"Divorced" Priests

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RobertinRSA

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Hi…

I have heard of two divorced men in Austria who were ordained without getting an annulment. They were granted special dispensation! What are the canonical grounds for this?

Thanks…
 
Canon 1047.2#3
Can. 1042 The following are simply impeded from receiving orders:
1° a man who has a wife, unless he is lawfully destined for the permanent diaconate;
Can. 1047 §1 If the fact on which they are based has been brought to the judicial forum, dispensation from all irregularities is reserved to the Apostolic See alone.
§2 Dispensation from the following irregularities and impediments to the reception of orders is also reserved to the Apostolic See:
…]
3° the impediment mentioned in can. 1042, n. 1.
tee
 
Thanks Tee…

So basically the thing is to get into Benedict XVI’s “good book”?! 😃
 
So basically the thing is to get into Benedict XVI’s “good book”?! 😃
I’m saying the canonical ground is explicit in the law.

If you want to know *why *such dispensation was granted, you’ll have to ask the gentlemen involved or petition the Apostolic See (or perhaps the ordaining see), and find out if it is any of you business. 😉

tee
 
So - heres the deal. What if a man wants to become a deacon or Priest but doesnt want an annulment because he believes that he would be ‘twisting’ the truth in obtaining an annulment,In other words he entered into the marriage in full awarensess of his responsibilties but his wife left him. Any suggestions on this?
Thanks
 
I know a priest who was ordained without an annulment. It consisted of a divorce with no chance of reconciliation. I believe the wife had already re-married outside the Church . I know another who was divorced and was given an annulment before ordination.
it is all up to a decision made in Rome.👍
 
Signs of the times…
When I first read the title, I thought the two men had divorced each other:o:o:o. and then
been ordained without an annulment.:o:o:o Took me reading the replies to get it right!!!:
LOL
 
So - heres the deal. What if a man wants to become a deacon or Priest but doesnt want an annulment because he believes that he would be ‘twisting’ the truth in obtaining an annulment,In other words he entered into the marriage in full awarensess of his responsibilties but his wife left him. Any suggestions on this?
Thanks
A person in such a situation would discuss it with the diocesan vocations director, and possibly the bishop. If the bishop chooses to admit this person to study for the priesthood or diaconate, the bishop would submit the case to Rome for a dispensation.

So, this person would be called to submit to their bishop’s decision regarding admittance to the seminary, and if the dispensation is denied to Rome’s decision regarding ordination. This person might then ask themselves how they can serve in a lay capacity.
 
Annulments are to help heal a painful past and to enter into a valid marriage. If a divorced man enters the seminary with no intention of getting married, then the need for an annulment is redundant.

Divorce is not a sin. Re-marraige into an adulterous relationship is a sin. That is what annulments are for, to ensure there is no impediment to a valid marriage.
 
Annulments are to help heal a painful past and to enter into a valid marriage. If a divorced man enters the seminary with no intention of getting married, then the need for an annulment is redundant.

Divorce is not a sin. Re-marraige into an adulterous relationship is a sin. That is what annulments are for, to ensure there is no impediment to a valid marriage.
This isn’t completely true.

A decree of nullity is not **only **for the purpose of ensuring there is no impediment to a valid marriage. A decree of nullity, or lack of it, impacts the **canonical status **of an individual and certain rights within canon law.

As we have seen, a married man is **impeded **from becoming a priest. A man who has been married and divorced is canonically still a married man, and thus impeded from Orders. A man who has been married and divorced who has obtained a decree of nullity is NOT married and therefore is NOT impeded from Holy Orders.

Therefore, a decree of nullity is necessary to *remove *the impediment to Orders. It is possible, though rare, to be *dipsensed from *the impediment by a favor of the Holy See while still validly married.

Similarly, a man or woman’s ability to profess vows in a religious order would be impacted by their canonical status. Also the ability to hold certain offices and perform certain functions.

So, no a decree of nullity from an attempt at marriage is not “just” about the ability to enter into a future marriage.
 
