Distributive Computing: Artificial Intelligence

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Matthias123

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These people are planning to start up a distributive computing project that would recreate the human brain, thus creating a fully conscious artificial life form. Is this morally acceptable to do? Would the Lord give this life form an immortal soul? It would be fully capable of understanding a worshiping God. There are so many philosophical implications of this.

Would it be immoral to participate considering they will eventually just shut it off thus killing it?

It is also my personal opinion that it should be illegal to create an artificial inelegance that is vastly superior to the human brain.
 
Thou shalt not make a machine in the likeness of a human mind!
 
It would only be a very complex machine, and nothing more. I think…
 
I hope it isn’t possible. Real Doll and Kari girl are one thing, but a self-aware machine capable of free will ? It reminds me of the age old quandary in cross-cultural slavery ; a nightmare for master and slave alike.
 
People seem to think that this is science fiction. But these people are about to make it happen.

The Church needs to decide if this a licit or not. Because even now some of her flock (such as me and the people on this forum) are contemplating whether it would be immoral to participate in such a project.
 
Look at Babbage’s mechanical computer. It was so complex it was never built. Even now Babbage’s effort looks absurd.
  • and here I am typing on a PC. :eek:
 
Slightly off-topic : Did you ever see the movie " Blade runner " ?

Slightly off-off topic : Did you ever see the movie " Gataca " ? ( what if “improved” people did exist? )

Off topic : Matthias is my favorite masculine name. It sounds so pretty, like the name of a flower.
 
Descriptions of Utopias, at least all the descriptions I have come across, ultimately describe the perfect world as being like a beehive, or an ant colony.
I’m a beekeeper myself, so obviously I love bees.
But I don’t hope to become a Bee.
Now I doubt that scientists or computer geeks have a perfect world as their goal.
But that is quite irrelevant.
I am an ex-communist, and I tell you, this is very very very bad news.
 
That description page is full of grammatical and typographical errors. They’re just a couple of Pseudoscientists from Canada with a HTML editor. I don’t think they’re going to invent anything other than a cool screen saver.

Frankly, I think the world has nothing to fear from these guys.
 
But if it could be done (and why couldn’t it?) should it be?

My thoughts are that it would be immoral because it separates the right act with the right end. Life is supposed to be produced from life by certain biological processes, as a matter of natural law. It seems a violation of natural law to produce life outside these biological functions.

If life is not being produced, bur rather a sort of separate intelligence or consciousness, then it seems that an attribute of the soul would exist without the soul itself, and this would be clearly disordered, and thus sinful.
 
That description page is full of grammatical and typographical errors. They’re just a couple of Pseudoscientists from Canada with a HTML editor. I don’t think they’re going to invent anything other than a cool screen saver.

Frankly, I think the world has nothing to fear from these guys.
I’m guessing you are correct. Computers are not my field. Apparently neither is grammar. :o

But one of the things I was taught in an introductory computer class 20 years ago was that self-awareness, learning, is the holy grail of computer science. Maybe it will prove to be the philosophers stone. But apparently it is on the mind of those who do know what they are doing.
 
But if it could be done (and why couldn’t it?) should it be?
There’s no known way, in computer code, to represent several of the intellectual operations a human mind executes routinely. I believe a mathematician named Penrose, whose first name I forget, has written a few things about the topic.
 
There’s no known way, in computer code, to represent several of the intellectual operations a human mind executes routinely. I believe a mathematician named Penrose, whose first name I forget, has written a few things about the topic.
Roger Penrose. Yea, I’ve read his work on the subject. I agree with aspects of his conclusion, but that only suggests a different computational proceedure would be necessary.

I see no reason to accept that it would be impossible. But I do think it would be immoral.
 
intelligencerealm.com/user/system.php

These people are planning to start up a distributive computing project that would recreate the human brain, thus creating a fully conscious artificial life form. Is this morally acceptable to do? Would the Lord give this life form an immortal soul? It would be fully capable of understanding a worshiping God. There are so many philosophical implications of this.
Well, let’s not get too far ahead of reality. First, I’m skeptical that they would be able to re-create the human brain. Secondly, it’s doubtful that even if a replica of the human brain were to be crafted, it would be anything more than an inert piece of machinery. I’ll get more excited about that when I see a piece of wholly artificial AI computer carrying on an intricate philosophical discussion with Peter Kreeft.

But yes, if you create HAL, then I suppose you would have to evangelize him and baptize him.
 
It would only be a very complex machine, and nothing more. I think…
True, and it would be highly dependent on the Internet for transfer of processes. We are not at fully conscious computers yet. They are still realms of science fiction. iRobot, The Terminator, 2001: A Space Oddesy etc… are still a ways away.
 
I see no reason to accept that it would be impossible. But I do think it would be immoral.
Well, currently it is, incontrovertibly, negatively impossible–we do not see how it can be done–and is, if Penrose is correct, also positively impossible–it intrinsically cannot be done.

