'Disciplining' 3 year olds

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I work in pediatrics, and I can tell you that there is a good chance the child’s pediatrician could provide the parents with some ideas. Sometimes people won’t listen to family (hence, your frustration), but they will listen to an outsider. If the child’s doctor tells the parents to try something else it might work. Perhaps you could convince your son to ask the pediatrician about how to handle discipline when they are in the office for their next well visit? Wait for a time when he and his wife are at their wits end and stressed out while disciplining, then, casually mention that the pediatrician might be able to recommend some strategies. Pediatricians answer these questions all the time, so there is no need to be embarrassed about asking how to discipline a 3 year old.

I can guarantee you that 3 year olds do not benefit from anything long or drawn out. They live in the here and now - that’s just how their minds work. They are stressing the entire family out and not actually disciplining the child. I guarantee with a punishment that long the child probably forgot what the parents were even angry about so all she knows is that her parents are angry with her and she doesn’t know why.
 
EasterJoy said:
I misread the OPs description, then? The mother was in there having a battle of wills with a three year old for 5 hours? Oh, wow. That is such utter lunacy, it beggars belief.

That little girl has some spunk. Those parents had better figure out how to work with her, and not try to break her. No one in their right minds tries to form a strong-willed child by brute force of will. If they do, they’re going to find out the hard way what kind of lunacy can come out of a big reservoir of built-up resentment. Wow, if either of the parents are half as strong-willed as this child, this could get* so *bad!! 😦
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Lunacy is the perfect word for it. It might be the extreme example, but I think similiar examples by young parents are not that rare of occurances these days.

The big problem is that these parents eventually get worn down with their over discipline, but not all at once. So the kids go through a long period of very inconsistent behavior by their parents. They do something minor, and all hell breaks loose; but the. They do something more major and they receive no discipline at all. Kids end up very confused. I have two family members who exhibited that pattern of parenting.
 
Egypt3, I would suggest focusing in your son, do your homework, provide him with materials, and point out to him how he was raised. When he is becoming convinced, tell him he is the head of the house, man-up, and get his wife under control. I don’t ysually see the benefit in a husband strongly asserting his authority over his wife. This would be a very ràre instance where it us needed.

And you did the right thing in saying it was cruel.
 
Iheartcoffee said:
I work in pediatrics, and I can tell you that there is a good chance the child’s pediatrician could provide the parents with some ideas. Sometimes people won’t listen to family (hence, your frustration), but they will listen to an outsider. If the child’s doctor tells the parents to try something else it might work. Perhaps you could convince your son to ask the pediatrician about how to handle discipline when they are in the office for their next well visit? Wait for a time when he and his wife are at their wits end and stressed out while disciplining, then, casually mention that the pediatrician might be able to recommend some strategies. Pediatricians answer these questions all the time, so there is no need to be embarrassed about asking how to discipline a 3 year old.

I can guarantee you that 3 year olds do not benefit from anything long or drawn out. They live in the here and now - that’s just how their minds work. They are stressing the entire family out and not actually disciplining the child. I guarantee with a punishment that long the child probably forgot what the parents were even angry about so all she knows is that her parents are angry with her and she doesn’t know why.
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This is a good idea; I hope the parents aren’t in medicine on one hand and yet aren’t wary of medicine on the other, because the advice might not work as well in that case. Still, this is good advice for first-time parents, provided the parents give the pediatrician an accurate history of the parenting strategies tried and the results seen.
 
Thank you, guys, for your very good support. God bless you. My son is very strict, too. It is not just my daughter-in-law. Only that she spends more time with the little one and gets to deal with her more often. A few year ago, when I told my son if I had to do things over again I would be more relaxed about disciplining him and his siblings, (their dad never disciplined them, so I thought I had to), he said “Mom, you weren’t strict enough”. Now, a few year later, when he has his own child I get to see what he meant.
Someone mentioned about the use of reason at this stage. I did have a few words with them, and pointed to the fact that children do not have the full use of reason, but very little discernment at this time, so they are not deliberate in their behavior, let alone malicious. But they seem to be convinced that she is spiteful. And I don’t know how to deal with that.
Because, maybe, yes, at the moment the child is plain spiteful, ignoring commands or stubbornly not complying with the parent’s wishes. However, that does NOT EQUAL malice, and a different approach is needed than breaking her will with a long battle of wits.
It is our Catholic understanding that because of original sin our wills are ‘messed up’ , and our reasoning is ‘darkened’ and often the appetite (concupiscence) takes over - even grown-ups are affected, let alone a little 3yr old.
So a different way of dealing with this is needed. But I am afraid we repeat what was done to us in our early lives and this may be a psychological reenactment (in their case).
Someone suggested I do positive things for my granddaughter to fill up her life with love and affection, to counter this harshness (especially maternal). I cannot visit them more than twice a year, as they live across country, and my budget as well as my welcoming to their place is a bit limited. But I have been sending her little packages, little gifts - maybe a skirt I’d make for her, or maybe stickers, always writing her a simple note about how precious she is and how much I love her. And pray. For my daughter-in-law, because, if she had something like this from her own mother, when she was a child, she too, is a little girl in need of affection, and unconditional love, and especially she does not need more criticism. God bless you all
 
