Discussing the "8th Day" with a 7th Day Adventist?

[SingleMomMonica]

I had a client come in and start discussing religion late last night…He wanted to know if Orthodox Christians use the Bible, which English Translation, do we accept the 10 Commandments and do we accept the 4th Commandment. I answered. Then he wanted to know why we don’t celebrate Divine Liturgy on Saturday instead of Sunday.

I explained to him that Orthodox Christians recognize & honor the 4th Commandment of keeping Holy the “Sabbath” on the Lord’s Day, the 8th Day, as each Sunday is a mini-Pascha (Easter) since Jesus rose from the death on the 8th Day, Sunday, and in the New Testament it was always documented that the Apostles celebrated the Eucharist (translated as “giving thanks” in most English Translations of the Bible) on Sunday not on Saturday & that even St. John, as recorded in the first book of Revelations was taken up into the Heavenly Divine Liturgy on a Sunday aka “the Lord’s Day” when he was on the Island of Patmos.

He was shocked stating he’d never heard anything about the “8th Day” being the day of Christ’s Resurrection. And that never even heard of the term the “8th Day”.

I had always thought this to be common knowledge and so I was also shocked - shocked by his response of shock.

I’m pretty sure that the early Church Fathers used the term “8th Day” frequently, but I’m not sure it happend to have been written down in any of the early Church Father’s writings that were included in the Bible?

If anyone knows about the 8th Day, please comment on any details you know.

 

[ralphinal]

I had heard that before. I was not sure who had or had not used it, so I looked it up. A few who have include Origen, Clement of Alexandria, and Justin Martyr.

It always amazed me that so many people, like the Seventh Day Adventists, miss the Easter connection as well as with the rising of Christ, the Earth is new again

 

[SingleMomMonica]

I had heard that before. I was not sure who had or had not used it, so I looked it up. A few who have include Origen, Clement of Alexandria, and Justin Martyr.

It always amazed me that so many people, like the Seventh Day Adventists, miss the Easter connection as well as with the rising of Christ, the Earth is new again

Thank you for the references!

Another thing I was surprised about in our conversation was that my client said that they (7th Day Adventists) do believe in the Trinity - which has to mean then that they accept the Early Church Council of Nicaea I which is when the word Trinity was created to describe God within Himself.

And if they believes in that Council of Nicaea, then wouldn’t they also accept the early Church Fathers who attended that Council and those Fathers who came between the Apostles and that Council? They should have no problem accepting the words of people like St. Justin Martyr right?

 

[ralphinal]

Thank you for the references!

Another thing I was surprised about in our conversation was that my client said that they (7th Day Adventists) do believe in the Trinity - which has to mean then that they accept the Early Church Council of Nicaea I which is when the word Trinity was created to describe God within Himself.

And if they believes in that Council of Nicaea, then wouldn’t they also accept the early Church Fathers who attended that Council and those Fathers who came between the Apostles and that Council? They should have no problem accepting the words of people like St. Justin Martyr right?

One would think so. What you have to understand is that SDAs are an off-shoot of a Protestant background. Many things that we as Orthodox or Catholic know to be true because of an Early Church Council they take for granted and do not know the history of. that can make it hard to really discuss.

So, do not be surprised if they accept some teachings then refuse to accept how they came about. Not to be deceptive, but I would focus on everything as being Orthodox and not Catholic, as some SDA may hold the Catholic Church as being the Whore of Babylon and the Pope as the Anti-Christ.

 

[bpbasilphx]

Most Orthodox monasteries have a Divine Liturgy on Saturday as well as Sunday. In fact, large monasteries and cathedrals have a DAILY Divine LIturgy (except M-F during Great Lent).

As you know, in Orthodoxy, Saturday is kept without fasting in honor of the Sabbath.

The Sabbath was a shadow that was to pass away, as we sing at the Lamentation Matins (usually anticipated on Holy Friday night in parishes) and at the Vesperal Liturgy of Holy Saturday:

Great Moses mystically prefigured this present day when he said,
‘And God blessed the seventh day’.
For **this is the blessed Sabbath,
this the day of rest
on which the only-begotten Son of God rested from all his works. **
Through the dispensation in accordance with death,
He kept the Sabbath in the flesh,
And, returning once again to what he was, through the Resurrection
He has granted us eternal life,
For he alone is good and loves humankind.

