Divinity of Christ and Islam

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Allah is a violent God and Jesus is a loving God and the RCC claims that they are the same.

On what does the RCC base this (Edited) claim?
thistle said:
What did I not answer? There is only one God and he is not violent.
It is the muslim extremists who are violent and not God and the Catholic Church most definitely does not say that God is violent.
Please cite your source for such an outrageous claim!
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The RCC teaches that both catholics and muslims worship the same God.

The Muslim God promotes violence and the Catholic God is a loving God. How can they possibly be the same God?
 
StHilarious said:
Thank you for your personal insult. I am delighted with your response, as you have just insulted one who loves Jesus.

If you were to read my post then you would come to the conclusion that your church claims that violent Allah and loving Jesus are both the same God of Abraham. I find this claim insulting to Jesus. I am prepared to stand up for Jesus, and if anyone dares to make false claims about my saviour than these need to be challenged. My statement and question remain:

Allah is a violent God and Jesus is a loving God and the RCC claims that they are the same.

On what does the RCC base this (Edited) claim?

and I am looking forward to a civil and polite response.
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They do not accept the Trintiy. You know that yet you make the most (Edited) posts nonetheless.
 
StHilarious said:
Allah is a violent God and Jesus is a loving God and the RCC claims that they are the same.

On what does the RCC base this (Edited) claim?

The RCC teaches that both catholics and muslims worship the same God.

The Muslim God promotes violence and the Catholic God is a loving God. How can they possibly be the same God?
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(Edited)
The CCC does not teach we worship “the same God”
ONLY that they worship the God of Abraham
 
Allah is a violent God and Jesus is a loving God and the RCC claims that they are the same.

On what does the RCC base this (Edited) claim?
Damascus said:
They do not accept the Trintiy. You know that yet you make the most (Edited) posts nonetheless.
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I understand that muslims do not accept the trinity.

It is not I but your church that equates Jesus with Allah. I find that offensive. Why do you think that I am wrong?
 
StHilarious said:
On what does the RCC base this (Edited) claim?
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If one studies the history and development of Islam, one will see that it is a Catholic/Orthodox heresy. Muhammed took the common form of Christianity at the time and removed the parts he couldn’t comprehend. It is thereby considered a heresy, rather than a pagan religion–it is not all that unlike Arianism. Since it is thereby a corruption of the true religion, rather than a distinct and independent false religion, one would say they worship the same God, albeit with a distorted and erroneous undstanding of Him.

Another argument can be made based on St. Paul saying that the pagans with the altar to the unknown God were worshipping the true God. From this point of view, anyone worshipping the one, all powerful Creator and God is worshipping the true God, albeit through a fog of error.

For further reading, I recommend the chapter on Islam from Hillare Belloc’s “Great Heresies”:
ewtn.com/library/HOMELIBR/HERESY4.TXT

(for clarity’s sake, I am not saying erroneous worship of the true God is in and of itself salvific)
 
Damascus said:
(Edited)
The CCC does not teach we worship “the same God”
ONLY that they worship the God of Abraham
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(Edited)

My claim is that Muslims worship the God of Abraham.

RCs worship the God of abraham.

The difference in these Gods can be seen in the violence of the Muslims and the Love? of the RCs.

I do not see Allah and Jesus as the same God at all, yet your church says that you both worship the God of Abraham. Please try and be polite and explain why the RCC says that you both worship the God of Abraham.
 
Have we considered that the Muslims do worship the God of the Israelites, as we do. But that their idea of him has been skewed because the Koran was written by men, or a man.

The Koranic ideas of death to unbelievers look to be from the minds of men, rather than directly from Satan, as one person on these posts hints. I’ll venture to guess that this Mahomet was an extremely clever man, to form the foundations of this most successful of ancient heresies.
 
