Do all Eastern priests have beards?

  • Thread starter Thread starter followingtheway
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Elijahmaria said:
;);)…I’ve been trying to goad somebody into finding some images. I only ever saw an Orthodox priest mention the fact that in the ancient iconography, the holy fathers were often clean shaven, with short hair. I never did go look…but I never forgot what he’d said.
Click to expand...
Not a lot of research is required: just pop to any good icon store on line and have a look.

Cut hair is far more common than uncut hair. And trimmed beards are perhaps as common as uncut ones - esp it appears in the pre-Nicean era.

Among those that appear beardless in common representations, most are younger men - pre-middle age - but not so young that they would be beardless without shaving. There are many examples. Some are uncommon, but many are well-known

Apostle Thomas
Apostle Philip
Protomartyr Stephen
George
Demetrius of Thessaloniki
Nestor of Thessaloniki
Zenobius (and Zenobia)
Saint Procopius of Caesarea
Sergios and Bacchos
Saint Panteleimon
Saints Timothy (and Maura)
Martyr Timolaos of Pontus
Martyr Tryphon of Campsada
Saint Victor (Theban Legion)
(Cosmas) Damien
Romanos
Saint Phanurius
(Boris) Gleb
John the Kalabytes (Hut-Dweller)
John the Russian
New Martyr Triandaphylos of Zagora
Peter the Aleut
etc.
 
FrancisB said:
I asked an Orthodox priest friend of mine about this. Coincidently, he has a goatee, but not the big stereo-typical priest beard. What he told me is that it all comes down to the tradition in the ancient world that men wore beards as a sign of their masculinity. The icons of the Eastern fathers often show them wearing beards, unless they were mentioned as being particularly boyish, or died young. St. John the Evangelist comes to mind. Essentially, wearing a beard showed how manly the priests were–and bear in mind this is coming from a tradition that allowed married men to become priests.

The Western tradition actually looks at the same tradition, but took a different slant on it–at least that’s what my priest friend told me. The idea was that priests were to be clean shaven as a sign of humility. By denying them the sign of their masculinity Western priests were humbled before their fellow men and therefore before God, who was born a man.

None of this, however, is dogma, and it may well be just one of those pious stories that explains an old tradition without any bearing on reality; I’m not sure. I just find it interesting, and I thought others might like it.
Click to expand...
Traditions!

https://classes.lt.unt.edu/Fall_2010/CECS_5420_020/sas0010/assign5/beardtypes1.jpg
 
dvdjs said:
most are younger men
Click to expand...
Yes. And that is why those saints are usually depicted without beards. It is also interesting that many of the non-bearded saints were soldiers. :hmmm:

However, the beards far outwigh the non-beards. 😃
 
dvdjs said:
Is the “tradition” that only old men had beards?
Click to expand...
I think it is more like a symbolic gesture to show the youthfulness of the saint depicted in the Icon. It can take a long time to grow one of those impressive beards! 😃

It is exceedingly rare to see Holy Icons of Elders, Bishops, Monastics, Hermits, and most Presbyters…without a beard. 🤷
 
Mickey said:
In Holy Orthodoxy, everything has meaning. I don’t think things should be dismissed so quickly with explanations of “being caught up in externals”. We love our “externals” and it does not mean that we are pharisaical. I love my incense with bells on the censer…I love the colorful vestments…I love the countless Icons…I love the beeswax candles…and yes…I like a priest or bishop with a nice long beard. 😃

Is he holier if he has a beard? Of course not.

What does the beard signify? The article posted earlier is a good explanation.
orthodoxinfo.com/praxis/clergy_hair.aspx
Click to expand...
So, I guess beards are small “t” tradition, hence not essential to the faith, as opposed to dogma or large “T” tradition, those things which are essential.

I’m not “dismissing” anything. I have, however, while in the Orthodox Church, encountered many, many Orthodox converts who confuse the two and get hung-up on the non-essential externals at the expense of that which is truly needful and essential in the Faith, thus becoming pharisaical. This is not to dismiss the “meaning” or symbolism of said externals or to discount their importance where such importance exists.

That’s all I was trying to say :D.

Shalom!
Jeff
 
MrPip said:
I have, however, while in the Orthodox Church, encountered many, many Orthodox converts who confuse the two and get hung-up on the non-essential externals at the expense of that which is truly needful and essential in the Faith, thus becoming pharisaical.
Click to expand...
Really? Many many?!?

We are all fallen sinful people. It is best that you do not judge what other may or may not consider as “essential to the faith” and focus on your own salvation.
 