Emphasis added.

Furthermore, as I also point out, there is NOTHING in the 4th commandment to require worship on the Sabbath. The commandment is about a rest from labor that extended even to one’s slaves and even farm animals.

Moreover, Saturday was NOT the only day called “Sabbath” in the Bible. This was used for ALL feasts of Old Israel.

So ask SDA why they are picking and choosing which of God’s Sabbath’s they observe, and not ALL of them?

Finally, in traditional Synagoges, services are held not only on the Sabbath, but TWICE DAILY, as they were in the Temple.

But actually, SDA’s do NOT get their emphasis on the Sabbath from the Bible, but rather from the ravings of Ellen Gould White (whose name adds up to 666, btw).

This, however, is a different issue.

 

[agent_grey]

Be carefull with SDA’s. They tend to have a hatred of our traditions and beliefs. When he says that he never heard of the 8th day he is most likely saying that there is no mention of the 8th day in scripture. They have studied us for the express reason to accuse and I gauranty he has heard of the 8th day concept that we put forth.

My responce to SDA’s on this topic is Traditionally Catholics have communion every single day. But for the sake of simplicity we all gather on Sunday. We chose Sunday cause it is the only day that scripture ever mentions communion. I make mention that to drive on the Sabbath is a sin so being the true church of God we tend by nature to relax on the Sabbath as the vast majority of us do and go for communion if it be available on Sunday. But if we are in need it is always available if it is available at all.

The best one is to ask why each day of creation is evening and morning accept the 7th? Why is there absolutely no mention of the Sabbath in the book of Genesis? Why does a latter prophet say that God will bring the Sabbaths to an end. I could go on and on.

If they give you the Sunday worship is the Mark of the beast. Ask if SDA’s separate from God on Sundays?

Always speak in riddles with these. Never tell them a blatant truth. Leth them accuse. Give them opportunity to accuse. Satan refines his lies by his failures.

I can’t wait to find out what God thinks about the SDA teachings and beliefs!

 

[SingleMomMonica]

Be carefull with SDA’s. They tend to have a hatred of our traditions and beliefs. When he says that he never heard of the 8th day he is most likely saying that there is no mention of the 8th day in scripture. They have studied us for the express reason to accuse and I gauranty he has heard of the 8th day concept that we put forth.

My responce to SDA’s on this topic is Traditionally Catholics have communion every single day. But for the sake of simplicity we all gather on Sunday. We chose Sunday cause it is the only day that scripture ever mentions communion. I make mention that to drive on the Sabbath is a sin so being the true church of God we tend by nature to relax on the Sabbath as the vast majority of us do and go for communion if it be available on Sunday. But if we are in need it is always available if it is available at all.

The best one is to ask why each day of creation is evening and morning accept the 7th? Why is there absolutely no mention of the Sabbath in the book of Genesis? Why does a latter prophet say that God will bring the Sabbaths to an end. I could go on and on.

If they give you the Sunday worship is the Mark of the beast. Ask if SDA’s separate from God on Sundays?

Always speak in riddles with these. Never tell them a blatant truth. Leth them accuse. Give them opportunity to accuse. Satan refines his lies by his failures.

I can’t wait to find out what God thinks about the SDA teachings and beliefs!

Wow! I love your insights! Sounds like you’ve come across this sect a time or two:thumbsup:

I was reading last night a booklet in which recounts a talk Fr. Kiril (I hope I have his name right) spoke to a group of Orthodox Christians along with some Protestant ‘missionaries’ to Russia (I think) around 1912 - although the Protestants present were Baptist, he also made mention of the Adventists (apparently they were not yet called “Seventh-day” Adventists yet?). Anyway, it was very interesting. The crowd, who had been interested in following this new teachings the Baptists presented them with, after Fr. Kiril’s talk, they were all greatly impressed with him and remained Orthodox.