Genesis315 said:
If one studies the history and development of Islam, one will see that it is a Catholic/Orthodox heresy. Muhammed took the common form of Christianity at the time and removed the parts he couldn’t comprehend. It is thereby considered a heresy, rather than a pagan religion–it is not all that unlike Arianism. Since it is thereby a corruption of the true religion, rather than a distinct and independent false religion, one would say they worship the same God, albeit with a distorted and erroneous undstanding of Him.

Another argument can be made based on St. Paul saying that the pagans with the altar to the unknown God were worshipping the true God. From this point of view, anyone worshipping the one, all powerful Creator and God is worshipping the true God, albeit through a fog of error.

For further reading, I recommend the chapter on Islam from Hillare Belloc’s “Great Heresies”:
ewtn.com/library/HOMELIBR/HERESY4.TXT

(for clarity’s sake, I am not saying erroneous worship of the true God is in and of itself salvific)
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Now that is a helpful answer, but I do not agree with it.

Mohammed started a religion in opposition to Christianity. It is not a corruption, but a religion that opposes and perverts the gospel.

Like Buddah, Allah is a false and pagan God. Christians are forbidden to worship pagan gods. The RCC claims that both RCs and Muslims worship the same God. I find it offensive and disturbing. How can the RCC claim this?

Paul went on to explain to these people the true gospel, if the RCC says that Allah is the true God, then they should explain that there is more to the gospel.
 
StHilarious said:
Now that is a helpful answer, but I do not agree with it.

Mohammed started a religion in opposition to Christianity. It is not a corruption, but a religion that opposes and perverts the gospel.
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Protestantism was a religion started in opposition to the Christianity of the time. As with all heresies it was an attempt to perfect or improve the true religion, but all it did was pervert it. The same can be said of Muhammed’s version. He was attempting to simplify the true religion and free it from “priestcraft” thereby making it better. Read the link I provided. The foundations of Islam and Protestantism are strikingly similar. All heresies are.
Like Buddah, Allah is a false and pagan God. Christians are forbidden to worship pagan gods. The RCC claims that both RCs and Muslims worship the same God. I find it offensive and disturbing. How can the RCC claim this?
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I’ve already told you. Please read the link I provided above.
Paul went on to explain to these people the true gospel, if the RCC says that Allah is the true God, then they should explain that there is more to the gospel.
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We do 🙂
 
kevathaide01 said:
Have we considered that the Muslims do worship the God of the Israelites, as we do. But that their idea of him has been skewed because the Koran was written by men, or a man.

The Koranic ideas of death to unbelievers look to be from the minds of men, rather than directly from Satan, as one person on these posts hints. I’ll venture to guess that this Mahomet was an extremely clever man, to form the foundations of this most successful of ancient heresies.
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No I have not considered that Allah is the God of Abraham. Any book written by a person, which has lead millions of people astray must be inspired by satan.

I see Allah as satan incarnate and I have great difficulty when the RCC says that both worship the God of Abraham.
 
Genesis315 said:
Protestantism was a religion started in opposed to the Christianity of the time. As with all heresies it was attempt to perfect the true religion, but all it did was pervert. The same can be said of Muhammed’s version. He was attempting to simplify the true religion and free it from “priestcraft” thereby making it better. Read the link I provided. The foundations of Islam and Protestantism are strikingly similar. All heresies are.

I’ve already told you. Please read the link I provided above.

We do 🙂
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I have a relationship with Jesus Christ my saviour, who died to set me free.
Muslims are a bunch of believers, who follow a different gospel and the fruits of that can be seen in their violence.

(Edited)
 
StHilarious said:
I have a relationship with Jesus Christ my saviour, who died to set me free.
Muslims are a bunch of believers, who follow a different gospel and the fruits of that can be seen in their violence.