Mickey said:
I think it is more like a symbolic gesture to show the youthfulness of the saint depicted in the Icon. It can take a long time to grow one of those impressive beards! 😃

It is exceedingly rare to see Holy Icons of Elders, Bishops, Monastics, Hermits, and most Presbyters…without a beard. 🤷
Click to expand...
Most of those sainted by the Church were monastics or bishops (who were monastics). The monastic practice is to not trim the hair as a sign that you’re not concerned with outward appearance but the things of the spirit. Presbyters on the other hand would trim their hair, although beards were still the norm (think St. John Chrysostom).
 
On a related topic, I’ve seen a trend with converts to Orthodoxy growing their hair long and not trimming their beards as well. Are laymen monastics now? 🤷
 
dcointin said:
Most of those sainted by the Church were monastics or bishops (who were monastics). The monastic practice is to not trim the hair as a sign that you’re not concerned with outward appearance but the things of the spirit. Presbyters on the other hand would trim their hair, although beards were still the norm (think St. John Chrysostom).
Click to expand...
Yes.
 
At any rate, the fact that a topic like this can consume Orthodox discussions is a sign of our overwhelming fidelity to our tradition, whether it be Holy Tradition or just custom. As a former Lutheran I find this immensely reassuring.
 
Mickey said:
Really? Many many?!?

We are all fallen sinful people. It is best that you do not judge what other may or may not consider as “essential to the faith” and focus on your own salvation.
Click to expand...
Well…thank you so much for the unsolicited advice 👍.

Yes, it was many, many, I am sorry to say. And I can’t, in all honesty, say that I wasn’t among them every once in a while.😊🤷

I do try to focus on my own salvation, as a matter of fact. I also (think I) know the difference between small “t” and large “T” traditions in both Orthodoxy and Catholicism–the one being non-essential, the other being essential to the Faith. It is not a matter of being judgmental, just knowing the difference. And, if my “knowing” is faulty, I’m always more than happy to be (non-judgmentally) corrected and set right. That’s why I put “think I” in parentheses above.

My own sinfulness is great and I thank God repeatedly for the Church and her Sacraments.

Shalom,
Jeff
 
dcointin said:
At any rate, the fact that a topic like this can consume Orthodox discussions is a sign of our overwhelming fidelity to our tradition, whether it be Holy Tradition or just custom. As a former Lutheran I find this immensely reassuring.
Click to expand...
Peace and prayers to you and yours for the glorious Feast of the Nativity of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ and Holy Theophany! 🙂
 
MrPip said:
It is not a matter of being judgmental, just knowing the difference.
Click to expand...
Wonderful…then it should not matter if you (we) “think” someone may be acting in a pharisaical manner. You (we) cannot read hearts.

That sinner,
Mickey
 
Mickey said:
Peace and prayers to you and yours for the glorious Feast of the Nativity of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ and Holy Theophany! 🙂
Click to expand...
Ephesians 3:14 This, then, is what I pray, kneeling before the Father, 15 from whom every fatherhood, in heaven or on earth, takes its name. 16 In the abundance of his glory may he, through his Spirit, enable you to grow firm in power with regard to your inner self, 17 so that Christ may live in your hearts through faith, and then, planted in love and built on love, 18 with all God’s holy people you will have the strength to grasp the breadth and the length, the height and the depth;19 so that, knowing the love of Christ, which is beyond knowledge, you may be filled with the utter fullness of God.

Peace
 
In keeping with the OP…What would regular shaving have been like 2000 years ago?

peace
 
hazcompat said:
Ephesians 3:14 This, then, is what I pray, kneeling before the Father, 15 from whom every fatherhood, in heaven or on earth, takes its name. 16 In the abundance of his glory may he, through his Spirit, enable you to grow firm in power with regard to your inner self, 17 so that Christ may live in your hearts through faith, and then, planted in love and built on love, 18 with all God’s holy people you will have the strength to grasp the breadth and the length, the height and the depth;19 so that, knowing the love of Christ, which is beyond knowledge, you may be filled with the utter fullness of God.
Click to expand...
Luke 2:11-15
For, this day, is born to you a Saviour, who is Christ the Lord, in the city of David. And this shall be a sign unto you. You shall find the infant wrapped in swaddling clothes, and laid in a manger. And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly army, praising God, and saying: Glory to God in the highest; and on earth peace to men of good will. And it came to pass, after the angels departed from them into heaven, the shepherds said one to another: Let us go over to Bethlehem, and let us see this word that is come to pass, which the Lord hath shewed to us.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top