Hello Ike and everyone.
Yes your comments Ike are as I suspected. As I understand it, there is no way a divorced man without annulment can become a Priest/Deacon. Its a shame though,if that man entered the marriage with a view to honour his vows and the divorce was a result of adultary on his ex wifes behalf. Annulment in this case would surelybe a technicality which may involve untruths about intentions in order to obtain an unmarried status. It would seem more honest to admit failure in marriage and vow celebacy from now on. I respect the Catholic ideals on these matters but in certain cases like this it would be nice if allowances could be made.
As was previously commented - - - maybe ecceptions can be made.
Thanks
 
Hello Ike and everyone.
Yes your comments Ike are as I suspected. As I understand it, there is no way a divorced man without annulment can become a Priest/Deacon. Thanks
Please go back and re-read the responses. No one said “no way”. They said the process is more complicated than if there is an annulment or if the person was never married.

A priestly candidate can be dispensed from the impediment that marriage creates. This is what happens when a married convert becomes a priest. It would also apply to someone who is validly still married but civilly divorced.

Note there IS NO imediment to the permanent deaconate due to marriage. Most permanent deacons are married men (at least in the US).
 
Annulments are to help heal a painful past and .
While that is often a desirable side effect, that isn’t what the annulment process is for.
to enter into a valid marriage.
Again, while a decree of nullity for a previous marriage is required before marrying validly, it is not the purpose of the annullment process.
If a divorced man enters the seminary with no intention of getting married, then the need for an annulment is redundant.
No. A person who is divorced can decide to pursue an annullment for many reasons, remarriage is only one of them. Other possibilities would be to free the ex-spouse to marry, to resolve family conflict, to enter religious life or simply to know the status of the attempted first marriage.
Divorce is not a sin.
Divorce is not always a sin but sometimes it is.
Re-marraige into an adulterous relationship is a sin.
Absolutely correct.
That is what annulments are for, to ensure there is no impediment to a valid marriage
Once again, that is an effect of a decree of nullity but not what annullments “are for”.
 
I see a strange combination of truths mixed in with misconceptions here.

A declaration of nullity is about finding the truth of a marriage in a particular case, not merely about freeing a couple up to marry someone else or freeing a man up to pursue sacred ordination or a man or woman up to pursue religious life.

According to Catholic teaching, once a man and a woman enter into a valid marriage, they are bound to each other until the end of one of the spouse’s life.

There are two exceptions:
  1. The Pauline privilege mentioned in the Book of Acts (?), which permits in the case of two unbelievers (unbaptized persons), one of which converts to Christianity, the other refuses to remain with the believer. In this case, the marriage may be dissolved by apostolic decree upon petition by one of the spouses. They are then free to marry again.
  2. The Petrine privilege which is based on the idea that eventhough a man and a woman have had a ceremony, it is really when the couple first has intercourse with each other that they really are married. If and only if it can be proven that a man and a woman have not had intercourse, a spouse or both of them may petition the Holy See to dissolve the marriage. They are then free to marry again.
Now, declarations of nullity are entirely different. These are declarations that a valid marriage never took place in the first place, not Catholic divorces, usually evidenced, but not always, by the fact of marital strife. Since the grace of the marital sacrament never took effect in the first place, it is reasoned that strife will occur. In order to understand marriage validity, think of when you are making a secular contract, say to buy a house for example. If somebody puts a gun up to your head and orders you to sign the housing contract, one could argue in court later that the contract was not valid. The same thing goes on with the validity of marriage if the rules for being married in the Church are not followed. In at least one case, however, a couple petitioned for an investigation of their marriage w/o marital strife.

In one such case, a man petitioned for an investigation of his marriage simply to prove to his wife that their marriage was valid (CLSA Roman Replies and Advisory Opinions-2002 (?)). Well, in the first instance, the tribunal ruled that the marriage indeed was invalid. When another tribunal in the second instance reviewed the case, it affirmed the first tribunal’s ruling. Then the man tried to abort the proceedings. In other words, these cases are not merely about how the petitioner(s) may benefit from them, like a person seeking damages in a secular court. They are about finding out the truth of a matter, whether it profits the petitioner(s) or not, so as to uphold the divine honor and the salvation of souls. As for how the aforementioned case ended up, I don’t know.
 
