Discouraged CCD teacher needs advice!

[Dorothy]

Are parents allowed to make their children get confirmed if the children do not wish to do so? What is the Canon Law about this? I always thought that if one is past the age of reason that he must choose to receive a Sacrament on his own.

Of my eight children, one of my daughters (in the late 70’s) was given the option, by the priest, of whether she wanted to be confirmed or not. She did not want to be. I totally understand that if someone who is not sure of their faith, or weak in their faith just automatically goes through with confirmation of their “faith” it is a sham.

My daughter is still struggling, though she is a believer. She talks about the Lord and getting back to Church, but has not done it yet. I keep praying for her. She would greatly benefit by going through an RCIA program and making her Confirmation.

 

[Orogeny]

There has been a lot of really good advice given here. I have been teaching confirmation for the last 6 years and I understand what you are going through. I am not a trained teacher, just someone who answered a call to fill a need in my parish. I think that perhaps the fact that I am not a trained teacher has worked to my advantage, because I have taught the class the way that I would have liked to have been taught when I went through confirmation so many years ago.

I have had several students ask to transfer to my classes because I don’t make them do the little teaching exercises that the professional teachers make them do. I focus on the topic for the class and we discuss it. When I say discuss, I don’t mean that I lecture them. I challenge them and get them to enter into a discussion. I try to treat them like young adults rather than children (we confirm at 15 years old in my parish) and push them to think about what we are discussing.

I have not had to have anyone removed from my class in the time I have been teaching. I have, on the other hand, accepted students who were on the verge of being removed from the program because they were too disruptive in their classes. I always start those students with my rules - if you are disruptive in my class, I will personally (with the DRE’s permission, of course) call their parents right then and there to have them come to class and if they want their child in my class, they will have to attend with them. I have never had to follow through with that.

Bottom line for me is that I believe that I am touching these kids in some way, some more than others and some now while others will be affected later in life. I feel that I am trying to plant a seed and it is up to God and the student to get it to grow. That is what I am called to do as a catechist.

Peace

Tim

 

[Cat]

My husband and I are converts from evangelical Protestantism.

I hope I don’t sound like I’m bragging if I say that I had fantastic youth group in my church as a teenager. So did my husband. Hundreds of kids came to our weekly meetings, Bible studies, and socials. Many of the leaders of our youth group became internationally-known youth speakers, and quite a few of the teenagers became pastors and missionaries.

We were never bored because our youth leaders were well-trained in teaching methods that really worked with teenagers. When I grew up, I worked with youth groups, and continually received training through meetings with the youth pastor, and through workshops and seminars sponsored by our church and other churches in the area.

Please forgive my ignorance, but are the confirmation teachers in the Catholic Church given this kind of training? If not, why not? It seems like it would be a good idea.

I’m not talking about “entertaining” youth. That’s a wrong way. But one of the posters above mentioned breaking into small groups. This is a very effective teaching method with teens.

Another person mentioned getting to know the teens personally. I agree with this, but caution that is must be done “safely” so that the teacher doesn’t put themselves in a position where they could be accused of any impropriety. (I hope I phrased that delicately enough. We were taught that no youth leader should EVER be alone with teenagers.)

Another person mentioned abandoning lectures. Definitely. I’m a grownup and I hate lectures, even when they are about our Lord! I fall asleep, especially if the lecture is in the evening.

I worked with junior highers for several years in a church club setting, and had a lot of success with “field trips.” Instead of just talking about the resurrection of the Lord and how death no longer has a hold over us, I took the teens to a local graveyard, and invited a college professor to come and talk to them about the apologetics of the resurrection. Another time we visited the local pregnancy care center (prolife) and listened to the Director talk about chastity.

Anyway, there are a lot of good teaching methods that work with teenagers. Does the Catholic Church help its teen teachers and sponsors to learn about these techniques?

 

[M-Dent]

It is difficult to keep the lesson flowing for those kids who do want to learn. These kids openly say they don’t want to be there but their parents make them come. They say their parents will let them stop coming to church if they get confirmed. These kids are required to come to Mass and many of them say they have never been to reconciliation since their first confession, yet they take Eucharist every week.
Does anyone else feel difficulty staying motivated in situations like this?

My wife and I also teach confirmation (Class of 11 kids). My wife has taught CCD for a decade yet this was my first year. It was a humbling experience.

One of the first weeks we asked which kids where forced to be there and had no intention or no want to be Catholic. About 4 kids raised there hands. I thanked them noting I would add them to my prayer intentions.

