60K the least.

God Bless,
Bill

 

[Bill_7154]

I I seriously think you haven’t investigated all your options to pay for your medical bills. Have you throughly investigated options like:

What about Medicare or med treatment on a sliding scale at a public hospital? IN my state they have 'healthcare for the homeless…free medical care…and mass health which is much better than the insurance I PAY for. IT’s basically medicare and medicaid combined.

Call all state public hospitals and explain your situation and aske what your options are.

Peace,
Bill

 

[Pug]

To be clear, and you may understand this, I did not mean gooing on disability. I mean that if your company offered you 80% of your income for life with no strings…you COULD show up and work but you could choose what parts of the job you do and what you don’t do, as you would be working as a volunteer…I think most people would choose that over their job as is, especiallly if it were guarenteed for life. I certainly would. My job is very stressful but some aspects I love so would take the money and show up to do the parts I like.

Peace,
Bill

Hmmm, less pay and never do the parts I don’t like. Yes, I could go for that. There are a few parts I would gladly skip and take less money as a result. For example, never have to do a year end “self-assessment” ever again! Yay! Never have to go to work while I have the flu again! Double Yay!

I suspect a volunteer might be a liability for some places (for the purposes of getting sued or whatever the lawyers fear). They’d never let me work and skip certain types of paperwork though. That would mess with their atmosphere of pseudo accountability as measured by documented goal setting, measurable outcomes, and whatever.

There is no way they would let me volunteer for part of my job. For me that is a total fantasy. I’d have to change fields.

 

[Bill_7154]

Hmmm, less pay and never do the parts I don’t like. Yes, I could go for that. There are a few parts I would gladly skip and take less money as a result. For example, never have to do a year end “self-assessment” ever again! Yay! Never have to go to work while I have the flu again! Double Yay!

I suspect a volunteer might be a liability for some places (for the purposes of getting sued or whatever the lawyers fear). They’d never let me work and skip certain types of paperwork though. That would mess with their atmosphere of pseudo accountability as measured by documented goal setting, measurable outcomes, and whatever.

There is no way they would let me volunteer for part of my job. For me that is a total fantasy. I’d have to change fields.

MY main point is the financial appeal of disability. Dr’s are not going to drop out of med school to get on the ‘ssi gravy train’ but for poor ppl with spotty work histories at min wage jobs it’s a very good deal financially (short term anyway). And for those who don’t do well at delaying gratification at all and cant think past the next 30 bucks…well…

Peace,
Bill

 

[DarkLight]

In general - like I said, I find the issue interesting. Especially considering issues I had when I was younger (but still adult), where I got told by a lot of charity stuff that since my parents were willing to pay for medical care and housing, I wasn’t qualified for outside help. I pretty much got kicked off of the help I was getting because I disclosed that my parents were willing to help conditional on me attending an approved church and professing to their particular denomination. So it’s not as simple as people think. There was clearly a value judgement going on - only people who are financially independent have the right to religious freedom, or that religious freedom is an acceptable cost for help. Maybe this isn’t a value judgement we agree with. But clearly we’re going to have to make some value judgments somewhere. Where do we draw the line?

Same with medical care. I do think I have a right to decent medical care, even if I can’t pay for it. What I’m getting right now is not even adequate to keep me from not eating, some weeks. I don’t think that’s something that should be negotiable. Unfortunately, I can’t pay for the sorts of specialists I’d need. That means, obviously, someone else will have to. Does that constitute a “right to someone else’s money”? If not, how to we reconcile that with the belief in a right to basic medical care? Or am I confused about that right?

 

[maryjk]

In general - like I said, I find the issue interesting. Especially considering issues I had when I was younger (but still adult), where I got told by a lot of charity stuff that since my parents were willing to pay for medical care and housing, I wasn’t qualified for outside help. I pretty much got kicked off of the help I was getting because I disclosed that my parents were willing to help conditional on me attending an approved church and professing to their particular denomination. So it’s not as simple as people think. There was clearly a value judgement going on - only people who are financially independent have the right to religious freedom, or that religious freedom is an acceptable cost for help. Maybe this isn’t a value judgement we agree with. But clearly we’re going to have to make some value judgments somewhere. Where do we draw the line?

Charities are well within their rights to decide who gets their money.

As someone in my care, my son must attend weekly church services. No he doesn’t have freedom of religion. When he moves out he is welcome to do as he pleases, until such time, he will attend Mass. (Now, for me, that isn’t a problem. He readily goes to Mass and Confession, but even if he didn’t want to go, he would still go. )

As many here have suggested, maybe you need to apply with the government.

Same with medical care. I do think I have a right to decent medical care, even if I can’t pay for it. What I’m getting right now is not even adequate to keep me from not eating, some weeks. I don’t think that’s something that should be negotiable. Unfortunately, I can’t pay for the sorts of specialists I’d need. That means, obviously, someone else will have to. Does that constitute a “right to someone else’s money”? If not, how to we reconcile that with the belief in a right to basic medical care? Or am I confused about that right?

