Do American Catholics believe in sin?

[Caveman]

The Center for Applied Research in the Apostolate (CARA), at Georgetown University has been publishing trends in American Catholicism since 1995, and their most recent report further illustrates the downward spiral that is The Church in America since the Second Vatican Council.

Below are just a few of the statistics;

• In 1965 the number of priests in this country was 58,632. It was since fallen to 39,993.
• The amount of priestly ordinations in the mid-1960’s was 994. It now stands at 459.
• And the most dramatic drop was in Religious sisters, whose numbers stood at 179,954 in 1965, and have since plummeted to an astonishing 57,544.

Possibly the most shocking number of all is the amount of professed practicing Catholics who receive Holy Communion with regularity, and all but pass on the Sacrament of Confession.

Speaking on grounds of anonymity, one priest commented that a sizable percentage of practicing Catholics “either don’t believe in sin, or the Catholic belief in the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist.”

Click here for the rest of the article.

 

[JRKH]

Do American Catholics believe in sin?

This one does!!!

Been there - Done that

Peace
James

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

The Center for Applied Research in the Apostolate (CARA), at Georgetown University has been publishing trends in American Catholicism since 1995, and their most recent report further illustrates the downward spiral that is The Church in America since the Second Vatican Council.

Below are just a few of the statistics;

• In 1965 the number of priests in this country was 58,632. It was since fallen to 39,993.
• The amount of priestly ordinations in the mid-1960’s was 994. It now stands at 459.
• And the most dramatic drop was in Religious sisters, whose numbers stood at 179,954 in 1965, and have since plummeted to an astonishing 57,544.

Possibly the most shocking number of all is the amount of professed practicing Catholics who receive Holy Communion with regularity, and all but pass on the Sacrament of Confession.

Speaking on grounds of anonymity, one priest commented that a sizable percentage of practicing Catholics “either don’t believe in sin, or the Catholic belief in the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist.”

Click here for the rest of the article.

I don’t know about them but I believe in sin. I have walked in darkness; only those who have can appreciate the light.

 

[Garyjohn2]

I think this is the case in many parts of the world, not just America, right? Europe is having big problems here I believe.

 

[pigtown]

I certainly believe in sin. Just open up a newspaper and you’ll see instances of sins everywhere. Of course, as a mere human being I know that I am a sinner but Christ still loves me.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

I’m a Catholic who happens to be American. And I believe in sin. I ought to --I do enough of it!

Of course some Catholics (and since we’re discussing American ones particularly and they’re the ones I know best, we’ll say American) believe in sin. . .but only ‘other people’ commit it. They (being perfect people) surely don’t!

You know. These are the ones who agree with the Church provided that they aren’t the ones facing the situation.

And they’re the ones who have an ‘excuse’ to make it ‘not sin’ if they happen to do the same thing that they are quick to condemn in others as sin.

Of course the ‘sexual sins’ are big on the list but there’s also a lot of lesser ‘known’ things.

A big ‘sin’ for others but not ‘moi’ for these is things like being ‘judgmental’, or ‘rigid’, or ‘into rules’, or ‘black-and-white’ thinking. And above all–hurting somebody’s feelings. It doesn’t matter how gently something is said. . .if it ‘hurts feelings’ it is a capital sin.

Of course, they usually use rather ‘harsh’ language in scolding those ‘sinful’ people who ‘hurt’ others by telling home truths. . .but you see, it isn’t sinful for them because they are simply ‘rebutting’ the others.

Funny how they can understand that truth can seem ‘harsh’ and accept that when they are laying down their ‘truths’ to us, but they can’t see any kind of ‘reciprocation’ or imagine that they could be the ones in error.

Because above all, many American Catholics are big believers in individualism. And so God (of course) needs to understand that if He doesn’t do HIS part and make things clear, it’s HIS fault if any Catholics make a ‘mistake’ and by god He’d better not ‘damn’ them for it. Of course if He DOES hold them to what they think of as ‘mistaken standards’, they wouldn’t want any ‘god like that’ **anyway. **

And since God is god in their image, they are convinced that they are all going to wind up in heaven anyway. Why worry about ‘petty things’ that they are **'forced into by circumstance" **when God isn’t going to pay any attention? He loves us so He’ll make sure we all wind up happy. (Except for those who dispute their thinking. They’re doomed.)