Out of the 11 teenagers we have 3 kids that I am farily confident will be faithful acting Catholics. That was keeps me going.

 

[guanophore]

I am new to posting on this site. My husband and I are frequent lurkers. We teach first year confirmation and I am AMAZED at how resistant many of the kids are to having to pay attention and take tests. There are a few kids in every class who constantly disrupt class and talk loudly about wild things off topic. It is difficult to keep the lesson flowing for those kids who do want to learn. These kids openly say they don’t want to be there but their parents make them come. They say their parents will let them stop coming to church if they get confirmed. These kids are required to come to Mass and many of them say they have never been to reconciliation since their first confession, yet they take Eucharist every week.
Does anyone else feel difficulty staying motivated in situations like this?

I hear ya! I tried teaching that class two years in a row, and it sickened me so bad I had to quit. I told the pastor these children were not ready for confrimation, and the beautiful sacrament was wasted on them. I tried talking to the parents and explaining it was better for them to wait. Working with college students is so much more refreshing!

What these kids need is evangelization, not confirmation. There was only one boy in the whole class that was ready to make an adult commitment to his faith. I think these kids should be attending a youth group, where they can concentrate on becoming Christians. There parents have not raised them in the faith, and they profane the Mass and the Eucharist. The parents expect the catechists to fix things, but we cannot!

 

[guanophore]

Hi. I’m in my second year of comfirmation and will be confirmed this month. I can understand your problem because most kids used to act like that in my class as well. There were three or four kids that would get everyone else distracted. As time went by everyone started acting better. I’m sure you want to help all the kids, but some of them just refuse to stay on course. Anyway, those disruptive kids are gone and things have gone much more smoothly. You should talk to there parents and see if they can do anything. It’s a shame that these kids are just trying to get confirmation out of the way and that they are bringing everyone else down with them. This is one of the reasons I have tryed to be the best student I can be. Our teachers have been great and they don’t deserve the disrespect they have gotten.

Bless your heart! And may your faith, and those of your serious peers sustain those of us who are grieved by the disrupting ones.

 

[guanophore]

We managed to work through it but I had serious reservations about a number of the kids going through with Confirmation. My pastor did what your’s did - He allowed the “guilty” kids to be confirmed - some without even talking to the parents about the problem, who, BTW, ignored his authority and stuck up for their kids - knowing he was one of the guilty ones!

I understand that the parents want goodness in their kids, and probably wish that God would “put a new heart within” them. However, God will not fill someone with His spirit against their will! It is good, too, that the parents want to fulfill their obligation to bring their children to the sacraments, but they are going about it in the wrong way. It happens by modeling, and proper instruction and discipline at home, in the domestic church. They can’t live an irreligious life all week, and expect the kid to be changed in an hour of catechism! Refusal to accept the authority of the pastor is a sin!

His reasoning was that where sacraments are concerned, it’s up to the candidate to ASK for the sacrament and once they do, it’s not up to him to refuse the sacrament. It will be between them and God. I have real problems with that line of thinking - for obvious reasons. He says it’s not up to us to “make” people (kids) do anything - we can only offer it and do our best, the rest is up to the kids, parents and the Holy Spirit. I guess I can believe in enough of that to keep going.

God will bless your efforts. It is true that the kids must ask, but it is up to the team to “confirm” their request. To me, when we present the candidates irresponsibly, we participate in their sins.

Anyway, YOU ARE NOT ALONE! Don’t give up and I’ll tell you why: More than once, when I thought I was not accomplishing anything, in each year that I taught, I DID make a difference to at least one kid! One year, there were 2 kids! I’m hoping I made a difference in more than those few kids, but I KNOW about these particular kids because they communicated with me about it. So, that’s why I do it - if I can get to one kid - it’s worth it!

Please don’t give up or give in. If your parish is like mine, I have a big problem with getting good teachers who really care. WE NEED YOU SO MUCH! Hang in there - you ARE making a difference, I promise. I know it’s frustrating, but - let go and let God!

I agree, but wouldn’t it be better to work with just one, or with a few that are sincere, and make some real progress in religious formation?

 

[Tracy783]

I totally feel the same way as Guanophore.
There have been a couple of people on here who have reported positive experiences with their classes and that is VERY encouraging!
I think Guanophore makes a good point, though, when he/she says that the kids need to be evangelized, not confirmed, because the parents have not raised them in the Faith. However, I feel that the parents have to be evangelized first. Our own children and some others whose parents try to be faithful and teach them report that CCD is an imposible place to learn. The parents in every parish are different which determines a lot about the youth of that parish. There are so many great resources for teens, but I feel that in our particular parish, the change is going to have to start with the parents.

