Divorce and remarriage prior to conversion

[jmcrae]

discussions about the individual status of candidates should NEVER be carried out during RCIA classes, but always privately, with the pastor or the person he designates. There must be an interview at the beginning of the process, before the candidate joins RCIA, to determine, among other things, if there are marriage issues to be resolved. The sponsors should be educated about the process, but the NOT in a freewheeling discussion of other people’s private business.

Absolutely not - this was not in an RCIA setting; it was while walking in the parking lot after Mass - the sponsor was the one who initiated the conversation. The interview had already taken place in private, and I guess the participant had asked her sponsor to explain what was going to happen with the Tribunal process. I was ambushed, and I did the best I could at the time. I could have lied, I suppose, or dithered around with an incomplete answer, just to be polite. There was no one near enough to overhear - I did have enough sense to tell the participant to go back and get me something from the Church while I explained it to her sponsor.

 

[Melo]

Whatever their religious background, they will have to go through the Tribunal. Maybe the Tribunal takes into consideration that they were divorced/remarried before they converted to Catholism but I’m not sure about that.

Yes, dredging up all those old memories might be painful but hopefully, the paperwork involved doesn’t keep them from converting. It is certainly worth the effort in the end!

 

[mrsjmwhts1]

I am going through almost the same thing now. I am attending RCIA. I am married (my first) and my husband’s second. Neither of us are Catholic. We are actually separated. I moved out on 8/10/07 due to many issues I won’t bring up here. We have not decided to divorce and will be starting counseling at the end of the month. However, I received a call from the priest of the church just this morning during which he told me it would be best if we were divorced because it would be less to deal with and if we stay together his first marriage must be annuled before they would even consider letting me into the church. He recommended I stop attending classes until I figure something out and suggested we talk again in a month because I might have a better idea of how my marriage will work out. His resposnes and guidance confuse me. He stated he would prefer I don’t make friends and relationships through RCIA if he’s just going to have to decline allowing me into the church and pull me out anyway. I was hoping I could continue to at least attend and use it as a period of inquiry. I understand the requirements regarding his prior marriage and the need for that to be annuled, I am just so disheartened about his request I pull out completely. Can anyone explain it so it makes sense?

 

[BeeSweet]

I am going through almost the same thing now. I am attending RCIA. I am married (my first) and my husband’s second. Neither of us are Catholic. We are actually separated. I moved out on 8/10/07 due to many issues I won’t bring up here. We have not decided to divorce and will be starting counseling at the end of the month. However, I received a call from the priest of the church just this morning during which he told me it would be best if we were divorced because it would be less to deal with and if we stay together his first marriage must be annuled before they would even consider letting me into the church. He recommended I stop attending classes until I figure something out and suggested we talk again in a month because I might have a better idea of how my marriage will work out. His resposnes and guidance confuse me. He stated he would prefer I don’t make friends and relationships through RCIA if he’s just going to have to decline allowing me into the church and pull me out anyway. I was hoping I could continue to at least attend and use it as a period of inquiry. I understand the requirements regarding his prior marriage and the need for that to be annuled, I am just so disheartened about his request I pull out completely. Can anyone explain it so it makes sense?

That does sound like some confused advice. Is this particular priest the pastor of your parish? If not, you might consider speaking to the pastor.

 

[mrsjmwhts1]

He is the pastor. I called back and asked for clarification. He said RCIA is only for people who have no barriers for conversion and I am “ready” for it.

He said either I stay “married” (though my marriage is not recognized because of my husband’s first marriage), live in sin and we try to get his marriage annulled - then I can start RCIA

or

I get divorced, I can attend RCIA and convert while trying to annul my own marriage (in the event I want to marry again in the future this won’t be lingering out there).

I took notes while we spoke - because I am so confused and frankly, ignorant on the whole topic - and that is what he said.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I am going through almost the same thing now. I am attending RCIA. I am married (my first) and my husband’s second. Neither of us are Catholic. We are actually separated. I moved out on 8/10/07 due to many issues I won’t bring up here. We have not decided to divorce and will be starting counseling at the end of the month. However, I received a call from the priest of the church just this morning during which he told me it would be best if we were divorced because it would be less to deal with and if we stay together his first marriage must be annuled before they would even consider letting me into the church. He recommended I stop attending classes until I figure something out and suggested we talk again in a month because I might have a better idea of how my marriage will work out. His resposnes and guidance confuse me. He stated he would prefer I don’t make friends and relationships through RCIA if he’s just going to have to decline allowing me into the church and pull me out anyway. I was hoping I could continue to at least attend and use it as a period of inquiry. I understand the requirements regarding his prior marriage and the need for that to be annuled, I am just so disheartened about his request I pull out completely. Can anyone explain it so it makes sense?

I don’t understand his suggestion either. You should continue to attend as an Inquirer as long as it takes. He does not have the ability to make the decision for you.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

He is the pastor. I called back and asked for clarification. He said RCIA is only for people who have no barriers for conversion and I am “ready” for it.

He said either I stay “married” (though my marriage is not recognized because of my husband’s first marriage), live in sin and we try to get his marriage annulled - then I can start RCIA

or

I get divorced, I can attend RCIA and convert while trying to annul my own marriage (in the event I want to marry again in the future this won’t be lingering out there).

I took notes while we spoke - because I am so confused and frankly, ignorant on the whole topic - and that is what he said.

Well first the period of Inquiry is open to anyone in any situation. He should not prohibit you from attending as an Inquirer. I personally feel when you feel you are ready to commit. you should be permitted to go through the Rite of Welcome. Knowing full well you can’t enter the Church without first the Marriage situation being resolved. If you divorce there would be no need for you to seek an annulment unless you plan to marry again. If you stay married you will both need to seek annulments. Keeping in mind what you will do if either is NOT found invalid.