 

[estesbob]

Well this one does. But I see your point-for way too many believe that the only sin is to believe there is sin.

 

[Musician]

I wonder if most American Catholics don’t believe in sin. What a pity. It is all around them and also in them.
I am constantly amazed at how few I see at confession and then how many I see in the Communion line every Sunday and I can’t help but think, “Really? NONE of you have committed any sins this week? ” Not trying to be judgmental here, but I go to Confession quite often as well as playing Mass every week, and I have a pretty good idea of who goes to Confession and who doesn’t.
Our poor priest does his very best to get people into the habit of going to Confession again but it’s all uphill!

 

[Soutane]

The Center for Applied Research in the Apostolate (CARA), at Georgetown University has been publishing trends in American Catholicism since 1995, and their most recent report further illustrates the downward spiral that is The Church in America since the Second Vatican Council.

Below are just a few of the statistics;

• In 1965 the number of priests in this country was 58,632. It was since fallen to 39,993.
• The amount of priestly ordinations in the mid-1960’s was 994. It now stands at 459.
• And the most dramatic drop was in Religious sisters, whose numbers stood at 179,954 in 1965, and have since plummeted to an astonishing 57,544.

Possibly the most shocking number of all is the amount of professed practicing Catholics who receive Holy Communion with regularity, and all but pass on the Sacrament of Confession.

Speaking on grounds of anonymity, one priest commented that a sizable percentage of practicing Catholics “either don’t believe in sin, or the Catholic belief in the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist.”

Click here for the rest of the article.

I agree with the assessment on confession but as to PRACTISING Catholics believing in the real presence either the commentator got it wrong or the priest is deluded.In North America only 20% of Catholics attend mass i.e. practise their faith,the balance are CINO’s and strangely enough 80% of ALL “Catholics” do not believe in the Real Presence.Wonder which group they fall into

1.5 Billion Catholics-don’t make me laugh.There is a mere remnant 20% in North America,10% in Europe who practise their Faith,The Faith is burning through Africa however and I hope that they send missionaries HERE to evangelise the CINO,s let alone Protestants who are even worse off than we are.

On Saturdays there are approximately 5 people who attend confession,my parish priest in his homilies expresses wonderment at the Saintliness of his congregation and wonders how they are sinless when he him self sins daily.My own brother refuses to go to confession and says V2 allows him to confess his sins internally venial and MORTAL at the beginning of the mass-Christ have mercy.I have tried to correct this mistaken notion but his eyes glaze over.

 

[Ecoclimber]

1.5 Billion Catholics-don’t make me laugh.There is a mere remnant 20% in North America,10% in Europe who practise their Faith,…
On Saturdays there are approximately 5 people who attend confession, my parish priest in his homilies expresses wonderment at the Saintliness of his congregation and wonders how they are sinless when he him self sins daily.My own brother refuses to go to confession and says V2 allows him to confess his sins internally venial and MORTAL at the beginning of the mass-Christ have mercy.I have tried to correct this mistaken notion but his eyes glaze over.

If it’s any comfort to you, these observations are not new, it occurred throughout the history of man relationship with God from the beginning of the Old Testament to the end of the New Testament. Elijah in 1Kings19:10 thought he was the only one that hasn’t fallen away but the Lord reminded him, there were others. Elijah replied, "I have been very zealous for the LORD God Almighty. The Israelites have rejected your covenant, broken down your altars, and put your prophets to death with the sword. I am the only one left, and now they are trying to kill me too.

So likewise St. Paul mentions in Romans.

Rom 11:2-4
2 God did not reject his people, whom he foreknew. Don’t you know what the Scripture says in the passage about Elijah-how he appealed to God against Israel:

3 “Lord, they have killed your prophets and torn down your altars;** I am the only one left**, and they are trying to kill me”?