So I wouldn’t worry about AI for a long, long time, since computer science is nowhere near resolving those issues, if it ever can (and there’s at least a 50-50 chance it can’t).
 
I’m guessing you are correct. Computers are not my field. Apparently neither is grammar. :o

But one of the things I was taught in an introductory computer class 20 years ago was that self-awareness, learning, is the holy grail of computer science. Maybe it will prove to be the philosophers stone. But apparently it is on the mind of those who do know what they are doing.
I have heard of a book called The Emperors New Mind, which is said to make a fairly strong argument against the capacity of any artificial intelligence which could rival the human mind (and by mind I mean brain but also the soul, “self” or “I”), because the human mind is completely unique in structure, operation, etc. To be frank, we don’t even know how the human brain operates yet and we are still very far away from getting a computer to rival such operations (IF that could ever happen). One important thing to consider is that computers must run on code and logic, and the more detailed the code and logic get, the harder it is for their not to be errors in the code. The human mind is capable of holding numerous positions, thoughts, emotions, etc, which simply are not captured by mere logical, arithmetic, codes.

However, the essential question is: what makes a human being human? If we believe in our Christian faith and also, some good supporting philosophy, we know that human beings have a soul. The soul is spiritual and simply cannot be replicated by material means. Therefore the whole position of being “self-aware” and “free” really means nothing when discussing artificial intelligence. There is good reason to think that machines, which are firstly limited by programming, could neither be free or self-aware, (these two things seem to go hand in hand) if they do not have a soul. I think, perhaps, some may be able to create fairly convincing machines which seem human in some ways, MAYBE, but nevertheless, these machines will always be constrained by programming. Even now, a machine can be programmed to say hello, but as far as it being aware, having a single unitive self which not only has data, but KNOWS data, requires a leap into the spiritual realm, in my opinion. The essential question is: what does it mean to know? and surely to know one has to have a “self” which knows and which knows that it knows. Delving into that question, would be of more benefit to all of us I think.

The whole drive into the artificial intelligence issue (or era perhaps) makes me question the motives. Why are some so compelled to create machines which mimic human beings? Utilitarian purposes aside, it seems like a rather pride-filled drive for man to create in his own image and likeness, to rival the true Creator. Indeed all of these technologies and even those which tamper with genetics and the like, all seem to draw from a prideful position. I daresay it may even have a demonic component to it, as they often depart from the morally acceptable.
 
Well, currently it is, incontrovertibly, negatively impossible–we do not see how it can be done–and is, if Penrose is correct, also positively impossible–it intrinsically cannot be done.

So I wouldn’t worry about AI for a long, long time, since computer science is nowhere near resolving those issues, if it ever can (and there’s at least a 50-50 chance it can’t).
I don’t see any reason that it is impossible (impossibility being defined as ‘not possible’, in this case, by principle, and not by practice). I see no intrinsic barrier to creating a sort of soul in this way, but I do see it as being highly immoral.

I disagree with Penrose’s conclusions, which deal more with his Platonism than with anything really substantial. He does raise some interesting philosophical problems with the idea, but none that disable it; just some that make it feel icky, or possibly hollow.
 
I see no intrinsic barrier to creating a sort of soul in this way, but I do see it as being highly immoral.
The human soul is of course, considered to be not material in nature. To create a non-material soul from the workings of matter and energy would be impossible.

If one were to create “a sort of soul” through AI, it would have to be a material soul, such as we attribute to animals and plants, as a life principle. That would not be in theory impossible, but neither would it be a supernatural soul as humans have. Such a being would not be subject to religious mandates, so better be sure to work in Asimov’s three laws.
 
The human soul is of course, considered to be not material in nature. To create a non-material soul from the workings of matter and energy would be impossible.
I should clarify (precision here is important). It would seem to me fitting that, should we design a system of complexity appropriate to, and modeled after, the human brain, and more the human mind, that, should such an artifice come so close as to be nearly indistinguishable from the human mind, that God would endow this thing with a rational or spiritual soul, much like he would endow a clone with a rational or spiritual soul, or even a homonculus made of human matter.

We cooperate with God in bringing about new souls in reproducing. We can cooperate properly or improperly. I think this would be a disordered cooperation, but one that would not necessarily (for any reason I can think of) be impossible.

Of course this is pure speculation, but it, I believe, will likely become an important matter.
If one were to create “a sort of soul” through AI, it would have to be a material soul, such as we attribute to animals and plants, as a life principle. That would not be in theory impossible, but neither would it be a supernatural soul as humans have. Such a being would not be subject to religious mandates, so better be sure to work in Asimov’s three laws.
This is an interesting point. Maybe we would only be creating life, creating an animal soul that only appears to be rational. Infusing it with good rules would be prudent, just as when one trains a dog.

And Asimov was a great writer of Science Fiction, to be sure. Many interesting ideas…
 
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