Disordered Homosexuality and Truth

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It was brought to my attention that I have a miniscule understanding of Veritatis Splendor. I must admit that caused me to reflect. After reflection it may be that I am not alone. In that regard I ask that a discussion concerning the disorder of Homosexuality be discussed in light of Veritatis Splendor and Church Teachings. I suggest that portions of the document that resonate with the reader are brought to light as we are all guided differently and moved to see things differently. I picked one paragraph that meant something to me…

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_enc_06081993_veritatis-splendor_en.html
Perfection demands that maturity in self-giving to which human freedom is called. Jesus points out to the young man that the commandments are the first and indispensable condition for having eternal life; on the other hand, for the young man to give up all he possesses and to follow the Lord is presented as an invitation: “If you wish…”. These words of Jesus reveal the particular dynamic of freedom’s growth towards maturity, and at the same time they bear witness to the fundamental relationship between freedom and divine law. Human freedom and God’s law are not in opposition; on the contrary, they appeal one to the other. The follower of Christ knows that his vocation is to freedom. “You were called to freedom, brethren” (Gal 5:13), proclaims the Apostle Paul with joy and pride. But he immediately adds: **“only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love be servants of one another” **(ibid.).
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This thread is a discussion of the disorder of Homosexuality and Veritatis Splendor…I pray we shed light so that this document can be relevant to those that read and post…thank you…🙂
 
Would you call drinking to excess an opportunity for the flesh?
 
EviPolevhia said:
Would you call drinking to excess an opportunity for the flesh?
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Evi,

This thread is about Homosexuality. You have asked me to provide you insight as to drinking to excess and the flesh. In consideration that you have asked and that Veritatis Splendor is about keeping the commandments please note this from the Catechism…

**ARTICLE 5
THE FIFTH COMMANDMENT

You shall not kill.54
You have heard that it was said to the men of old, “You shall not kill: and whoever kills shall be liable to judgment.” But I say to you that every one who is angry with his brother shall be liable to judgment.55 **
Respect for health
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2288 Life and physical health are precious gifts entrusted to us by God. We must take reasonable care of them, taking into account the needs of others and the common good.
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Concern for the health of its citizens requires that society help in the attainment of living-conditions that allow them to grow and reach maturity: food and clothing, housing, health care, basic education, employment, and social assistance.
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2289 If morality requires respect for the life of the body, it does not make it an absolute value. It rejects a neo-pagan notion that tends to promote the cult of the body, to sacrifice everything for its sake, to idolize physical perfection and success at sports. By its selective preference of the strong over the weak, such a conception can lead to the perversion of human relationships.
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2290 The virtue of temperance disposes us to avoid every kind of excess: the abuse of food, alcohol, tobacco, or medicine. Those incur grave guilt who, by drunkenness or a love of speed, endanger their own and others’ safety on the road, at sea, or in the air.
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2291 The use of drugs inflicts very grave damage on human health and life. Their use, except on strictly therapeutic grounds, is a grave offense. Clandestine production of and trafficking in drugs are scandalous practices. They constitute direct co-operation in evil, since they encourage people to practices gravely contrary to the moral law.
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The excess of alcohol as you know may cause someone to drive drunk and as you know excess of alcohol impairs judgement. In the context of this thread there may be those that waiver in judgement as it concerns homosexuality as well.

I pray that provides some insight.
 
I know this thread is about Homosexuality, thank you. I do know how to read titles and posts. My point was to lead on to this. Many things can be considered an opportunity for the flesh. But yet that which can be considered as such is not always treated by Catholicism the same way that Homosexuality is. So I am unsure if it is right for you to correlate the passage you highlighted in red in Veritatis Splendor with Homosexuality.
 