(Edited)
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I’m sorry you got offended, none was intended. 🙂

I am not going to judge your relationship with God and neither am I going to judge that of Muslims. The fact of the matter is, error is error. Both heresies are corruptions of the pure doctrine delivered by the Apostles of Christ–albeit corrupted to different degrees. Likewise, both religions have followers who sincerely desire to worship the true God, to do His will, and to have relationship with Him. I am not going to judge someone on that. Both, however, can have their faith perfected in the fullness of all revealed Truth. 🙂
 
I have problems speaking to muslims because my objection to the muslim faith is purely reason bassed. I never even have to crack the bible, torah or qur’an… After I began to form this argument against muslims (on a forum actually) I researched further to find this is called the “trilemma of the Christ”.

In my original formulation I proposed it rather crudly. The man named Jesus was either a scam artist, lunitic or the Christ. There are no other possibilities.

Propose this and watch them be unable to reject it. If one reads the greek text of the new testament it does not portray any other possibilities. Jesus Christ equals himself to God, uses references to old testament passages which align himself as being God incarnate, expresses that he is fulfilling the prophesies of the O.T. There is no argument, this trillemma is absolute one must choose one of those three options.

A resource for a more refined proposal of this Trillemma can be found: tektonics.org/jesusclaims/trilemma.html
 
StHilarious said:
Like Buddah, Allah is a false and pagan God. Christians are forbidden to worship pagan gods. The RCC claims that both RCs and Muslims worship the same God. I find it offensive and disturbing. How can the RCC claim this?
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Buddah is not purported to be a god : /
 
Genesis315 said:
I’m sorry you got offended, none was intended. 🙂

I am not going to judge your relationship with God and neither am I going to judge that of Muslims. The fact of the matter is, error is error. Both heresies are corruptions of the pure doctrine delivered by the Apostles of Christ–albeit corrupted to different degrees. Likewise, both religions have followers who sincerely desire to worship the true God, to do His will, and to have relationship with Him. I am not going to judge someone on that. Both, however, can have their faith perfected in the fullness of all revealed Truth. 🙂
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Col.1:25 I became its servant according to God’s commission that was given to me for you, to make the word of God fully known, 26 the mystery that has been hidden throughout the ages and generations but has now been revealed to his saints.

Paul knew the Word of God fully and therefore what is written in the scriptures is sufficient. Any additional material has to be seriously questioned.

2 Tim 3:16 All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,

I do not find my trust in Jesus to be heretical, but I find empty accusations offensive.
 
visavismeyou said:
Buddah is not purported to be a god : /
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Allah is a false and pagan God. Christians are forbidden to worship pagan gods. The RCC claims that both RCs and Muslims worship the same God. I find it offensive and disturbing. How can the RCC claim this?
 
visavismeyou said:
I have problems speaking to muslims because my objection to the muslim faith is purely reason bassed. I never even have to crack the bible, torah or qur’an… After I began to form this argument against muslims (on a forum actually) I researched further to find this is called the “trilemma of the Christ”.

In my original formulation I proposed it rather crudly. The man named Jesus was either a scam artist, lunitic or the Christ. There are no other possibilities.

Propose this and watch them be unable to reject it. If one reads the greek text of the new testament it does not portray any other possibilities. Jesus Christ equals himself to God, uses references to old testament passages which align himself as being God incarnate, expresses that he is fulfilling the prophesies of the O.T. There is no argument, this trillemma is absolute one must choose one of those three options.

A resource for a more refined proposal of this Trillemma can be found: tektonics.org/jesusclaims/trilemma.html
Click to expand...
I can confirm that you have problems with conversing with Christians as well.
 
StHilarious said:
Allah is a false and pagan God. Christians are forbidden to worship pagan gods. The RCC claims that both RCs and Muslims worship the same God. I find it offensive and disturbing. How can the RCC claim this?
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Rofl - you ought to start a new post FYI

Second - you quoted me and didnt respond… K

Third, understand the politics which are involved here.

Fourth, Muhammad preached as if he was receiving visions from the Christian God and the people who wrote the qur’an some 150-200 years after Muhammad’s death created the religion. Muhammad believed the Judeo-Christian beliefs while he was alive. The qur’an actually states to ask Christians for clarification of the O.T.
 
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