You are talking apples and oranges. You say basic medical care but then mention all sorts of specialists. Multiple visits to numerous specialists isn’t basic care.

And please know, since we don’t know your condition or the type of services you would need, it are all talking in generalities.

I do know that you have mentioned seeing someone “daily.” I don’t know of any insurance that would pay for a visit to a doctor daily or at least wouldn’t pay for it for very long.

 

[DarkLight]

Charities are well within their rights to decide who gets their money.

As someone in my care, my son must attend weekly church services. No he doesn’t have freedom of religion. When he moves out he is welcome to do as he pleases, until such time, he will attend Mass. (Now, for me, that isn’t a problem. He readily goes to Mass and Confession, but even if he didn’t want to go, he would still go. )

But what if that never ends? If your Catholic son had to depend on private charity, would you think they’d be within their rights to demand that he not attend Mass or go to confession? For how long? Keep in mind the government often doesn’t provide care for all areas. Or what about the birth control pills I need to keep the PMDD down - what if I could only go to a Catholic counselor if I stopped taking those (I know that my using them isn’t against Catholic teaching, but I’ve still seen people make a fuss)? Would those all be ok?

Getting government aid is not anywhere near as easy as you seem to think. I’ve been waiting for 4 weeks just for a single letter that would let me apply for loans. All this with a disorder that makes phone calls nearly impossible, and can knock me flat for a week or more after a doctor’s visit of having to rehearse traumatic experiences on command to a skeptical audience. That’s a big risk for something that from everything I know I’m not likely to get.

But I don’t see government aid as fundamentally different from private aid. They’re both other people’s money. The same rules for what is and isn’t right should apply to both. If it’s ok for a private charity or individual to do, it’s ok for the government to do, and vice versa, at least for most cases. What if the government started requiring that you get an abortion if you become pregnant under certain circumstances? After all, they don’t believe there’s anything wrong with abortion. Would that be ok for them to do? Or if it required a Muslim woman to take off her headscarf because it might be preventing her from getting work?

As many here have suggested, maybe you need to apply with the government.
You are talking apples and oranges. You say basic medical care but then mention all sorts of specialists. Multiple visits to numerous specialists isn’t basic care.

And please know, since we don’t know your condition or the type of services you would need, it are all talking in generalities.

I do know that you have mentioned seeing someone “daily.” I don’t know of any insurance that would pay for a visit to a doctor daily or at least wouldn’t pay for it for very long.

I consider “basic medical care” to be “care that meets the medical industry’s standards for treating whatever condition someone has.” In my case, that would involve weekly visits to a mental health specialist in abuse and trauma cases, as well as (typically monthly) visits to a psychologist that handles medication issues. Plus most likely (also monthly) visits to a nutrition specialist to deal with the accompanying eating problems. A lot of places also recommend at least a week or two of in-patient treatment, which would be daily.

But in any case - I don’t think I’m asking for something special. I’m asking for what the medical community is telling me I should have in order to get better. Problem is I’m in a situation where I can have that or I can get a job. On one hand I’m being told I’m irresponsible if I don’t accept treatment that would interfere with my work - on the other hand I’m being told I’m lazy if I do, because I could be working

 

[Bill_7154]

In general - like I said, I find the issue interesting. Especially considering issues I had when I was younger (but still adult), where I got told by a lot of charity stuff that since my parents were willing to pay for medical care and housing, I wasn’t qualified for outside help. I pretty much got kicked off of the help I was getting because I disclosed that my parents were willing to help conditional on me attending an approved church and professing to their particular denomination. So it’s not as simple as people think.?

Go to social security and get an application. Fill it out. Get all the medical records forwarded to them. If the parents thing comes up you can lie and say that you had a falling out and do not grant them permission to talk to your parents (it’s your right as an adult). Simple (exept maybe for the lie but it will serve the greater good if you truely can get a degree and a job you will have an income and have your medical tx $ taken care of so you can focus on school, then work.

 

[DarkLight]

Go to social security and get an application. Fill it out. Get all the medical records forwarded to them. If the parents thing comes up you can lie and say that you had a falling out and do not grant them permission to talk to your parents (it’s your right as an adult). Simple (exept maybe for the lie but it will serve the greater good if you truely can get a degree and a job you will have an income and have your medical tx $ taken care of so you can focus on school, then work.

I am actually working on some stuff. I have one more paycheck that I get from my contract this semester. Right now I’m working on the paperwork so that I can stay a student in good standing while taking time off, instead of being listed as on suspension for failure to complete work. Plus a bunch of pesky little things that have needed doing for months and haven’t been done because work tired me out.

 

[Bill_7154]

I am actually working on some stuff. I have one more paycheck that I get from my contract this semester. Right now I’m working on the paperwork so that I can stay a student in good standing while taking time off, instead of being listed as on suspension for failure to complete work. Plus a bunch of pesky little things that have needed doing for months and haven’t been done because work tired me out.

I am kind of in your shoes, working but barely hanging on. And I have the responsibility of a husband and father. So I understand. But we have to work to get what we want or will not get it (unless your parents are rich and willing to dole you out a salary every month).