 

[guanophore]

I totally feel the same way as Guanophore.
There have been a couple of people on here who have reported positive experiences with their classes and that is VERY encouraging!
I think Guanophore makes a good point, though, when he/she says that the kids need to be evangelized, not confirmed, because the parents have not raised them in the Faith. However, I feel that the parents have to be evangelized first. Our own children and some others whose parents try to be faithful and teach them report that CCD is an imposible place to learn. The parents in every parish are different which determines a lot about the youth of that parish. There are so many great resources for teens, but I feel that in our particular parish, the change is going to have to start with the parents.

There is nothing better for evangelizing parents than a teenager on fire for Jesus! When I left the Church as a teen, and became a born again baptist pentecostal, it really made heads turn at home! Of course, it would be preferable if they could have that expeience IN the church, but I think reaching the kids is a great way to reach parents! At least the kids are coming…

John Paul II pray for our youth!

 

[Dorothy]

Orogeny wrote:

<<I have had several students ask to transfer to my classes because I don’t make them do the little teaching exercises that the professional teachers make them do. I focus on the topic for the class and we discuss it. When I say discuss, I don’t mean that I lecture them. I challenge them and get them to enter into a discussion. I try to treat them like young adults rather than children (we confirm at 15 years old in my parish) and push them to think about what we are discussing.>>

I can relate to that! For the first time in many years I taught 4th grade CCD from last fall to this spring. We had only an hour and a quarter for the class, and I decided to skip the arts and crafts that were recommended in our guide book.

Instead, I too like to engage the class in conversation and have them contribute to the lesson. Although 18 were in the class there were no behaviour problems. Of course, it helped that I had a teaching assistant, a gentleman who is a commanding officer in the U. S. Navy. It took about an hour of at-home time to prepare an interesting challenge to the students, based on the content that was to be taught.

I chose to teach this young grade because I felt I could handle them okay. My hat is off to those who have the gift of relating to teen-agers in a teaching capacity!

 

[DianJo]

I understand that the parents want goodness in their kids, and probably wish that God would “put a new heart within” them. However, God will not fill someone with His spirit against their will! It is good, too, that the parents want to fulfill their obligation to bring their children to the sacraments, but they are going about it in the wrong way. It happens by modeling, and proper instruction and discipline at home, in the domestic church. They can’t live an irreligious life all week, and expect the kid to be changed in an hour of catechism! Refusal to accept the authority of the pastor is a sin!

I was pretty upset with those parents who ignored our pastor’s authority and I was pretty upset with him for not addressing it with them. But, knowing this family, he was right, it wouldn’t have made a difference. Sad, really.

It’s not that the kids are doing this against their will - they want to be confirmed. I’m just not sure they know enough about their faith to be making this huge decision. Although, I look at the Eastern rite and they Baptize and Confirm and give the Eucharist to infants - and they know nothing about the faith they will be raised in… So, maybe there’s something to our pastor’s line of thinking…

The big problem is that these kids are getting no instruction or example from home. That’s where it’s all supposed to start and we are to supplement but it doesn’t happen that way - parents think it’s up to the Church to educate their children in the faith. We need to reach the parents first! Parents don’t know enough about their faith to teach their children!

Wait - this will really blow your mind - the week after Confirmation, a senior came to me and wanted me to know something about some of the kids in that class - some of the parents PAID THEIR KIDS LARGE SUMS OF MONEY TO GO THROUGH WITH CONFIRMATION!! I wanted to sit down and cry. What am I supposed to do with this information? I can’t do a thing with it. Our kids are in a no win situation, they are not interested and their parents don’t care but they want them to go through the motions.

God will bless your efforts. It is true that the kids must ask, but it is up to the team to “confirm” their request. To me, when we present the candidates irresponsibly, we participate in their sins.

That’s what I wonder, too! I feel like I’m being irresponsible.

I agree, but wouldn’t it be better to work with just one, or with a few that are sincere, and make some real progress in religious formation?

Sometimes, I think, yes, it would be better to have just a few that are really sincere but then I play the “What if” game. What if one of those kids who are not so serious were to come to class or attend the retreat and they heard one thing I said that might make a difference? Do I want to take the chance of leaving that one child out that might, in one class, gain someting from that class? I’m not sure I want to take that chance to try to touch one child - even if it’s really frustrating.

