Do Baptists really hate Catholics?

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From the link you posted:

I. The Scriptures

The Holy Bible was written by men divinely inspired and is God’s revelation of Himself to man. It is a perfect treasure of divine instruction. It has God for its author, salvation for its end, and truth, without any mixture of error, for its matter. Therefore, all Scripture is totally true and trustworthy. It reveals the principles by which God judges us, and therefore is, and will remain to the end of the world, the true center of Christian union, and the supreme standard by which all human conduct, creeds, and religious opinions should be tried. All Scripture is a testimony to Christ, who is Himself the focus of divine revelation.

“truth, without any mixture of error”…Then why do you remain among those who walked away in John:6?
Considering the fact that I’m not over 2000 years old, technically I wasn’t one of the ones who walked away in John 6. It sounds like you think that as a Baptist I have walked away from Jesus’ death and resurrection as my hope for salvation. However, unless I misunderstand or things have change since the second vatican council, the Holy Roman Catholic Church doesn’t deny that separated brethren have access to salvation even if we aren’t in perfect communion with the Holy Roman Catholic Church. Though I admit I’m not well read in the documents of the second vatican council so I could easily be misinterpreting the passage below.
Moreover, some and even very many of the significant elements and endowments which together go to build up and give life to the Church itself, can exist outside the visible boundaries of the Catholic Church: the written word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, and visible elements too. All of these, which come from Christ and lead back to Christ, belong by right to the one Church of Christ.
The brethren divided from us also use many liturgical actions of the Christian religion. These most certainly can truly engender a life of grace in ways that vary according to the condition of each Church or Community. These liturgical actions must be regarded as capable of giving access to the community of salvation.
It follows that the separated Churches(23) and Communities as such, though we believe them to be deficient in some respects, have been by no means deprived of significance and importance in the mystery of salvation. For the Spirit of Christ has not refrained from using them as means of salvation which derive their efficacy from the very fullness of grace and truth entrusted to the Church.
 
Considering the fact that I’m not over 2000 years old, technically I wasn’t one of the ones who walked away in John 6. It sounds like you think that as a Baptist I have walked away from Jesus’ death and resurrection as my hope for salvation. However, unless I misunderstand or things have change since the second vatican council, the Holy Roman Catholic Church doesn’t deny that separated brethren have access to salvation even if we aren’t in perfect communion with the Holy Roman Catholic Church. Though I admit I’m not well read in the documents of the second vatican council so I could easily be misinterpreting the passage below.
I did not imply that you had no means of salvation. I just cannot understand that if the Scriptures contain no error, why are not Jesus’ very words believed?

I have no way of knowing how God will judge those who “walked away” because it was a “hard teaching”. But Jesus gave Himself to us in the Eucharist, so He could indeed, be with us until the end of time. I just have a hard time wrapping my mind around why some would not take advantage of such a wonderful gift.
 
Being in rural central Texas, which is predominantly baptist, I was destined to fall in love with a baptist girl. whom I married, much to the chagrin of her family. Being a cradle Catholic and not having much memory of any catachesis, I am not sure they were entirely distraught by me marring her.

Then my wife made me go to Church. I said I would IF it was a Catholic Church - thinking she would be totally against the idea… she called me out on that one.

Years later… she was confirmed. God bless her.

While we do have our moments with her parents, (infant baptism, refusing to go ANYWHERE near our parish) I have not had a sense of hostility. If anything, what I sense from them is a burning desire to convert me. I have met the few baptist whom get a wee bit fundie (handing out chick tracts and such), mostly they are those from the larger baptist branches around here… Calvary Chapel, Great Hills, Second Baptist…ext…ext…

I am not sure if baptist hate Catholics, although in my experience, I can definitely say; most baptist have a vague knowledge of Christian history, of our Early Church Fathers and they tend to misunderstand Catholic teachings and Traditions in light of these.
 
Ultimately both Catholics and Baptists should strive to concentrate on the many things we do agree upon.
I’m wondering if you could give us a list of the particular types of Baptists to start with. Because from my own experience (take note of my location), I personally know only one Baptist who has the moderate view of Catholics you describe.

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but even here on these forums, Baptists with your moderate pov are few and far between.
 