Egypt3 said:
Thank you, guys, for your very good support. God bless you. My son is very strict, too. It is not just my daughter-in-law. Only that she spends more time with the little one and gets to deal with her more often. A few year ago, when I told my son if I had to do things over again I would be more relaxed about disciplining him and his siblings, (their dad never disciplined them, so I thought I had to), he said “Mom, you weren’t strict enough”. Now, a few year later, when he has his own child I get to see what he meant.
Someone mentioned about the use of reason at this stage. I did have a few words with them, and pointed to the fact that children do not have the full use of reason, but very little discernment at this time, so they are not deliberate in their behavior, let alone malicious. But they seem to be convinced that she is spiteful. And I don’t know how to deal with that.
Because, maybe, yes, at the moment the child is plain spiteful, ignoring commands or stubbornly not complying with the parent’s wishes. However, that does NOT EQUAL malice, and a different approach is needed than breaking her will with a long battle of wits.
It is our Catholic understanding that because of original sin our wills are ‘messed up’ , and our reasoning is ‘darkened’ and often the appetite (concupiscence) takes over - even grown-ups are affected, let alone a little 3yr old.
So a different way of dealing with this is needed. But I am afraid we repeat what was done to us in our early lives and this may be a psychological reenactment (in their case).
Someone suggested I do positive things for my granddaughter to fill up her life with love and affection, to counter this harshness (especially maternal). I cannot visit them more than twice a year, as they live across country, and my budget as well as my welcoming to their place is a bit limited. But I have been sending her little packages, little gifts - maybe a skirt I’d make for her, or maybe stickers, always writing her a simple note about how precious she is and how much I love her. And pray. For my daughter-in-law, because, if she had something like this from her own mother, when she was a child, she too, is a little girl in need of affection, and unconditional love, and especially she does not need more criticism. God bless you all
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You might, when you have the chance, say this: Son, bring her along as your disciple and be a disciple yourself; that is the way to go. You need to have your will and her will moving in the same direction, and not fighting, because while you may gentle each other, you will never break each other. You are both way too strong for that. Besides, you are good parents and good people. Go in the same direction, and she is going to want to please you and be like you.
Son, when I see you or dear DIL being too hard on her, I know you’re also being too hard on yourself. I’ve been where you are, all the way through it. You love her so much, you want the best for her, you don’t want to fail her. I tell you this: worry less about whether you are strict enough. Be gentle with yourself, be gentle with dear DIL, or you will find it impossible to be gentle enough with her.

Always be gentle with him, and bring him along as you hope he’ll bring her along…
 
Thank you, EasterJoy, for your words of wisdom; this is very helpful for me, because I really need help with what to say, when I will find it is time to say something. God bless
 
Egypt3, your compassion and wisdom are quite evident in your posts. Your granddaughter is blessed to have you.

It’s a delicate situation. I have known several women whose sons turned against them and wouldn’t let them see the grandchild(ren) due to daughter-in-law issues with the mother-in-law. So be very diplomatic; it would be tragic if this happens.

Don’t mean to scare you overmuch with that but since there seems to be a tricky balance with many women and their daughters in law I just wanted to make you aware. I’d say beware of any overly direct confrontational strategy - it could backfire.

I think as upsetting as it is for you, if your son - and daughter in law actually saw your pain on your granddaughter’s behalf, it might make them reconsider. Even if he saw you shed a tear, that might touch his heart. I don’t mean fake it, but if you feel it, don’t suppress it. :bighanky:

Somehow if you could get through to your son that he needs to try to put himself in his child’s shoes and have empathy for her . . . that it wouldn’t be surrendering legitimate parental authority to do that. He seems to be trying to strike a balance to his own childhood but going overboard. He hasn’'t found the “sweet spot” in the center.
 
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