I don’t know what the answer is but I like the suggestion of giving the teachers some professional training on teaching methods and how to deal with teens. What they were describing sounds like Life Teen and relational ministry (of which I’m a part of). But, relational ministry calls for someone to meet the kids on their turf and CCD teachers cannot typically do that because it’s not their full time jobs. That would be the “job” of the youth minister.

One parish in my area is doing “Generations of Faith.” It’s a parish wide catechesis program that involves the entire family and it is a huge hit there. Parents are learning right along with their kids and they all have “homework” before they meet again. The meetings are once a month but the family is working on their “assignments” all month long - learning together and setting examples for each other. This, to me sounds like the way to go.

 

[guanophore]

Sometimes, I think, yes, it would be better to have just a few that are really sincere but then I play the “What if” game. What if one of those kids who are not so serious were to come to class or attend the retreat and they heard one thing I said that might make a difference? Do I want to take the chance of leaving that one child out that might, in one class, gain someting from that class? I’m not sure I want to take that chance to try to touch one child - even if it’s really frustrating.

The Kingdom of Heaven has always been one of attraction, not promotion. When the believers are on fire, people come in droves. We need to fan the flames that exist, and trust that it is catching! If we have committed youth that are fervent for God, even a few, then others will be attracted.

 

[jmcrae]

The Kingdom of Heaven has always been one of attraction, not promotion. When the believers are on fire, people come in droves. We need to fan the flames that exist, and trust that it is catching! If we have committed youth that are fervent for God, even a few, then others will be attracted.

When it comes down to the choice that, if you don’t throw out the bad kids, your good kids are going to quit, then you have to throw out the bad kids.

Most of the time, the good kids won’t warn you that they’re quitting - they’ll just quit showing up, so it’s really important to let everyone know right from the start what’s acceptable and what’s not acceptable, and that you are more than willing to ask people to drop the class and wait until next year, if they don’t seem mature enough to handle it this year. That way, they still have a chance - you’re not giving up on them - but they have to show respect for your time, and for the time being spent by the other kids, and not waste it.

 

[Orogeny]

Instead, I too like to engage the class in conversation and have them contribute to the lesson. Although 18 were in the class there were no behaviour problems. Of course, it helped that I had a teaching assistant, a gentleman who is a commanding officer in the U. S. Navy. It took about an hour of at-home time to prepare an interesting challenge to the students, based on the content that was to be taught.

This year I also had 18 students. In past years, I never had more than 11, but this year I had a great student aid (peer minister) - my son who was in my class and was confirmed last year. This year, he helped me teach and I can’ t tell you how blessed I am that he helped. I was so proud that he wanted to share his faith with other kids roughly his age. He also helped in the very few times when we had a student who was being disruptive by basically calling him out as a peer. That was the end of that!

Peace

Tim

 

[Dorothy]

This year I also had 18 students. In past years, I never had more than 11, but this year I had a great student aid (peer minister) - my son who was in my class and was confirmed last year. This year, he helped me teach and I can’ t tell you how blessed I am that he helped. I was so proud that he wanted to share his faith with other kids roughly his age. He also helped in the very few times when we had a student who was being disruptive by basically calling him out as a peer. That was the end of that!

Peace

Tim

It’s great that a peer of your students (your son) was willing to be a student aid! That makes quite an impression on the class, when someone of their own age group shares with them about the faith.

 

[toaslan]

I’ve also had these same hard times with my Confirmation Classes. I would have quit by now except that the pastor backs me up, and we are both very faithful to the Magesterium.

What I have learned so far:

Truly disruptive students cannot stay in class. They make it impossible for the class to learn. Not fair to the kids prepared to learn. You can send disruptive next door with an individual study prepared ahead for such an event; call the parents and say it can’t happen again; when it does send them away again, and inform parents the child cannot be in class again without the parents being present. Inform pastor or DRE of each step. Not a disaster if kid leaves program–not a sacrament necessary for salvation in same sense as baptism, and maybe when they are older, requesting marriage perhaps, they will be able to better prepare and receive this once-in-a-lifetime sacrament.

Start it out as a challenging academic program; parents should know beforehand this is going to be academic, not just feel-good time. They should know you will be applying objective standards to measure child’s progress. Do weekly quizzes, cumulative tests at semester. Do real grades! Keep parents constantly informed via binders/folders of the grade situation. Constantly relate to parents as to the primary teachers of the faith to their child–you are just helping the parent teach the faith.