I did not imply that you had no means of salvation. I just cannot understand that if the Scriptures contain no error, why are not Jesus’ very words believed?

I have no way of knowing how God will judge those who “walked away” because it was a “hard teaching”. But Jesus gave Himself to us in the Eucharist, so He could indeed, be with us until the end of time. I just have a hard time wrapping my mind around why some would not take advantage of such a wonderful gift.
I don’t think I really understand in what way you mean that Baptists have walked away. We do celebrate the Lord’s Supper in a very similar manner. The main difference is that Baptists view it as an act of remembrance (As directed by Paul in 1 Corinthians 11 and in line with the Gospels) where the bread and cup represent the body and blood that were broken and spilled in sacrifice for us. I don’t think it’s an important distinction if Jesus was speaking literally or figuratively when he said “This is my body given for you; do this in remembrance of me.” The point of the Eucharist/Lord’s Supper is that Jesus made a sacrifice that we desperately needed but could not provide. Also, Baptists tend to use grape juice instead of wine since many parents are uncomfortable giving their kids wine. But I don’t think the symbolism and importance of the celebration are lost using grape juice instead of wine. 😛
I’m wondering if you could give us a list of the particular types of Baptists to start with. Because from my own experience (take note of my location), I personally know only one Baptist who has the moderate view of Catholics you describe.

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but even here on these forums, Baptists with your moderate pov are few and far between.
I’m not sure what you mean by a list of types of Baptists. Unfortunately, Baptists have not been terribly united over the years due to their emphasis on the autonomy of individual churches so there are quite a few different associations/conventions of Baptists.

As the joke goes: Two Catholics, two Lutherans, two Methodists, and two Baptists form a town. The catholics immediately form the Saint Marry’s Catholic Church, the Lutherans form the 1st Lutheran Church, the Methodists the 1st Methodist Church, and the Baptists the 1st and 2nd Baptist churches.

If you’re interested in what all is out there, I’d suggest wikipedia as a good starting point to look. The main doctrine divisions you should look at are mainline, evangelical, and fundamentalists. If you’re encountering very extreme views, it’s most likely from fundamentalists. However, they make up a minority of Baptists.

I’ll be honest, I personally haven’t been to a wide variety of Baptist Churches. However I have frequented both my home church in suburban Houston and my grandparent’s church in rural Texas (historically German part of the Hill Country). Both are evangelical Southern Baptist Churches, and both emphasize the love of Christ and his sacrifice for us and not how Southern Baptist is the only way and everyone else is doing it completely wrong. At the rural Texas church, you are more likely to run into people who aren’t as informed about the Catholic Church. However, their pastor and deacons show nothing but the greatest love and service to people no matter their faith or denomination.

Also, I should note that while I was raised as a Baptist and continue to be active in my church, I’m not an expert on all things Baptist given that I’m only 22. I’m also an engineer not a theologian 😛
 
One quick question please…do Baptists believe that once saved, always saved? Thank you. Shalom haMeshiach.

PAX DOMINI :signofcross:

Shalom Aleichem.
Okay I will attempt to answer this the best I know how. My church (which is SBC) does teach “once saved, always saved”. When a person is truly saved when the Holy Spirit takes up residence in his heart, he is given the gift of eternal life. If we cannot do anything to earn our salvation, then we cannot do anything to lose it. God has us in His hand and He won’t ever let us go. John 6:39 may discuss this but I am not certain as I do not have a Bible with me at present. We can stray from the faith like the prodigal son of course. Or if someone later in life says they no longer believe in God then the actual salvation experience must be questioned. Was it genuine or were they just praying a sinner’s prayer on an emotional high (or low). Our faith should not depend on our emotions (though we will certainly go through highs and lows). There is much more to SBC’s thoughts on the issue but I hope this answered your question in general.

And I know from talking to my Catholic friends that yall disagree with us on this and I respect that. I have struggled with both sides of this topic myself. I do not bind myself to the Baptist doctrine just because I choose to worship there. I bind myself only to the Word of God.
 
