Do all priests know Latin enough to say Latin Mass?

[lak611]

In my diocese the seminary does not have Latin as a requirement. They are focused on Spanish right now. Even older priests I do not think would know Latin in my diocese and if they did, they would be very against the MP. I also heard from some seminarians that right now now some bishops do not know Latin either. I cannot confirm that but it would not surprise me.

From the website of St. Mary’s Seminary in Cleveland:

Linguistic Skills

A. Greek, Hebrew, Latin

B. German, French, or Spanish

         It is desirable that a student has a reading knowledge of one of the biblical languages and of one of the classical or modern languages.  Decisions about additional language skills should be related to the future work of the individual.  Thus, French or German should be included for a person contemplating possible graduate study in academic theology.  Spanish or a language of the Third World might be of value for another ministry.

Latin is not required.

 

[BobP123]

Latin is not required.

Hmmm. Is that a Catholic seminary?

Can. 249 The Charter of Priestly Formation is to provide that the students are not only taught their native language accurately, but are also well versed in latin, and have a suitable knowledge of other languages which would appear to be necessary or useful for their formation or for the exercise of their pastoral ministry.

 

[stmaria]

The issue is not so much that of learning Latin, though that ceratinly is a justfied concern,** but of learning the complex rubrics involved in the old rite.** Even older priests ordained back in the day have to completely retrain themselves, to undo forty years of other habits. This generally proves more involved than the Latin issue.

But the good news is that training is now offered by the FSSP and SSJC and I expect that they will increase the frequency and venues of the training offered.

The Priest makes the Sign of the Cross 52 times in the Latin Mass and I believe 33 genuflections that represent the 33 years of the life of Jesus plus many other complex rubics.So you are right it is much more than Latin.

 

[Brendan]

The Indult Mass here in Detroit is served by diocesan priests, not the FSSP.

As such, several have taken the time to learn (including my own Pastor).

In addition, two of our Auxilliary Bishops also celebrate the TLM at our Indult TLM as their schedules allow (several times a year). As both were ordained post V-II, each had to learn the rubrics, including the rubrics for a Pontifical High Mass

So any priest here who is competent in Latin ( which is required at our Seminary) would have several priests to train them in the rubics.

 

[historybrat]

I don’t think the question is really do priest know enough Latin to give TLM mass. I think the question would be do priest have the desire to learn Latin. My priest is a good man, who truly cares about his parish, but has come out quite vocally about anything that was pre-Vat II. In fact anything that smacks of traditionalism will usually get him going. He’s not a bad guy, and he does remember a bit of Latin for his seminary days, but I know we will never have a TLM mass given in our parish while he’s around. Just down the highway about 40 miles is a much younger priest who has expressed his willingness to learn Latin for TLM if there seems to be interest for a TLM mass.

I really believe that whether you are lucky enought o have a TLM available will depend solely on what the priests want to do and not on the language abilities.

Historybrat

 

[sojo]

WOW! I am thank all of you so much for your answers. Yes, I will have to ask Father if he intends to celebrate the Latin Mass and see what he says. I will be prepared for him to poo-poo it – or embrace it. I couldn’t brand him a post VII liberal nor a traditionalist – he’s just… Father, with his own quirks (like wearing sandals or sneakers and jeans under his vestments and NEVER wearing a collar outside of church – strips down to jeans and t-shirt in the vestry before even heading next door to the rectory).

I also appreciated someone commenting that “saying” the Mass in Latin is not the same as “praying” the Mass.

We seldom have the luxury of attending any Mass right now, as both my husband and I work 7 days a week (2 and 3 jobs each, respectively – hard times), and with only one vehicle, no public transport, and few Masses available in a rural area, it has been months since we were able to attend any Mass at all, and that last one was a daily Mass celebrated in 10 minutes with no homily and all shooed out of the Church immediately after so they could lock up.

But I so hope to experience a truly worshipful Latin Mass sometime somehow. My son is 10 years old with Down syndrome, and we are learning a bit of Latin together in his home school. It is exciting to listen to our Holy Father speak in Latin and be able to pick up a few words here and there!

sojo

 

[rwoehmke]

I guess this question rises another in my mind. The assumption seems to be that “Father” will learn Latin if he doesn’t have it and retrain in the new/old rubrics. I don’ know anbout other dioceses, but in ours most parish priests are responsible for a cluster of two or three parishes, as well as being responsible for some aspects of diocesan administration. When does the load we expect them to carry drive them into the ground. A lot of them are no longer young and vigorous anymore. What about the impact on their health. I don’t think many lay people have any idea how busy they are. There is always the comment, well he takes xxxday off to play golf. All work and no pay makes Jack a dull boy. What would it do to our priests? Are you all ready to put out $50 thousand or more for a lay administrator? I am glad that Benedict has fulfilled the dream, but its going to be interesting to see what impact this decision has on the life of the Church. Pray that God will provide.