4 And what was God’s answer to him? “I have reserved for myself seven thousand who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”

 

[Soutane]

If it’s any comfort to you, these observations are not new, it occurred throughout the history of man relationship with God from the beginning of the Old Testament to the end of the New Testament. Elijah in 1Kings19:10 thought he was the only one that hasn’t fallen away but the Lord reminded him, there were others. Elijah replied, "I have been very zealous for the LORD God Almighty. The Israelites have rejected your covenant, broken down your altars, and put your prophets to death with the sword. I am the only one left, and now they are trying to kill me too.

So likewise St. Paul mentions in Romans.

Rom 11:2-4
2 God did not reject his people, whom he foreknew. Don’t you know what the Scripture says in the passage about Elijah-how he appealed to God against Israel:

3 “Lord, they have killed your prophets and torn down your altars;** I am the only one left**, and they are trying to kill me”?

It IS a comfort and I thank you
4 And what was God’s answer to him? “I have reserved for myself seven thousand who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”

 

[OriginalJS]

Sure they do. As for confession, many I speak with just don’t go. As for the Real Presence, some don’t really think about it and treat receiving communion is just part of the Mass or, as one lady told me, “that’s just what Catholics do.” I don’t know that these views were proximately caused by Vatican II - that seems like a stretch.

 

[Bob_Aliano]

I don’t know about them but I believe in sin. I have walked in darkness; only those who have can appreciate the light.

Amen to that, I was lost for over 35 years. I’m now often accused of being too Catholic, that born-again syndrome I guess.

 

[saayra]

I can understand why one might conclude that American Catholics don’t believe in sin. It seems that most of American society as a whole has become so permissive that they are in denial. For practicing Catholics to fall into this trap it takes a priest who is not willing to make individual confession available to everyone. I saw the contrast in priestly handling of sin when we welcomed a new immigrant priest to our parish who is truly a holy man and unafraid to hold each person’s feet to the fire with regard to both attendance and confession. He went out of his way to obtain a sufficient number of priests to hear everyone’s confession at solemnities. He is also more accessible on a weekly basis. I understand that priests are overworked, but this is a huge thing. A priest needs to be brave enough to confront this problem without fear of offending people. The prophets of the OT certainly were unafraid to expose sin!

 

[marci]

Sure they do. As for confession, many I speak with just don’t go. As for the Real Presence, some don’t really think about it and treat receiving communion is just part of the Mass or, as one lady told me, “that’s just what Catholics do.” I don’t know that these views were proximately caused by Vatican II - that seems like a stretch.

I think the lack of good catechism has been one of the realities facing the church since Vatican II. If you believe in the Real Presence and you are aware that a catholic must be in good standing (free from mortal sin) to receive, than you would frequent Confession. My mother went to Catholic school throughout her youth and not only did they attend daily morning Mass, but they went to weekly Confession.

At my parish there are typically 10 to 20 people in line for Confession and hundreds in line for Communion (at one of 5 Sunday Masses)

 

[Elizabeth502]

I suppose there’s a logic in abandoning Confession if you lack conviction about Eucharist being true Transubstantiation --Body and Blood, Soul and Divinity --(I prefer that to the term “Real Presence,” because even some Protestant non-Episcopalians believe in a vague “presence” which leaves much ambiguity. Marcus Grodi has discussed this on Journey Home.)

However, it puzzles me as to why one would remain Catholic, even merely in name, if you no longer believed in the unique power/grace of all of the individual Sacraments, as this is one of the core areas that sets Catholicism apart from most of Protestantism.

For those who do believe in transubstantiation but partake of Confession infrequently, the truth is that they have been poorly catechized in the area of spirituality. One can rattle off all the moral theology teachings by heart, and be lectured on them every Sunday from the pulpit, but that in itself will not attune one to one’s own very frequent failings and serious sins, unless one has been trained in or encouraged to or given opportunities for prayerful introspection. There are an awful lot of weekly Mass attendees who will readily admit they have “no prayer life.” And there are a lot of posters on CAF who actually state on this forum that “it is difficult to commit a mortal sin.” Just amazing. One would think that the only sins that are serious are ones with criminal or civil juridical repercussions.