Okay I will attempt to answer this the best I know how. My church (which is SBC) does teach “once saved, always saved”. When a person is truly saved when the Holy Spirit takes up residence in his heart, he is given the gift of eternal life. If we cannot do anything to earn our salvation, then we cannot do anything to lose it. God has us in His hand and He won’t ever let us go. John 6:39 may discuss this but I am not certain as I do not have a Bible with me at present. We can stray from the faith like the prodigal son of course. Or if someone later in life says they no longer believe in God then the actual salvation experience must be questioned. Was it genuine or were they just praying a sinner’s prayer on an emotional high (or low). Our faith should not depend on our emotions (though we will certainly go through highs and lows). There is much more to SBC’s thoughts on the issue but I hope this answered your question in general.

And I know from talking to my Catholic friends that yall disagree with us on this and I respect that. I have struggled with both sides of this topic myself. I do not bind myself to the Baptist doctrine just because I choose to worship there. I bind myself only to the Word of God.
What is the “sinner’s prayer”? Where may I find it in the Bible?

thanks.
 
What is the “sinner’s prayer”? Where may I find it in the Bible?

thanks.
Somewhere someplace you have to respond to God’s tug(the gospe) He knocks we have to open our lives/hearts to Him He don’t force His wy into our lives…In the early seventies(1973) my co worker/druggie buddy and I had a radical conversion to Christ…Mine came from a pretty blonde in the office…It was chick tract with scriptures explaining of sin and what Jesus did to provide salvation to me…They invited me to hear and evangelistic message when that was over I knelt in front of that stage asking God to forgive me and I turned my life to Him…That’s what I call a sinners pray…The Holy Spirit started to work on those verses I heard…He bought me to repentance…Every has to chose to repent and follow Him…Thats how we are born anew…Th NT is full of the message being preached…Peter’s first street meeting added 3,000 to the church in one day…That short prayer radically changed my lifestyle…I felt like a ton of weight lifted off me…I went home an laid in bed and it felt like rivers of joy bubbling through me> I didn’t know whether to laugh ofr cry I was full of such joy…This happened to my coworker friend the same year…Our office co workers wondered what happened to us now tell them about Jesus and how they can be born anew…We were water baptized a year or so later…I had an encounter with the Holy Spirit about a year or so after water baptism that set my faith on fire to this day…He is faithful to complete the work he started in me…Man I could write pages of the miraculous experiences and answered prayer…I have been able to share the message of a born anew experience with hundreds over the years…Iv’e seen/met lives messed in drinking\drugs turned miraculously around all in response to the Lord from the gospel message…So yes I think God responds to a heart felt sinners call out to Him…I’ve been to Haiti via short term ministry(my BIL and sister were missionaries there) and seen life’s changed, some out of dark voodoo by the gospel message…I literally wept as as started the generate one day as(the natives come with water buckets on their heads when they here it start) the water filled thier bucket as I thought of the verse as giving a cup of water doing it as unto the Lord…
 
Somewhere someplace you have to respond to God’s tug(the gospe) He knocks we have to open our lives/hearts to Him He don’t force His wy into our lives…In the early seventies(1973) my co worker/druggie buddy and I had a radical conversion to Christ…Mine came from a pretty blonde in the office…It was chick tract with scriptures explaining of sin and what Jesus did to provide salvation to me…They invited me to hear and evangelistic message when that was over I knelt in front of that stage asking God to forgive me and I turned my life to Him…That’s what I call a sinners pray…The Holy Spirit started to work on those verses I heard…He bought me to repentance…Every has to chose to repent and follow Him…Thats how we are born anew…Th NT is full of the message being preached…Peter’s first street meeting added 3,000 to the church in one day…That short prayer radically changed my lifestyle…I felt like a ton of weight lifted off me…I went home an laid in bed and it felt like rivers of joy bubbling through me> I didn’t know whether to laugh ofr cry I was full of such joy…This happened to my coworker friend the same year…Our office co workers wondered what happened to us now tell them about Jesus and how they can be born anew…We were water baptized a year or so later…I had an encounter with the Holy Spirit about a year or so after water baptism that set my faith on fire to this day…He is faithful to complete the work he started in me…Man I could write pages of the miraculous experiences and answered prayer…I have been able to share the message of a born anew experience with hundreds over the years…Iv’e seen/met lives messed in drinking\drugs turned miraculously around all in response to the Lord from the gospel message…So yes I think God responds to a heart felt sinners call out to Him…
So where in the Bible does it say to say a sinner’s prayer?