 

[jmcrae]

Well first the period of Inquiry is open to anyone in any situation. He should not prohibit you from attending as an Inquirer. I personally feel when you feel you are ready to commit. you should be permitted to go through the Rite of Welcome. Knowing full well you can’t enter the Church without first the Marriage situation being resolved. If you divorce there would be no need for you to seek an annulment unless you plan to marry again. If you stay married you will both need to seek annulments. Keeping in mind what you will do if either is NOT found invalid.

Maybe they don’t have the option to remain in the Period of Inquiry - maybe it is the collegial program of RCIA that they are doing. In which case, it would not be possible to remain in the Period of Inquiry past the date when they do the Rite of Welcome or Rite of Acceptance.

If this is the situation, then I would encourage her to keep going to Sunday Mass and attend other educational opportunities, but wait for RCIA until the marriage situation has been resolved one way or another.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Maybe they don’t have the option to remain in the Period of Inquiry - maybe it is the collegial program of RCIA that they are doing. In which case, it would not be possible to remain in the Period of Inquiry past the date when they do the Rite of Welcome or Rite of Acceptance.

If this is the situation, then I would encourage her to keep going to Sunday Mass and attend other educational opportunities, but wait for RCIA until the marriage situation has been resolved one way or another.

The what? The “collegial program of RCIA”? My Rite book does not have anything in it called that.

 

[puzzleannie]

I want to return to OP, they hypothetical case of the non-Christian with 5 previous marriages who now seeks to become Catholic. Yes each marriage must be investigated and judged by the tribunal. It is highly likely that this investigation will look at the reason for the break-ups, and look for any condition, inclination or problem that must be addressed and rectified before this person is judged competent to fully consent to marriage again. His annulment, presuming all the previous marriages are null and void, will most likely have conditions attached. For instance if the reason for the break-ups was a pattern of infidelity on his part, he would have to show a genuine conversion of his attitude toward marriage and manner of living.

 

[jmcrae]

The what? The “collegial program of RCIA”? My Rite book does not have anything in it called that.

RCIA is presented in two forms: the most common one is the college-class format that runs from September to Easter. Each period is of a specific length, and either you are ready to move on to the next period at that time, or else you drop out. The Period of Inquiry typically ends at the First Sunday of Advent, everyone receives the Rite of Welcome or the Rite of Acceptance, and then they all move into the Period of Catechesis as a group, with no option for anybody to remain in the Period of Inquiry.

Those who can’t receive the Rite of Acceptance or the Rite of Welcome because of some impediment, such as a marriage situation, have to drop out of RCIA at that point.

The other method of presenting RCIA is the “church year” method, where the Period of Inquiry and the Period of Catechesis run side by side. When the individual is ready to move into Catechesis, he applies to the priest for the Rite of Acceptance or Rite of Welcome, receives it at the next convenient opportunity, and then enters Catechesis the same week. His co-Inquirers, meanwhile, continue on in the Period of Inquiry until they find themselves ready for Catechesis. In some cases, a large number of Inquirers might go at the same time, and in other cases, it might just be one or two who are ready at the same time. But there is always the option for those who aren’t ready yet, to remain in the Period of Inquiry. If there is a delay with getting their marriage situation resolved, they don’t have to drop out altogether - they just stay in Inquiry until everything gets sorted out, and then when it’s all done, they go into Catechesis without having to wait any* longer* than that.

 

[Andreas_Hofer]

He is the pastor. I called back and asked for clarification. He said RCIA is only for people who have no barriers for conversion and I am “ready” for it.

He said either I stay “married” (though my marriage is not recognized because of my husband’s first marriage), live in sin and we try to get his marriage annulled - then I can start RCIA

or

I get divorced, I can attend RCIA and convert while trying to annul my own marriage (in the event I want to marry again in the future this won’t be lingering out there).

I took notes while we spoke - because I am so confused and frankly, ignorant on the whole topic - and that is what he said.

As puzzleannie is always good to point out, none of us here is really competent to advise on the specifics of someone’s marriage case, but I thought I would note that I can’t at all understand why your pastor would pose the first approach as an option - stay in sin until an anullment comes? I just don’t understand.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

RCIA is presented in two forms: the most common one is the college-class format that runs from September to Easter. Each period is of a specific length, and either you are ready to move on to the next period at that time, or else you drop out. The Period of Inquiry typically ends at the First Sunday of Advent, everyone receives the Rite of Welcome or the Rite of Acceptance, and then they all move into the Period of Catechesis as a group, with no option for anybody to remain in the Period of Inquiry.

Those who can’t receive the Rite of Acceptance or the Rite of Welcome because of some impediment, such as a marriage situation, have to drop out of RCIA at that point.

The other method of presenting RCIA is the “church year” method, where the Period of Inquiry and the Period of Catechesis run side by side. When the individual is ready to move into Catechesis, he applies to the priest for the Rite of Acceptance or Rite of Welcome, receives it at the next convenient opportunity, and then enters Catechesis the same week. His co-Inquirers, meanwhile, continue on in the Period of Inquiry until they find themselves ready for Catechesis. In some cases, a large number of Inquirers might go at the same time, and in other cases, it might just be one or two who are ready at the same time. But there is always the option for those who aren’t ready yet, to remain in the Period of Inquiry. If there is a delay with getting their marriage situation resolved, they don’t have to drop out altogether - they just stay in Inquiry until everything gets sorted out, and then when it’s all done, they go into Catechesis without having to wait any* longer* than that.

We must seek to put an end to the form you describe in the first paragraph. It is not and never has been an official form and does not conform to the purpose of the Rite at all. But then that is not the original question of this thread.