Hello Ike and everyone.
Yes your comments Ike are as I suspected. As I understand it, there is no way a divorced man without annulment can become a Priest/Deacon. Its a shame though,if that man entered the marriage with a view to honour his vows and the divorce was a result of adultary on his ex wifes behalf. Annulment in this case would surelybe a technicality which may involve untruths about intentions in order to obtain an unmarried status. It would seem more honest to admit failure in marriage and vow celebacy from now on. I respect the Catholic ideals on these matters but in certain cases like this it would be nice if allowances could be made.
As was previously commented - - - maybe ecceptions can be made.
Thanks
Admitting failure in marriage may be honest, but not germane to the issue. An annulment says there was never a valid marriage. The wife’s adultery would have nothing to do with whether the marriage was valid, unless she entered the marriage never intending to be faithful. Adultery is not grounds for annulment.
 
Hello Ike and everyone.
Yes your comments Ike are as I suspected. As I understand it, there is no way a divorced man without annulment can become a Priest/Deacon. Its a shame though,if that man entered the marriage with a view to honour his vows and the divorce was a result of adultary on his ex wifes behalf.
As has been pointed out, a dispensation from the Holy See is required. So, it is not that there is “no way” but that it is an exceptional basis.
Annulment in this case would surelybe a technicality
No, it would not ‘surely’ be a technicality. Adultery is not grounds for nullity. A decree of nullity confirms the fact that a valid marriage did not take place. Adultery after a person is validly married does not change the validity of the marriage. Those who experience infidelity are called to reconcile and live a communal life with their spouse. If the spouse will not reconcile, that persno remains bound by the indissoluable bond of marriage nonetheless.
which may involve untruths about intentions in order to obtain an unmarried status.
A person who would **lie **to receive a decree of nullity is NOT a candidate for ordination to the priesthood. Such a person is unfit.
It would seem more honest to admit failure in marriage and vow celebacy from now on.
A person would certainly be called to remain chaste if they were unable to reconcile with their spouse. That is not relevant to the requirements of the priesthood. The discipline in the Latin Church is that priest are called from the unmarried.
I respect the Catholic ideals on these matters but in certain cases like this it would be nice if allowances could be made. As was previously commented - - - maybe ecceptions can be made.
Thanks
In rare cases, a dispensation can be obtained. This would not, however, be the norm.
 
Thank you. I do understand all this, I suppose I have a slight hang up about the fact that annulment appears to be mainly used as a means (loophole) for Catholics to re-marry. In my case there is no desire to do so and the vows were intentional. I understand howver that it would free the ex wife to legally re-marry. I will investigate further locally but it has already been stated by head deacon that diaconate preparation couldnt even be considered without annulmant of marriage, I appreciate different Bishops may be more liberal in other areas.
Thanks
 
  1. The Petrine privilege which is based on
Code:
the idea that eventhough a man and a woman have had a ceremony, it is really when the couple first has intercourse with each other that they really are married
. If and only if it can be proven that a man and a woman have not had intercourse, a spouse or both of them may petition the Holy See to dissolve the marriage. They are then free to marry again.
Wow! That is not at all an accurate description of the Petrine Privilege, and the highlighted bit is absolutely not a Catholic understanding of the sacrament.

In a nutshell:

  • *]The Pauline Privilege is a process dissolving an otherwise valid marriage between parties who had not been baptized.
    *]The Petrine Privilege is a process dissolving an otherwise valid marriage between parties, of whom one was baptized and one was not.
    *]A baptized couple who are otherwise free to marry and exchange consent in an acceptable manner become validly and sacramentally married. If/when such a couple consummate that already valid and sacramental marriage it is rendered indissoluble

    Wow!

    tee
 
Hello Ike and everyone.
Yes your comments Ike are as I suspected. As I understand it, there is no way a divorced man without annulment can become a Priest/Deacon. Thanks
no this understanding is not completely true, as stated and documented, the Vatican can grant a dispensation

unless and until someone presents positive proof otherwise, we assume that any man who has been ordained in spite of a previous marriage has gone through the proper canonical process.

if you want to debate annulment, there are ongoing threads for that.
 
thanks for all these comments, I’m sorry I dont want this to turn into a Christian ethical discussion on annulment. I will explore other avenues towards ordination from a civil divorced perspective and will report back if anything other that what might be expected comes to light. God Bless.
 
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