Dishonesty during RCIA, please help

[SeekerAndMom]

I am a recent convert (just confirmed this past Easter) and need help. My husband and I were not forthcoming about his religious status and now I’m worried. I plan to talk to the priest about this during confession but I’m writing here to see if anyone knows what will likely happen.

My husband was raised a Catholic but stopped attending mass at 18. He is now agnostic. When we met we were both agnostic but since then (10 years) I have found a strong faith in God. We were married in a civil ceremony. I attended RCIA class this past year and a few weeks before the Easter vigil the priest said we would need to have our marriage blessed since we weren’t married in a church, and we had to do this in order for me to be converted. He asked if my husband was Catholic and I said yes, and that he had been baptized and confirmed. The priest said he would need to go to confession before the vigil (which he did). I wish I had just said to the priest at that time that my husband doesn’t go to church and talked to him about it, but I was nervous and embarrassed about it and I wanted to be able to join the church. Later my husband and I had our meeting with the priest and filled out the form which again we should have just told him the situation but instead we signed the form which made it seem like we both were intent on being part of the church. Everything was very rushed and if we had taken more time maybe we would have done the better thing, but that’s neither here nor there. So after the vigil we were remarried in the church.

At the time I didn’t think I was technically lying about anything, but now I feel like I wasn’t forthcoming and I think while my answers on the form were true his probably weren’t and I knew they weren’t.

Since then when I’m at church I feel conspicuous without my husband. I feel like he should be there with me and he’s not. I’ve started sitting in a section where I won’t receive communion from the priest (we have several deacons who give communion too) because I’m afraid the priest will notice that my husband never goes to church. I feel guilty about the whole thing and it’s making me not enjoy going to church as much.

I feel like the only way to feel better about this is to confess it to the priest and just tell him what happened. The thing is I’m afraid he’ll tell me that I can’t receive communion anymore or that my husband has to come back and have a meeting with the priest or participate in the church in some way again. I don’t think he would be willing to do that. I was really surprised that he agreed to go to confession for the marriage blessing but he did it for me because he knew joining the church was important to me. However, he really doesn’t like going to church.

Does anyone know what the priest is likely to say about this and how badly have I messed up here? Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[puzzleannie]

I am a recent convert (just confirmed this past Easter) and need help. My husband . I attended RCIA class this past year and a few weeks before the Easter vigil the priest said we would need to have our marriage blessed since we weren’t married in a church, and we had to do this in order for me to be converted. He asked if my husband was Catholic and I said yes, and that he had been baptized and confirmed. The priest said he would need to go to confession before the vigil (which he did). I wish I had just said to the priest at that time that my husband doesn’t go to church and talked to him about it, but I was nervous and embarrassed about it and I wanted to be able to join the church. .

stop right there
your husband made a sacramental confession and presumably was absolved. anything abou this status, his practice of the faith, his intent, his spiritual condition is between him and the priest in confession. You are not part of this except as it relates to your own marital status, which has been taken care of, so you are not part of this. You did not withhold any information so it is not your place to “tattle” on your husband. He had his chance to be honest, and still has a chance. Your entry into the Church was not predicated on his faith status except as it relates to marriage, and the marriage aspect has been properly dealth with. You cannot do anything to change his faith or practice of it, or lack thereof.

Continue praying for your husband and setting the example of a joyfilled obedient Catholic wife. You have not messed up at all. Yes simply because it is troubling you discuss it with the priest, especially how hard it is to come to church without your husband beside you. Your husband needs the priest’s pastoral care so share what you can as it relates to your relationship, but you can’t make your husband do anything, or atone for any lack in his own honesty or intentions.

 

[Prince_Hal]

Without any shadow of a doubt, ask to see Father immediately and explain everything, all of the details, your motives, your thoughts. Don’t leave anything out. This way it can be cleared up once and for all.

Misleading someone is never a good thing. However, God does not sit on His Throne drawing a line in the sand and making sure people do not cross it, and if they do smiting them like bugs. And it is my experience that His priests do not have this attitude either. In fact sometimes greater things come out of initial errors or wrong-doings. Of course this is never a reason to do the wrong thing in the first place - never at all. Adam and Eve’s “Fall” is often described as a “fall upwards”. Undoubtedly you will experience the same in your life.