But also be aware that the parent/family is the source of the lack of catechesis the child is laboring under.

We do class after the last Mass on Sunday. Yes, I know, weekends can be bad. But as my pastor says, “priorities have to be made; families have to make sacrifices.” The connection between going to Sunday Mass and being Catholic is too essential, and concern for it overwhelmed objection to doing class on Sunday. We must avoid the sacraments, and church membership, from being an empty form just for show. We must avoid being just culturally Catholic. My kids know the chant–“if you don’t go to Mass, don’t come to Class.” (If they are late to class–giveaway they didn’t go to Mass, and they get the hard time, in frot of whole class from teacher.) Three class absences and child cannot again attend until parent has to call the pastor to get into a conversation about WHATEVER needs to be discussed. These conversations, I am told, have been a chance for him to emphasize personally with a parent the need for the parent to go to Sunday Mass.

I just went through informing some kids that, as they failed to get 65% on a cumulative test, that is a no-pass in my class, but perhaps a third year of formation will benefit them anyway. And give them one more chance to pass the (same) test. Parents in on all this. After all, what I want is for the material to be mastered.

The next time, one week later, closed book test again, those students all got 85% and up, same grading weight! No, they do not want to be in class; but yes, they can do it if insisted upon. And the parents don’t want the bother of getting junior to/from class indefinitely; nor do they want to give up. We should use the leverage we have–the parents are desiring the sacrament for their kid, and that can motivate them to motivate the kids.

The catechism gives us 3 pre-conditions for Confirmation, one of which is to be “well-instructed in the Catholic Faith.” The teacher is responsible to convey the content of the faith; and hopefully also show some of how to love/live the faith, but this latter is more up to the family. Teachers’ first job is to teach content, always in charitable way.

Yes, I do not lecture–always have kids read lesson bit by bit going around, then open discussion, then say the point. Lots of verbal reports from kids–last year they were responsible to bring a “nugget” from Catholic radio each class, and we always went through all these nuggets verbally, briefly, each class. They got so they looked forward to this very much, after initial resistance.

Sometimes discouraged; hopeful. Have to do it because people labored to give me this gift, and we older ones have duty to pass on to younger as best we can.

Blessings!

 

[hilde_the_dog]

Not to be completely off topic but in our CCD classes we at a minimum or twice a year set aside a night to go to Confession? Does anybody else do that? That we we know that the kids go to confession at least twice ayear.

 

[puzzleannie]

Not to be completely off topic but in our CCD classes we at a minimum or twice a year set aside a night to go to Confession? Does anybody else do that? That we we know that the kids go to confession at least twice ayear.

Our pastor prefers that they be guided to attend confession at the normal times set for the parish, since CCD time is intended for doctrinal instruction, and we already lose a lot of classtime from other demands. He also goes by a rather strict canon law interpretation that you cannot tell people when to go to confession and cannot make them go. He is right, but it still means that unless their parents go, the kids probably won’t go either.

Our discipline policy for all grades is 3 strikes and you are out. We never “kick anyone out” of CCD but we inform parents by phone and in writing that the student is not welcome back to class without a parent or other responsible adult who will be responsible for their behavior. CCD is a privilege, not a right. The parents always have the choice of taking a book (free), instructing the child at home, and bringing the completed unit reviews and tests to me for credit. In 5 years precisely 2 parents have taken advantage of this option.

 

[jmcrae]

Not to be completely off topic but in our CCD classes we at a minimum or twice a year set aside a night to go to Confession? Does anybody else do that? That we we know that the kids go to confession at least twice a year.

I get my class to organize a Service of Reconcilation with a priest, to which the rest of the classes are invited, during Lent. An opportunity is provided for them to go to Confession with the priest at the end of the service. So far (in six years) I’ve only seen one kid not go, and he was also the only kid not present to help organize the service, so I really do think that it’s educational for them to do this, even though some people might consider it “fluff.”

 

[guanophore]

I really like you plan for dealing with disruptive students.

Not a disaster if kid leaves program–not a sacrament necessary for salvation in same sense as baptism, and maybe when they are older, requesting marriage perhaps, they will be able to better prepare and receive this once-in-a-lifetime sacrament.

I agree that it does not have to be a disaster, but I do think it is a serious matter. I disagree that the sacrament is necessary for salvation. It is the “other half” of the initiation rite of baptism, and I think if this attidute and behavior of rebellion and disruption do not change, it will most certainly affect a person’s salvation. That being said, I do think it is better to wait until they are older, and the sacrament should be approached with humility and honor.