 

[AngelicDoctor]

I guess this question rises another in my mind. The assumption seems to be that “Father” will learn Latin if he doesn’t have it and retrain in the new/old rubrics. I don’ know anbout other dioceses, but in ours most parish priests are responsible for a cluster of two or three parishes, as well as being responsible for some aspects of diocesan administration. When does the load we expect them to carry drive them into the ground. A lot of them are no longer young and vigorous anymore. What about the impact on their health. I don’t think many lay people have any idea how busy they are. There is always the comment, well he takes xxxday off to play golf. All work and no pay makes Jack a dull boy. What would it do to our priests? Are you all ready to put out $50 thousand or more for a lay administrator? I am glad that Benedict has fulfilled the dream, but its going to be interesting to see what impact this decision has on the life of the Church. Pray that God will provide.

Good point. Competency in Latin and the rubrics of the TLM is important, and learning it is possible for at least many priests,… but I am in the Dubuque, IA Archdiocese and priests w/ 4 parishes here is common… it will not be easy for them to cram in lessons for something that is so important. Another point that will require patience on the part of the lay faithful.

 

[pjn6444]

You could hear a Latin mass before now. A priest can say mass in any language, including Latin. There are many liturgical differences besides a different language.

 

[OutinChgoburbs]

Our priest knows Latin, Greek, Hebrew with some Aramiac- and has trouble with Spanish. He knows both Masses. He just has to figure out what to do with the NO altar during the TLM, as the church is not only equipped with altar rails, but a HUGE high altar (throwback from the 1950s).

 

[BlestOne]

Judging by my pastors homily and the way he was correcting the NAB spellings of names from biblical times… I would say he knows Latin, Greek, and probably Hebrew too. I would love for him to introduce a Latin mass here. But first he has to find himself an organist that doesn’t have a penchant for drums and “happy/clappy” music…

 

[rwoehmke]

Our priest knows Latin, Greek, Hebrew with some Aramiac- and has trouble with Spanish. He knows both Masses. He just has to figure out what to do with the NO altar during the TLM, as the church is not only equipped with altar rails, but a HUGE high altar (throwback from the 1950s).

Unless the distance between the communion rail and the high altar is very limited, why not just leave it where it is?

 

[mahleh]

For anyone who is interested, if you use the following as a search engine ‘how to say the catholic latin mass’ one of the areas there is speciffically called For The Clergy. It offers a free video, altar cards, etc. on how to preform the mass. I am sure we could call some priests out of retirement to show the young whipper snappers how to say and do the TLM

 

[grrttweaver]

It will be interesting to see if some priests say the Mass in classical Latin rather than Church Latin.

• Kathie :bowdown:

i know Eccelestial Latin is very different from Classical latin

Example:

Eccelestial Latin: In Nomine Patris, et Fili, et Spiritu Sancti. Amen

Classical Latin: In Nomenarum Patris, et Filius, et Spiritarum Sanctum.

 

[chicago]

The Priest makes the Sign of the Cross 52 times in the Latin Mass and I believe 33 genuflections that represent the 33 years of the life of Jesus plus many other complex rubics.So you are right it is much more than Latin.

That would be quite a workout for some of the older priests who remember saying the Mass in the past and might still know how.

 

[Archerette74]

My priest touched on this topic during the homily at mass this past Sunday.

He said that while he would like to say a mass in Latin from time to time, he simply couldn’t yet. He said it would be a minimun of 1 to 1 1/2 years before he would do this. His reason? He had to re-learn the latin mass, he had to find a choir to sing the latin hymns, and he had to train his alter servers on what to do.

 

[lak611]

That would be quite a workout for some of the older priests who remember saying the Mass in the past and might still know how.

There is a retired priest in residence at my parish. He remembers the Latin but would be unable to do the genuflections since he has bad arthritis.

 

[BobP123]

There is a retired priest in residence at my parish. He remembers the Latin but would be unable to do the genuflections since he has bad arthritis.

Not really a problem. I’ve seen some TLM priests bow instead of genuflect, probably for health reasons. I think the congregation will allow for that, don’t you?

 

[lak611]

Not really a problem. I’ve seen some TLM priests bow instead of genuflect, probably for health reasons. I think the congregation will allow for that, don’t you?

I would have no problem if he bowed instead. I am glad that it is ok. Now I will just have to ask Father if he will say a TLM.

 

[Archerette74]

Not really a problem. I’ve seen some TLM priests bow instead of genuflect, probably for health reasons. I think the congregation will allow for that, don’t you?

Of course the congregation would understand. But I think he must have permission (from the Bishop?) to bow instead of genuflect. I don’t think it would be up to the congregation to allow or disallow such a thing. It might have to come from higher up.