God loves you and wants you to be with Him. One of the dangers of not resolving it is that you may continue to avoid the Priest and in so doing you may inadvertently be avoiding God.

The great thing is that Father is your friend and Father and this will be resolved in love, with love and through love.

God bless you,

Hal.

 

[mcrow]

First off, I think you either misunderstood what the Priest said or he made a major blunder. You’re marriage does not have to be blessed to be confirmed.

Maybe I really missed something but I don’t believe your marriage status figures into if you can be confirmed or not.

As for your issue:

I don’t see you as being dishonest. HE IS CATHOLIC. He was raised Catholic, I presume he had first communion and was confirmed. So, when you say he’s Catholic, you are correct. I believe unless he wrote the church a letter requesting to be removed from the records the Church will still consider him a part of the church.

It would be dishonest to have said he’s an active Catholic and attends mass every week but to simply state that he is Catholic is actually correct. He may not be an active Catholic but that is what he is.

 

[ctkrcia]

stop right there
your husband made a sacramental confession and presumably was absolved. anything abou this status, his practice of the faith, his intent, his spiritual condition is between him and the priest in confession. You are not part of this except as it relates to your own marital status, which has been taken care of, so you are not part of this. You did not withhold any information so it is not your place to “tattle” on your husband. He had his chance to be honest, and still has a chance. Your entry into the Church was not predicated on his faith status except as it relates to marriage, and the marriage aspect has been properly dealth with. You cannot do anything to change his faith or practice of it, or lack thereof.

Continue praying for your husband and setting the example of a joyfilled obedient Catholic wife. You have not messed up at all. Yes simply because it is troubling you discuss it with the priest, especially how hard it is to come to church without your husband beside you. Your husband needs the priest’s pastoral care so share what you can as it relates to your relationship, but you can’t make your husband do anything, or atone for any lack in his own honesty or intentions.

This is the correct answer. Question for you though. Would your husband consider attending RCIA classes with you next year? As a RCIA Director, I have seen unbelieving spouses become believers just by sitting in the class. It may be because the class has an informal atmosphere, it provides a basis for understanding, it is interactive, etc. I don’t know why. I just see the Holy Spirit work in people who wouldn’t move at all by regular attendance at Mass.

Keep attending Mass and be a good example. The joy you demonstrate in your life may just get him interested in trying to attain some of the same.

 

[Cor_ad_Cor]

First off, I think you either misunderstood what the Priest said or he made a major blunder. You’re marriage does not have to be blessed to be confirmed.

Maybe I really missed something but I don’t believe your marriage status figures into if you can be confirmed or not.

Actually, a valid marriage is necessary for reception of Confirmation or Eucharist. When a Catholic (practicing or not) marries outside the Church, which is what it seems happened here, the marriage must be convalidated by the Church before either spouse can have a sacramental relationship with the Church.

At any rate, Puzzleannie has given the best answer, as usual.

 

[mcrow]

Actually, a valid marriage is necessary for reception of Confirmation or Eucharist. When a Catholic (practicing or not) marries outside the Church, which is what it seems happened here, the marriage must be convalidated by the Church before either spouse can have a sacramental relationship with the Church.

At any rate, Puzzleannie has given the best answer, as usual.

Not true, I know that for a fact because of my own situation. My wife was Catholic I was not, there was no need for us to have our marriage blessed for me to be Confirmed. Bring it to your priest, bring to your Bishop and you will get the same answer.

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

Not true, I know that for a fact because of my own situation. My wife was Catholic I was not, there was no need for us to have our marriage blessed for me to be Confirmed. Bring it to your priest, bring to your Bishop and you will get the same answer.

Were you married according to Catholic law? If so then your marriage was valid. If you were not married according to Catholic form – as in the case of the OP – then the marriage would need to be convalidated before you could receive the other sacraments.

 

[mcrow]

Were you married according to Catholic law? If so then your marriage was valid. If you were not married according to Catholic form – as in the case of the OP – then the marriage would need to be convalidated before you could receive the other sacraments.

Sorry, not true.

I was non-religious, we were married by a justice of the peace, my wife is Catholic.

Our priest and bishop did not require our marriage to be blessed for me to be confirmed.