Or is this a “tradition of man”?
 
When I say the Bible does not contain a sinner’s prayer I am referring to repeating after a person going through ABCs if you don’t mean it. A genuine salvation experience comes in many forms so yes this could be one of them. It is more about the heart and less about the prayer.
 
What is the “sinner’s prayer”? Where may I find it in the Bible?

thanks.
The actual prayer isn’t in the Bible, but is based on scripture. In fact, its content is analogous to the Apostles’ Creed.

It is my understanding that Catholic doctrine links salvation to baptism which leads to the recitation of the Apostles’ Creed. However, Baptists link salvation to a personal decision to affirm their belief in Jesus as their savior which is then closely followed by baptism. Both Catholics and Baptists end up doing very similar things though in admittedly different orders. However, I think the results are the same.

Also, CCC 2558 defines prayer as the personal relationship with the living and true God. Is it that unreasonable for Baptists to strive to initiate that relationship by humbling themselves before God and declaring something very similar to the Apostles’ Creed before following through with baptism?
CCC 2558: “Great is the mystery of the faith!” The Church professes this mystery in the Apostles’ Creed (Part One) and celebrates it in the sacramental liturgy (Part Two), so that the life of the faithful may be conformed to Christ in the Holy Spirit to the glory of God the Father (Part Three). This mystery, then, requires that the faithful believe in it, that they celebrate it, and that they live from it in a vital and personal relationship with the living and true God. This relationship is prayer.
 
So where in the Bible does it say to say a sinner’s prayer?

Or is this a “tradition of man”?
I don’t how else to talk to the Lord but through prayer…How does a sinner tell the Lord they want to repent…You put a name to it…I just know that one short prayer from that young hippie sinner sure got his life changed…I pray out loud I pray silently He hears it all…It it a tradition of man to pray and repent ? We just don’t become His followers just by saying were christians…It takes action…It take response on our part to the Holy Spirit’s calling…The heart needs converted…It takes a response…Heart cries silent or verbal, He hears them He knows if there are repentant…If it didn’t require a repentive response to Him we could just drag people off the streets and water baptise them and call them christians…We would even have to share the gospel message and see if they respond
 
The reason he was bumfoozled is that your understanding of Baptist beliefs was just as wrong as his understanding of Ash Wednesday. While Baptists do believe that someone who is truly repentant and places their faith in Jesus as Lord and Savior cannot lose their salvation, they do not think sin is not a cause for concern. Sin creates a stumbling block in our paths that delays the sanctification process and can make our testimony less effective. But to say that Baptists are unconcerned about sin by believers is not true.

Note: Baptists do not have a set doctrine concerning sin. Each church and believer is autonomous and has the ability to interpret the Bible with the help of the Holy Spirit. I imagine there are some baptists that have decided that sin after conversion is of no concern. However, the vast majority of Baptists would be very concerned by such sin and would probably question whether or not someone was truly repentant if they were not concerned about the sin in their lives.

If you ever want to know what the average evangelical Baptist believes, you should check out the Southern Baptist Convention’s (SBC) website. Though the beliefs of the SBC are going to differ slightly from church to church and from each subdivision of Baptist. There are probably significant differences between mainline and evangelical Baptists. However the majority of Baptists (including me) are evangelical and Southern Baptist.
Read what you wrote and think about it, then re-read what I wrote. Now carry your theory to a logical conclusion. “Sin creates a stumbling block…”, well, OK, but it really makes no difference in the Baptistic theology. Think abut it. OK, a stumbling block, no big deal, you still get the final goal of heaven regardless of how you live and in the absence of repentance.

Let’s take it to a actual conclusion. My wife is a “Baptistic” (her pastor’s word, not mine) Evangelical. I went to church with her one SUnday and the senior pastor announced: “Joe and I went down to the jail to visit Sam last week. (Sam had found his wife and her male friend in a compromising position and proceeded to shoot both of them) While he misses his kids and family very much, he has set up a ministry in the jail trying to reach others.”