EviPolevhia said:
I know this thread is about Homosexuality, thank you. I do know how to read titles and posts. My point was to lead on to this. Many things can be considered an opportunity for the flesh. **But yet that which can be considered as such is not always treated by Catholicism the same way that Homosexuality is. **So I am unsure if it is right for you to correlate the passage you highlighted in red in Veritatis Splendor with Homosexuality.
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Evi,

You have knowledge and understanding as to the point of the thread. You have a point. You point out that there are many opportunities via many things concerning the flesh. You say that Catholicism treats Homosexuality differently as it regards the flesh. You state lack of surety in my correlation of Veritatis Splendor with regards to the red as it concerns homosexuality and Veritatis Splendor.

Let me ask you this. Explain to me what you mean by what I highlighed in red that you wrote so I may understand you.

I know you can read as you say. Please regard that I picked one point that meant something to me. Homosexuality is aberrant behavior and a disorder of the flesh…so that meant something to me as it correlates with my thinking as it concerns homosexuality.

This is the CAF and discussing Veritatis Splendor was brought to my attention as being misunderstood…or rather it was said that my understanding was miniscule and I accepted that. It is for that reason this post was spawned.

Explain please.
 
I don’t think Catholicism treats homosexuality differently from any other sin of the flesh.
Many Catholics, especially in America, may do, but that’s a different matter.

All cultures vary in their attitudes to particular sins. Thus in Ireland heavy drinking is not taken too seriously; but in Italy it is considered rather shocking.
 
As to proper and popular studying of all encyclicals, I have always wondered way they are not made available at parishes and study groups organized. I do not even recall that thay were announced as having been issued.

As for Freedom and Divine Law, I think Blessed Pope John Paul II nailed it when he visited Denver back in the 90s and the news media tried to box him in regarding the freedom of speech and the excesses in our popular media. The Pope smiled and said, “The Pope is not against Freedom. The Pope is for the good use of Freedom.”

We pride our Freedoms so much that we tend to think that ANYTHING we do expresses and protects our Freedom. We fully forget the common sense need to limit our Freedom to the GOOD USE of it. GOOD is an objective measure, not something that is subject to personal desires only.

As for the disorder of homosexuallity, I rarely see reference to Romans 1: 18-32. Unless I misread that passage, it seems clear that such behavior can be freely engaged in but it is not witihn Divine Law.
 
GratefulFred said:
As to proper and popular studying of all encyclicals, I have always wondered way they are not made available at parishes and study groups organized. I do not even recall that thay were announced as having been issued.

As for Freedom and Divine Law, I think Blessed Pope John Paul II nailed it when he visited Denver back in the 90s and the news media tried to box him in regarding the freedom of speech and the excesses in our popular media. The Pope smiled and said, “The Pope is not against Freedom. The Pope is for the good use of Freedom.”

We pride our Freedoms so much that we tend to think that ANYTHING we do expresses and protects our Freedom. We fully forget the common sense need to limit our Freedom to the GOOD USE of it. GOOD is an objective measure, not something that is subject to personal desires only.

As for the disorder of homosexuallity, I rarely see reference to Romans 1: 18-32. Unless I misread that passage, it seems clear that such behavior can be freely engaged in but it is not witihn Divine Law.
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Grateful,

This is consistent with Veritatis Splendor. True freedom is freedom from fear and the Pope is in favor of freedom that provides just that…the good use of Freedom as Veritatis Splendor says.
 
Hadrianus said:
I don’t think Catholicism treats homosexuality differently from any other sin of the flesh.
Many Catholics, especially in America, may do, but that’s a different matter.

All cultures vary in their attitudes to particular sins. Thus in Ireland heavy drinking is not taken too seriously; but in Italy it is considered rather shocking.
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I like how no one ever comments on what the one guy with serious theological training says 🤷
 
CopticChristian said:
Dakota,

Forgive my ignorance, are you speaking of JPII?
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No, I’m talking about the poster Hadrianus, no one ever seems to comment on his posts and as far as I know he is the only one of those of us who comment on threads like this to have been formally educated on Catholic theology.
 
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