 

[1ke]

Sorry, not true.

I was non-religious, we were married by a justice of the peace, my wife is Catholic.

Our priest and bishop did not require our marriage to be blessed for me to be confirmed.

Either there is more to the story OR your priest misunderstood the situation OR your priest seriously messed up.

A person in an invalid marriage cannot be received into the Church. The marriage must be convalidated first. If your wife received a dispensation from form to marry before the JP then that would be a valid marriage. If your wife married without permission for mixed marriage and without dispensation from form, then the marriage is invalid per this canon:

Can. 1108 §1. Only those marriages are valid which are contracted before the local ordinary, pastor, or a priest or deacon delegated by either of them, who assist, and before two witnesses according to the rules expressed in the following canons and without prejudice to the exceptions mentioned in cann. ⇒ 144, ⇒ 1112, §1, ⇒ 1116, and ⇒ 1127, §§1-2.

 

[mcrow]

Either there is more to the story OR your priest misunderstood the situation OR your priest seriously messed up.

A person in an invalid marriage cannot be received into the Church. The marriage must be convalidated first. If your wife received a dispensation from form to marry before the JP then that would be a valid marriage. If your wife married without permission for mixed marriage and without dispensation from form, then the marriage is invalid per this canon:

Can. 1108 §1. Only those marriages are valid which are contracted before the local ordinary, pastor, or a priest or deacon delegated by either of them, who assist, and before two witnesses according to the rules expressed in the following canons and without prejudice to the exceptions mentioned in cann. ⇒ 144, ⇒ 1112, §1, ⇒ 1116, and ⇒ 1127, §§1-2.

So where does it say that you have to have your marriage convalidated to be confirmed?

 

[Muze]

First off, I think you either misunderstood what the Priest said or he made a major blunder. You’re marriage does not have to be blessed to be confirmed.

Maybe I really missed something but I don’t believe your marriage status figures into if you can be confirmed or not.

As for your issue:

I don’t see you as being dishonest. HE IS CATHOLIC. He was raised Catholic, I presume he had first communion and was confirmed. So, when you say he’s Catholic, you are correct. I believe unless he wrote the church a letter requesting to be removed from the records the Church will still consider him a part of the church.

It would be dishonest to have said he’s an active Catholic and attends mass every week but to simply state that he is Catholic is actually correct. He may not be an active Catholic but that is what he is.

How can he be Catholic and agnostic?

 

[mcrow]

How can he be Catholic and agnostic?

Simple, unless you officially withdraw your status with the church and you have been confirmed Catholic you are always Catholic, like it or not.

Also, we believe anyone baptized with the Trinitarian method is baptized Catholic in a way. So even you are Catholic in some respect.

 

[Muze]

Simple, unless you officially withdraw your status with the church and you have been confirmed Catholic you are always Catholic, like it or not.

Also, we believe anyone baptized with the Trinitarian method is baptized Catholic in a way. So even you are Catholic in some respect.

So, you can be Catholic and not be a Christian?

 

[puzzleannie]

First off, I think you either misunderstood what the Priest said or he made a major blunder. You’re marriage does not have to be blessed to be confirmed.

Maybe I really missed something but I don’t believe your marriage status figures into if you can be confirmed or not.
.

this is not true

each case of an RCIA candidate who is married, or planning to be married is unique. You must assume the priest handled the situation correctly in each case. There are so many variables it is impossible to make such a statement and apply it to an individual case.

In OP’s case, for instance, she is married to a Catholic who failed to conform with Church law on marriage, therefore the marriage was objectively invalidated. She could not be confirmed and enter into full communion with the Church in a situation which would immediately bring her into an objective state of sin. Therefore the marriage had to be convalidated first.

And none of that is at issue in her dilemma. She is worried about her husband’s sincerity in making the promises entailed in the process, and whether or not that affects her situation, or the marriage.

Another RCIA candidate might be in an entirely different situation so there is no blanket “RCIA marriage rule.” Each case is handled individually according to the individual’s circumstances.

Not true, I know that for a fact because of my own situation. My wife was Catholic I was not, there was no need for us to have our marriage blessed for me to be Confirmed. Bring it to your priest, bring to your Bishop and you will get the same answer.

we do not know all the facts of your situation, which we assume was handled correctly at the time by your priest.

you and I do not know any of OP’s circumstances beyond what her priest ascertained, so he, not we, is in the best position to judge what was necessary at that time.