My comment to my wife, which was not well recieved, was: “He best be talking to Sam about repentence. Sam has got a huge spiritual issue.” Turns out, nope, he doesn’t, he’s saved. Well good luck to Sam but that’s a bunch of tommy rot, it just doesn’t hold any water for me (or for the historic Christian Church). The Baptist would say Sam stumbled, the Catholic and Orthodox and many Protestants and the Bible would say Sam fell and that goes back to my original comment. If a person dies in a state of unrepented serious sin he’s off to hell.
 
I have some close family members who are Baptist and we attended a Baptist Church on many occasions when I was a child. I have seen very diverse attitudes toward Catholics by the Baptists church members. I know a few who regarded Catholics as “lost”, “pagan” and “non-Christian” and would not associate with Catholics. Other s including pastors who were very accepting of Catholics and regared them as fellow Christians and felt they were only worshiping God differently and did not hold any contempt toward them at all.
 
I was born as a Catholic and raised in a Muslim country, after a while from moving to USA because of security reasons in my original country and threats against Christians, I moved to a place where Baptists are dominated. To be honest with you I am not so religious, but I can say of my self as a secular Catholic where I love everything being taught by my family as a catholic, especially the values of love not to hate. I found that baptists reject everyone who don’t think like them, in fact after one year in this place I find my self alone with no friends, it is really hard for me to absorb that, where I love the values of freedom in this country and who gave me my rights when my original country didn’t because of Muslim fundamentalists. Sorry to say that, but from my experience with the two, I can now compare Baptists fundamentalists to Muslim fundamentalists. Unfortunately I can’t move to another place in the mean time due to my work and study.
Let me supply some names of famous Baptists you might be aware of:

Jimmy Carter
Billy Graham
Charles Colson
Fred Phelps
Bob Jones III
Jerry Farwell
Jesse Jackson

As this list implies, Baptists are really a diverse lot.
 
Let me supply some names of famous Baptists you might be aware of:

Jimmy Carter
Billy Graham
Charles Colson
Fred Phelps
Bob Jones III
Jerry Farwell
Jesse Jackson

As this list implies, Baptists are really a diverse lot.
You forgot Bill Clinton.
:cool:
 
Being in rural central Texas, which is predominantly baptist, I was destined to fall in love with a baptist girl. whom I married, much to the chagrin of her family. Being a cradle Catholic and not having much memory of any catachesis, I am not sure they were entirely distraught by me marring her.

Then my wife made me go to Church. I said I would IF it was a Catholic Church - thinking she would be totally against the idea… she called me out on that one.

Years later… she was confirmed. God bless her.

While we do have our moments with her parents, (infant baptism, refusing to go ANYWHERE near our parish) I have not had a sense of hostility. If anything, what I sense from them is a burning desire to convert me. I have met the few baptist whom get a wee bit fundie (handing out chick tracts and such), mostly they are those from the larger baptist branches around here… Calvary Chapel, Great Hills, Second Baptist…ext…ext…

I am not sure if baptist hate Catholics, although in my experience, I can definitely say; most baptist have a vague knowledge of Christian history, of our Early Church Fathers and they tend to misunderstand Catholic teachings and Traditions in light of these.
personally, i would have gone mail order to find a Catholic bride if this were the case! 😉 im very happy it worked out for you though. Peace and prayers for you. 🙂
 
I’ll be honest, I personally haven’t been to a wide variety of Baptist Churches. However I have frequented both my home church in suburban Houston and my grandparent’s church in rural Texas (historically German part of the Hill Country). Both are evangelical Southern Baptist Churches, and both emphasize the love of Christ and his sacrifice for us and not how Southern Baptist is the only way and everyone else is doing it completely wrong. At the rural Texas church, you are more likely to run into people who aren’t as informed about the Catholic Church. However, their pastor and deacons show nothing but the greatest love and service to people no matter their faith or denomination.
Thanks for your thoughtful response.
 
I heard an Episcopal priest once relate this story:
He was counseling a young lady who wanted to become a Christian. She had been involved in the occult and had a boyfriend who was still heavily involved. When he found out the boyfriend stormed into the church and confronted the pastor.
He only had one question: was she Baptized yet?
The pastor said yes.
The boyfriend never contacted the girl again.
Odd question if Baptism is ‘just a symbol’.
no baptism purchases you with the shed blood of the cross and makes you god’s property obviously the boyfriend was never baptized.👍
 
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