I’m not making this up or exaggerating. Ask any priest. As but one example, Fr. Larry Richards says he hates it when someone comes to Confession once a year and states that he “hasn’t really done much worth confessing” Then Father begins to ask him pointed questions relating to the deeper reach of each Commandment, and it turns out naturally that he’s done a whole heck of a lot, but hasn’t bothered to look inside and recognize that many everyday habits of behavior and thought and neglect and rationalization, which spring from the omnipresent cardinal sins, are themselves actually serious sins.

Also, there’s a terrible misunderstanding that sins of commission, even if slight, are categorically more serious than sins of omission. Not at all. Depends on the sin, the opportunity, the responsibility, the circumstances, and the practical consequences that occurred.

 

[Shin]

I’m not making this up or exaggerating. Ask any priest. As but one example, Fr. Larry Richards says he hates it when someone comes to Confession once a year and states that he “hasn’t really done much worth confessing” Then Father begins to ask him pointed questions relating to the deeper reach of each Commandment, and it turns out naturally that he’s done a whole heck of a lot, but hasn’t bothered to look inside and recognize that many everyday habits of behavior and thought and neglect and rationalization, which spring from the omnipresent cardinal sins, are themselves actually serious sins.

Also, there’s a terrible misunderstanding that sins of commission, even if slight, are categorically more serious than sins of omission. Not at all. Depends on the sin, the opportunity, the responsibility, the circumstances, and the practical consequences that occurred.

Which reminds me that I once read on an examination of conscience, that not to make a regular examination of conscience was a sin.

If the priests preach sin, that the saved are few, and justice and punishment, people will go to Confession. If they preach softness, near universal salvation, mercy without justice, crime without punishment, few will go to Confession.

Since I have read more than one saint say that priests who fail in their responsibilities to save a single soul in their parish can go to Hell for it…

I am afraid for not only our parishioners but also for our priests. Pretty much everyone. It’s a hard environment to be properly formed in the faith in, even with good motivations. Even in all this, if you seek, you shall find.

 

[Teelynn]

I can understand why one might conclude that American Catholics don’t believe in sin. It seems that most of American society as a whole has become so permissive that they are in denial. For practicing Catholics to fall into this trap it takes a priest who is not willing to make individual confession available to everyone. I saw the contrast in priestly handling of sin when we welcomed a new immigrant priest to our parish who is truly a holy man and unafraid to hold each person’s feet to the fire with regard to both attendance and confession. He went out of his way to obtain a sufficient number of priests to hear everyone’s confession at solemnities. He is also more accessible on a weekly basis. I understand that priests are overworked, but this is a huge thing. A priest needs to be brave enough to confront this problem without fear of offending people. The prophets of the OT certainly were unafraid to expose sin!

AHHH!!! You hit the nail directly on the head. Most parish priests are indeed afraid to turn people off. Thus, how many of us hear of personal sin anymore from the pulpit? The pro life movement has complained about this for quite some time now. Priests are AFRAID to speak of abortion being a MORTAL SIN from the pulpit because they don’t want to offend those in the pews who have had abortions.
What really is a kills me, is that they speak of “social sin” all day long but NEVER A MENTION OF PERSONAL SIN!!!

 

[OriginalJS]

However, it puzzles me as to why one would remain Catholic, even merely in name, if you no longer believed in the unique power/grace of all of the individual Sacraments, as this is one of the core areas that sets Catholicism apart from most of Protestantism.

Because: (1) they grew up in Catholic families and they are comfortable with it; (2) the rituals are beautiful; (3) they are rarely, if ever, challenged by their priests with difficult issues. (4) it is easy and fun to be Catholic.

 

[janman55]

I saw Fr Corapi in St Louis in May and he talked about the loss of the sense of sin. He quoted from Pius XII 1946 Pius XII “ The sin of the century is the loss of the sense of sin “

The issue of pride and our tendency to excuse our selves of sin through moral relativism has now been around for centuries.