YOu simply cannot make a blanket statement about all RCIA + marriage cases based on “my experience.” there are simply too many variables to make such a statement of any value.

 

[mcrow]

So, you can be Catholic and not be a Christian?

Again, the Church will always consider yuo Catholic even if you do not identify that way.

When I say that a trinitarian makes you Catholic I’m being a bit facetious. Basically what I’m saying is that Baptism is the first our 7 sacraments and if someone has a trinitarian baptism they’ve already met one of the four sacraments needed to be Catholic.

You can’t simply walk into a Catholic church and take part in the Eucharist because of your Baptism but you are 1/4 Catholic already, in a way.

 

[jwinch2]

Sorry, not true.

I was non-religious, we were married by a justice of the peace, my wife is Catholic.

Our priest and bishop did not require our marriage to be blessed for me to be confirmed.

If your wife had dispensation from the Bishop to be married outside of the Church then you would have been fine as it was a recognized marriage by the Church. If not, then the marriage would have been considered invalid by the Church, (I believe due to lack of Canonical Form), and you would have needed a convalidation. My wife and I just went through this ourselves.

I don’t want to come across the wrong way, but I would suggest following up on that just to be sure… Whether you do or not is your business.

 

[mcrow]

this is not true

each case of an RCIA candidate who is married, or planning to be married is unique. You must assume the priest handled the situation correctly in each case. There are so many variables it is impossible to make such a statement and apply it to an individual case.

In OP’s case, for instance, she is married to a Catholic who failed to conform with Church law on marriage, therefore the marriage was objectively invalidated. She could not be confirmed and enter into full communion with the Church in a situation which would immediately bring her into an objective state of sin. Therefore the marriage had to be convalidated first.

And none of that is at issue in her dilemma. She is worried about her husband’s sincerity in making the promises entailed in the process, and whether or not that affects her situation, or the marriage.

Another RCIA candidate might be in an entirely different situation so there is no blanket “RCIA marriage rule.” Each case is handled individually according to the individual’s circumstances.

we do not know all the facts of your situation, which we assume was handled correctly at the time by your priest.

you and I do not know any of OP’s circumstances beyond what her priest ascertained, so he, not we, is in the best position to judge what was necessary at that time.

YOu simply cannot make a blanket statement about all RCIA + marriage cases based on “my experience.” there are simply too many variables to make such a statement of any value.

I wasn’t saying that my situation applies to the OP, because we have two different backgrounds. In fact, I was simply giving my situation as example because the OP seemed to think that you cannot be confirmed because of her situation. So, I was just pointing out that this is not always the case. I can’t know how the priest would view here situation, but I just wanted to point out that there are exceptions.

As for my case, my priest knew fully of my situation as did the bishop who OK’d my confirmation. I don’t pretend to understand all of the rules within the church but apparently it was OK for me to be confirmed.

 

[Muze]

Again, the Church will always consider yuo Catholic even if you do not identify that way.

When I say that a trinitarian makes you Catholic I’m being a bit facetious. Basically what I’m saying is that Baptism is the first our 7 sacraments and if someone has a trinitarian baptism they’ve already met one of the four sacraments needed to be Catholic.

You can’t simply walk into a Catholic church and take part in the Eucharist because of your Baptism but you are 1/4 Catholic already, in a way.

I understand that, and that’s fine.

But this man is an agnostic. A confessed agnostic. Which precludes ANY faith in God. If he believed as a child, he certainly rejected that faith when he turned 18. Since we are saved by grace through faith (Eph 2:8-9), it would seem that this man is not a Christian now, and there is some question as to whether he ever was.

So, the question remains: Can one be Catholic and not be a Christian?

 

[Elizium23]

Yes, you can. A baptized Catholic is forever Catholic; baptism makes an ontological mark on the human soul. A person can subsequently choose his faith. If he chooses to be Protestant, then he is a heretic Catholic. If he chooses to be an atheist then he is an apostate Catholic. While placing himself outside the church, he always remains Catholic with the possibility of making a confession and a re-entry to the Church.